MCR74
Registered User
- Nov 11, 2022
- 3,830
- 4,596
Did McDavid win the Hart last year? Did he win the Conn Smythe? Did he lead his team to the title? Mahomes is in a higher tier than McDavid.
Very.
Did McDavid win the Hart last year? Did he win the Conn Smythe? Did he lead his team to the title? Mahomes is in a higher tier than McDavid.
You can judge guys based on their awards or based on their actual ability. I guess that's where we differ.Did McDavid win the Hart last year? Did he win the Conn Smythe? Did he lead his team to the title? Mahomes is in a higher tier than McDavid.
You can judge guys based on their awards or based on their actual ability. I guess that's where we differ.
And to answer the bolded - he did, in fact.
And yet the greatest of the greats lead their clubs to championships. Those that don’t, get ranked a tier lower. And talking to the greats that never won, they’d agree. The greatest are defined by championships.Furthering the point that no single player can win a championship by themselves on a roster of 18 other players on their own team. I’ve always found the idea ridiculous that the only measure of a player for many is how many championship teams they played on.
Football has 22 “starters” per team.
Hockey has 19 per team.
Baseball has 9.
Basketball has 5.
Tennis and golf have 1.
Which sports are most likely to have the highest variance between individual player dominance and team championships? An individually dominant player can make it more likely their team wins a championship, but hardly guarantees it in a league of 30+ teams.
Yeah you might want to run that one by oilers fans I think you’d be surprised lol…..And yet the greatest of the greats lead their clubs to championships. Those that don’t, get ranked a tier lower. And talking to the greats that never won, they’d agree. The greatest are defined by championships.
Messier and six Cups or McDavid and lots of points? Oilers were (are) charmed to have both, but one was a winner. The other, not yet. So Messier is in that higher tier of the greats.
And yet the greatest of the greats lead their clubs to championships. Those that don’t, get ranked a tier lower. And talking to the greats that never won, they’d agree. The greatest are defined by championships.
Messier and six Cups or McDavid and lots of points? Oilers were (are) charmed to have both, but one was a winner. The other, not yet. So Messier is in that higher tier of the greats.
And yet the greatest of the greats lead their clubs to championships. Those that don’t, get ranked a tier lower. And talking to the greats that never won, they’d agree. The greatest are defined by championships.
Messier and six Cups or McDavid and lots of points? Oilers were (are) charmed to have both, but one was a winner. The other, not yet. So Messier is in that higher tier of the greats.
Gretzky was key to winning four, so it’s a moot point.This is exactly why I contest this idea. Messier had Hall-of-Famers Gretzky, Anderson, Coffey, Kurri, Fuhr, and Lowe off the top of my head on those Oilers teams. That’s an HoF player at every position on the same team.
As a Rangers fan, I also believe he is vastly over-attributed to them winning in 94. He had Gartner, Zubov, and Leetch as HoF in addition to his EDM buddies in Anderson, Tikkanen, Beukeboom, McTavish, Lowe, and I think I’m missing at least one more.
The goal is to win championships, but would anyone dare suggest Gretzky was not the best ever if he never won a Cup?
has any done what McDavid has done before? Yes, Gretzky, Lemieux and arguably a few more
Has anybody done what Mahomes has done before? Yes, Brady, Montana, Elway and arguably a few more
Has anybody done what Ohtani has done before? Nobody, none zilch….
Gretzky was key to winning four, so it’s a moot point.
The greatest of the greats lead their clubs to championships. That’s what separates them from the very good.
Winning Super Bowls is insignificant? Are you being serious with this?
Since 2018 (Mahomes’s first season, not counting one game in 2017):
1st in total passing yards, 9% higher than 2nd (Goff)
1st in passing yards per game, 5% more than 2nd (Brady)
1st in passing TD, 21% higher than 2nd (Wilson)
1st in QBR
1st in TD%
3rd in INT%
I’m sure there are others, but by nearly all measures of QB success he is in 1st with more than a slight separation in total yards, yards per game, and passing TDs. The only exception is INT%, where his 1.7% is beaten by Tom
Brady (1.6%), and Aaron Rodgers (1.0) during that span. 2nd place is also different for each category, showing how hard it is to be 1st place in more than one of these, yet Mahomes is in 1st in 5 of 6.
Where in the world did I say that was insignificant? What an incredible straw man argument/comment
Actual good reply, thanks!