Prospect Info: Who does LA pick #2? Part 2 To Byfield or to Stutzle? That is the question

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How about him being a top 3 pick ?

The fact he is more skilled than Byfield. That defense in junior hockey is worse than in professional hockey. Its not outlandish.

I currently read too much anti Stützle comments. The comment I responded to, is stuff I just can not agree with, nobody should.

Everything looks so much more flashy in junior hockey.

Considering Byfield put up 32 goals in 45 games with a fantastic shot and an absurd 27% shooting percentage, I highly doubt Tim Stutzle puts up 35 goals. I could see Stutzle putting up 20 goals, 50 assists which is still very impressive. Stutzle scored almost all his goals last season either skating in circles out and then back in to the zone on the power play, or by parking himself in front of the net. The former doesn't work on smaller ice surfaces. If he reaches his potential, I think Stutzle is going to put up around 15-20 goals a season in the NHL and put up like 60 assists.

I am curious, can anyone think of a good example of a player who had a poor shot in his draft year and then really improved it? Quinn Hughes comes to mind for me.
 
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Just because people are remarking on Stutzle's shot doesn't mean they think he's a bad player. It seems like you're instead going the opposite direction and think Stutzle could easily put up the same number of goals Byfield could even though Stutzle's shot is arguably "weaker." So are you saying Stutzle is better in every facet of the game compared to Byfield?

And while you say everything looks much more flashy in junior hockey, don't forget Europe has a lot more open ice to allow Stutzle to buy time for himself.
It is not “just” Stützle’s shot. Why would I think those people think he is a bad player ? How did you come to that conclusion?

Yes I think Stützle’s stickhandling, hands, skating east-west is way better.

IQ too but that is harder to determine.


Considering Byfield put up 32 goals in 45 games with a fantastic shot and an absurd 27% shooting percentage, I highly doubt Tim Stutzle puts up 35 goals. I could see Stutzle putting up 20 goals, 50 assists which is still very impressive.
I think that is not impressive and this is what I mean......or that Byfield would have lit up the DEL.

This is the stuff I am currently reading...
 
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You can't prove this yet. No one thought anyone would touch McDavid and yet Draisaitl and MacK have played as well if not better despite not being considered gereational.

I'd gladly take a non-generational MacK or Draisaitl.
I'm actually not trying to prove anything.

I've seen numerous posts comparing Byfield to Malkin and talk of 100 point potential. I haven't seen any scouting publications project Byfield or Stützle to that level. It is possible they could develop into it tho.

I'm simply suggesting that some of our fanbase pump the brakes a little on the hype train. But hey, I am also excited about our prospect pool and the players we will be adding at the draft <insert thumbs up :)>
 
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Considering Byfield put up 32 goals in 45 games with a fantastic shot and an absurd 27% shooting percentage, I highly doubt Tim Stutzle puts up 35 goals. I could see Stutzle putting up 20 goals, 50 assists which is still very impressive. Stutzle scored almost all his goals last season either skating in circles out and then back in to the zone on the power play, or by parking himself in front of the net. The former doesn't work on smaller ice surfaces. If he reaches his potential, I think Stutzle is going to put up around 15-20 goals a season in the NHL and put up like 60 assists.

I am curious, can anyone think of a good example of a player who had a poor shot in his draft year and then really improved it? Quinn Hughes comes to mind for me.

And Quinn can get away with it because he's a d-man, does a great job just getting the shot through now. But his bro still has a muffin and look how much it held him back this year.
 
How about him being a top 3 pick ?

The fact he is more skilled than Byfield. That defense in junior hockey is worse than in professional hockey. Its not outlandish.

I currently read too much anti Stützle comments. The comment I responded to, is stuff I just can not agree with, nobody should.

Everything looks so much more flashy in junior hockey.
The goaltending in DEL is awful.
 
I'm actually not trying to prove anything.

I've seen numerous posts comparing Byfield to Malkin and talk of 100 point potential. I haven't seen any scouting publications project Byfield or Stützle to that level. It is possible they could develop into it tho.

I'm simply suggesting that some of our fanbase pump the brakes a little on the hype train. But hey, I am also excited about our prospect pool and the players we will be adding at the draft <insert thumbs up :)>
A better skating faster version of Eric Staal will do just fine.
 
I'm actually not trying to prove anything.

I've seen numerous posts comparing Byfield to Malkin and talk of 100 point potential. I haven't seen any scouting publications project Byfield or Stützle to that level. It is possible they could develop into it tho.

I'm simply suggesting that some of our fanbase pump the brakes a little on the hype train. But hey, I am also excited about our prospect pool and the players we will be adding at the draft <insert thumbs up :)>

Don't harsh my buzz man. As Kings fans we need something to dream about.
 
The unfortunate thing, and their is no fixing this, their are no comps for high level prospects out of the DEL. They exist for virtually every big European league, KHL, SHL, Liiga, CZE etc.

This would be much easier if Leon Draisaitl hadn't come over, not comparing the two, but we would have some measure of a top-level NHL prospect in that league.
 
The unfortunate thing, and their is no fixing this, their are no comps for high level prospects out of the DEL. They exist for virtually every big European league, KHL, SHL, Liiga, CZE etc.

This would be much easier if Leon Draisaitl hadn't come over, not comparing the two, but we would have some measure of a top-level NHL prospect in that league.
It’s not a good comparison but in German u-16 in the last season each had...

Draisaitl - GP 29 G 97 A 95 PTS 192 (2010-11)
Stützle - GP 32 G 37 A 46 PTS 83 (2016-17)

It’s the best like for like available so there may be some changes in the league standard etc. So make of it what you will...
 
It’s not a good comparison but in German u-16 in the last season each had...

Draisaitl - GP 29 G 97 A 95 PTS 192 (2010-11)
Stützle - GP 32 G 37 A 46 PTS 83 (2016-17)

It’s the best like for like available so there may be some changes in the league standard etc. So make of it what you will...

Is that a typo? That's like beer league numbers for Draisaitl. Probably too many years apart to make it anywhere near a valid comparison, but that's insane.
 
I think you are exaggerating his performance against USA, Russia, and Canada a bit. And also downplaying the quality of talent Stutzle got to play with on Germany. Stutzle was regularly on the ice with Peterka, Bokk, Seider, and Reichel. So while the rest of the German team was not talented the top end of that team was legit.

Stutzle played 58 total minutes against those top three teams and had 2 assists. I'm not knocking the kid for two assists, it's still solid for his age. But it's not like he was just saddled with trash linemates and lit those three good teams up.

Hi I see your reasoning and I need to clarify things just a little bit. Yes Seider, Bokk, JJP, and Reichel are incredibly talented players. I hope its okay if I respectfully disagree with you though.

Now I will dive into why. First and foremost JJP and Reichel are now considered 1st-2nd round talent. Before the WJC though, it was questionable if they would be drafted in the 3rd round let alone 1st. Many scouts, similar to people on this board and many hockey fans in general, have no idea how to gage the competition level of the DEL. In truth, there has never been a prospect pool like this to come out of the DEL in hockey history. So NHL scouts were unable to really project where they would go until they saw them at the WJC against competition they know how to gage.

Now look a Seider and his draft class. The central draft board listed him in the late 1st round. Yet Yzerman stunning a large amount of fans and scouts alike(including myself) took him at 6th. Yzerman selecting him at 6 was and is incredibly bold as if you go that far off centrals draft board and are wrong it could seriously be a GM career killer. If you are right people will praise the GMs genius. What caused the disperarity between the red wings board and the NHLs? It can only be linked to his scouting team holding the DEL in a regard that most of the NHL and hockey world as a whole does not. Most scouts go with players from leagues they know how to gage performance in. As of now, could change I suppose, it's looking like Yzerman is getting the genius nod.

Moving forward, yes Stützle actually deserves an insane amount of credit for his performance against Canada, The US, and Russia. To begin Canada has 6 players picked or that will be picked in the top 10 and 13 first round players in total. Their lowest skater was selected in the 4th round. US and Russia rosters were slightly less stacked , but only slightly as every player on the US was or would be drafted and 2 or 3 on russia may not. Compare that to Germany with 2 first round picks Bokk(late) Seider(early even though he was projected late), JJP(pre WJC who knows, post WJC before 3rd as a high as mid-late first), Reichel(pre WJC 3rdish round, post WJC mid 2nd latest, mid 1st earliest) 5 draft picks total on a team of 20 is kind far fetched compared to a team of over half 1st round picks. Add on top that Germany drew the hardest division. Of the 6 hockey power countries Germany had to play 4 of them.

Stützles stat line is not what should be looked at and it is wildly misleading(as is Byfield's for the WJC). What should be paid attention to is his play as a whole. Everytime he is on the ice watch him, not the game, him. How does he handle playing the top talent? Is the skill there, but no difference making? Is he a game changer or was he invisible against top talent? Every time he makes a good decision give him a plus every time he makes a poor decision give him a minus. Very few minuses if you watch his games. Kid makes the right decisions. His hockey IQ , hands, and speed pop. His play without the puck needs some work, but most kids in the draft do. Overall and most importantly he stood out against the best of the best(in his age group). Watching his games it was obvious he is a difference maker. I fully believe his greatest strength is that he can quarterback or run an NHL powerplay the instant he is drafted.

Byfield also looked great at WJC despite the low stats his play off the puck in the offensive zone is spectacular. The kid is always where he should be. His play in the D zone was less impressive. He does make the wrong read a good amount. Talent is there. His offensive positioning was most impressive to me though. Shot was good, shot selection typically great because of positioning, but he does force bad angel low percentage shots.

I'm sorry I called him ST I'm really not sure why I did just a mental error, it happens. Both great players still. And I'm pretty sure no matter what is said everyone is still gonna have a personal preference because there is no right answer. Years from now there may be, but well until then it is all just speculation.

Also if you guys really want to see how the CHL translates to the DEL Taro Jentzsch was a near ppg player in the QMJHL and he is on a DEL roster now. So if he shreds you have your answer. If he doesn't, well it looks like you still have your answer
 
Kind of reverse engineering this by comparing Stützle to his peers (the vast majority of whom are older) that he played with in the DNL in 18-19 or on the national team, and see if they have made the jump to the DEL and how they faired, keeping in mind these are not top prospects.

Here's just a few:
For reference, Stützle had 55 points (23 goals) in 21 games in the DNL U20, starting the season as a 16 year old.

Jan-Luca Schumacher, Stützle's teammate at Mannheim U20 had 16-45-61 in 34 games, about 5 months older than Tim, hasn't played in the DEL.
Jan Nijenhuis, had 16-27-43 in 29 games, also about 5 months older, made the jump to DEL and had 1 Assist in 34 games.
Timo Bakos, had 28-31-59 in 35 games in the DNL U20, he's about 1 1/2 years older than Tim, played last year in the USHL, had 7-8-15 in 41 games.

The conclusion to be drawn is that most players don't make the jump to the DEL straight from U20, and those that do have very limited success.
 
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Probably been posted already and it's just highlights not shift to shift but you can see a lot of it in there--the breathtaking skating, the PP quarterbacking, deceptiveness/shiftiness of feet and hands, the absolutely sublime playmaking--and the borderline terrible shot. Count the crest snipes and outright misses from royal road.

Hardly any of his shots were even getting through d-men. Hell even on a 5-on-3 he was hitting people with it.

I love this kid but let's call a spade a spade, that's a major flaw. One that's workable to be sure, but there's a reason there's a debate. I worry he will struggle to break 20 goals in the NHL. Maybe it doesn't matter if for example you believe he'll feed Kaliyev 50 or something. Hell he played 54 games in 2019-2020 including DEL and junior tournaments and didn't break 10.
 
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Or a better skating, shoot first, less elite defending version of Kopitar would be great. Still a true #1 center.

Most of us hope that whoever gets picked at #2 is a first line, top player on the team or top 2 if Doughty is motivated in 2 or 3 seasons.

That's really the ultimate point to be made. This pick has to be a top front line player. He can't be some complementary guy. This is your future star. Those aren't unrealistic expectations for a #2 overall pick in any year. This is a unique year in that you really have 3 forwards who are in their own class at the top. Maybe 4 if you include Raymond there.

I know that is has been used before in drafts but I really feel that you are going to get a star in Lafreniere, Byfield or Stutzle. They may be different types of stars but they will all fulfill that requirement for the teams who draft them and let them develop. You can't rush a kid who isn't ready no matter who it is. In a way, Byfield and Stutzle have more room to grow than Lafreniere who will be expected to by a God by day one when you consider New York, the fan base and expectations that come with being #1. I hope that kid is ready for the microscope over there.
 
wondering if that abomination of a tape job on Stützle’s stick has anything to do with his rinky dink shot

he is pretty amazing at everything else, though
 
wondering if that abomination of a tape job on Stützle’s stick has anything to do with his rinky dink shot

he is pretty amazing at everything else, though
I seem to remember the same tape job observation about a Luc somebody or other and that worked out well enough for the Kings. Might have been "hands of cement" himself making the comment back in the day.
 
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I seem to remember the same tape job observation about a Luc somebody or other and that worked out well enough for the Kings. Might have been "hands of cement" himself making the comment back in the day.

I don't recall Luc's sticks looking like THIS

*TRIGGER WARNING*



EdJf71UWsAgn-Zv
 
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