When does the Yzerplan start getting criticized?

[KirkAlbuquerque]

They still have no goalie, a subpar d corps , some pretty decent forward depth but no truly elite players.

 

[Hockeyfan2390]

How long it was supposed to take?

2019-20 tank year
2020-21 tank year
2021-22 tank year
2022-23 1st attempt to reach playoffs, failed
2023-24 2nd attempt to reach playoffs, leaning towards failure

I suggest you circle back to the 1st press conference in 2019, Yzerman said six times that "this is going to take time". And to this take from the the 1st interview.

"This is going to take time". Sure. And Five years is more than enough time to have your team back in the playoffs. That should be the absolute lowest of expectations by the end of Year 5.

 

[GMR]

When Yzerman took over, their top two prospects were Zadina and Veleno. Literally.

Think about that.

Holland left him less than nothing.

 

[Hockeyfan2390]

Do you guys not remember what Steve started with? Dylan Larkin and literally nothing else. What GM could possibly do any better? I still trust Steve.

Almost any other GM in hockey would have the Red Wings arguably right where they are right now after 5 years.

That's not why Yzerman was brought back to Detroit. He was brought back to be special like he was in Tampa Bay, not an average GM.

The amount of people on here making excuses for him is staggering, frankly.

"Oh but look at what he inherited!"

Okay, and?

 

[Goon42]

Almost any other GM in hockey would have the Red Wings arguably right where they are right now after 5 years.

That's not why Yzerman was brought back to Detroit. He was brought back to be special like he was in Tampa Bay, not an average GM.

The amount of people on here making excuses for him is staggering, frankly.

"Oh but look at what he inherited!"

Okay, and?

Okay, and?

it took steve 10 years to build something special in tampa

 

[Grifter3511]

"This is going to take time". Sure. And Five years is more than enough time to have your team back in the playoffs. That should be the absolute lowest of expectations by the end of Year 5.

Because development is perfectly linear and Detroit had a plethora of talented vets for the new kids to lean on and learn from?

 

[Hockeyfan2390]

Okay, and?

it took steve 10 years to build something special in tampa

He wasn't even in Tampa for 10 years.

In his first season on the job, they came within a game of the Cup Final. And then when Guy Boucher started falling short of expectations, he whacked him and hired Jon Cooper.

Brayden Point was drafted in 2014, he was on the Lightning roster in 2016. He drafted Kucherov in 2011, he was on the Lightning roster in 2013. Anthony Cirelli was drafted in 2015, he was on the Lightning roster by 2018. He drafted Ondrej Palat in 2011, he was on the Lightning roster by 2013. He drafted Andrei Vasilevskiy in 2012, he was on the Lightning roster by 2015. He turned Drouin into Sergachev and found Tyler Johnson.

All of those moves and more that I'm sure I didn't list elevated Yzerman to elite GM status. That's what Red Wings fans were envisioning when he came back in 2019, not this ultra-low and slow snails-pace rebuild that is on the verge of failing to yield a playoff appearance by the end of Year 5.

Only two players that Yzerman has drafted in Detroit (in 5 drafts) are regular NHL players. That's not good enough. Derek Lalonde is a milquetoast coach with all the intensity of a wet carrot who fails to get the most out of his players and routinely attempts to lower expectations. That's not good enough.

We as fans are allowed to expect more from someone who was viewed as hockey's best GM and a human cheat code, and there's nothing wrong with saying that his "Yzerplan" is far off course from what we thought it would be at this point.

Because development is perfectly linear and Detroit had a plethora of talented vets for the new kids to lean on and learn from?

The "talented vets" that the Red Wings do have now and who were specifically brought here to help the team avoid a monumental collapse and weather the storm if a key player like Larkin was hurt failed spectacularly.

 

[The don godfather]

Yzerplan has failed.

 

[Goon42]

He wasn't even in Tampa for 10 years.

In his first season on the job, they came within a game of the Cup Final. And then when Guy Boucher started falling short of expectations, he whacked him and hired Jon Cooper.

Brayden Point was drafted in 2014, he was on the Lightning roster in 2016. He drafted Kucherov in 2011, he was on the Lightning roster in 2013. Anthony Cirelli was drafted in 2015, he was on the Lightning roster by 2018. He drafted Ondrej Palat in 2011, he was on the Lightning roster by 2013. He drafted Andrei Vasilevskiy in 2012, he was on the Lightning roster by 2015. He turned Drouin into Sergachev and found Tyler Johnson.

All of those moves and more that I'm sure I didn't list elevated Yzerman to elite GM status. That's what Red Wings fans were envisioning when he came back in 2019, not this ultra-low and slow snails-pace rebuild that is on the verge of failing to yield a playoff appearance by the end of Year 5.

Only two players that Yzerman has drafted in Detroit (in 5 drafts) are regular NHL players. That's not good enough. Derek Lalonde is a milquetoast coach with all the intensity of a wet carrot who fails to get the most out of his players and routinely attempts to lower expectations. That's not good enough.

We as fans are allowed to expect more from someone who was viewed as hockey's best GM and a human cheat code, and there's nothing wrong with saying that his "Yzerplan" is far off course from what we thought it would be at this point.



The "talented vets" that the Red Wings do have now and who were specifically brought here to help the team avoid a monumental collapse and weather the storm if a key player like Larkin was hurt failed spectacularly.

its like talking to a brick wall

Yzerman started in tampa in 2010 left in 2019. They won a cup in 2020. But whatever enjoy your yappin

 

[Ezekial]

They still have no goalie, a subpar d corps , some pretty decent forward depth but no truly elite players.

Good thing he's used a lot of quality draft capital (2 firsts on D men, and a 1st and 2nd on goalies since 2021) and are trending in positive directions so far.

Hopefully with a 3 headed monster d-corps (Seider, Edvinsson, ASP) and 1 of Cossa and Augustine turning into a reliable NHLer, added to a hard forward group to play against defensively we can become a contending team.

 

[raymond23]

They still have no goalie, a subpar d corps , some pretty decent forward depth but no truly elite players.

The good news is they have arguably the best prospect pool in the league in both the goalie and defense category, all without a lottery pick

We’re getting antsy tho… need to see the talent in Detroit

 

[Grifter3511]

The "talented vets" that the Red Wings do have now and who were specifically brought here to help the team avoid a monumental collapse and weather the storm if a key player like Larkin was hurt failed spespectacularly.

Hmm...Wings around wild card spot. Larkin gets injured. Larkin comes back. Wings around wild card spot. Looks like the monumental collapse was avoided. But I wouldn't call those players brought in talented vets...more like depth vets

 

[ViewsFromThe6ix]

Do you guys not remember what Steve started with? Dylan Larkin and literally nothing else. What GM could possibly do any better? I still trust Steve.

Who forced Yzerman to waste $23MM AAV on Vrana (buyout), Holl, Chiarot, Copp, Husso, and Petry?

That's $23MM that you're getting virtually no value from. 25% of the cap for nothing.

When Yzerman took over, their top two prospects were Zadina and Veleno. Literally.

Think about that.

Holland left him less than nothing.

They're literally wasting $23MM in cap space on replacement or below replacement level players. Yzerman hasn't helped himself either.

 

[ShelbyZ]

He wasn't even in Tampa for 10 years.

In his first season on the job, they came within a game of the Cup Final. And then when Guy Boucher started falling short of expectations, he whacked him and hired Jon Cooper.

Brayden Point was drafted in 2014, he was on the Lightning roster in 2016. He drafted Kucherov in 2011, he was on the Lightning roster in 2013. Anthony Cirelli was drafted in 2015, he was on the Lightning roster by 2018. He drafted Ondrej Palat in 2011, he was on the Lightning roster by 2013. He drafted Andrei Vasilevskiy in 2012, he was on the Lightning roster by 2015. He turned Drouin into Sergachev and found Tyler Johnson.

Begs the question whether that was Yzerman or if it had more to do with Al Murray.

But there was also no way that Yzerman was ever going to be able to emulate what he did in Tampa in Detroit.... When he got to Florida, the Lightning already had Stamkos and Hedman to build around, and guys like St. Louis and Lecavalier were still around playing at a high to elite level.

I've often found Yzerman's tenure in Tampa to be a bit overrated. Don't get me wrong, he helped build a juggernaut. But under his tenure the team couldn't get over the hump similar to the Wings in the early to mid-90's,

While his Lightning teams were talented, had great goaltending and pretty lethal offensively, they were often too soft for the playoffs. His Red Wings teams have so far been noticeably soft as well.

Yzerman stepped down right before the 18-19 season, and aside from Brisebois swapping Koekkoek for Rutta, that team ended up getting embarrassed in the first round against Columbus... Brisebois then went out and added the type of grit/sandpaper/etc. the team was missing (Maroon/Goodrow/Coleman/etc.) and they finally got over the hump and won 2 Cups.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Who forced Yzerman to waste $23MM AAV on Vrana (buyout), Holl, Chiarot, Copp, Husso, and Petry?

That's $23MM that you're getting virtually no value from. 25% of the cap for nothing.



They're literally wasting $23MM in cap space on replacement or below replacement level players. Yzerman hasn't helped himself either.

Cap space is not their problem.

I applaud Yzerman for actually trying to sign players and take the next step instead of just tanking year after year.

I just think a lot of Detroit’s core and prospects and whatnot are overrated by their fans.

 

[ViewsFromThe6ix]

Cap space is not their problem.

I applaud Yzerman for actually trying to sign players and take the next step instead of just tanking year after year.

I just think a lot of Detroit’s core and prospects and whatnot are overrated by their fans.

Cap space is a massive part of their problem. They should weaponize it to acquire bad contracts for draft picks, and flip those for young players like Montreal.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Cap space is a massive part of their problem. They should weaponize it to acquire bad contracts for draft picks, and flip those for young players like Montreal.

Cap space has zero impact on their failures this season.

Cap space is overrated as is “weaponizing” it.

 

[Voight]

He didn't have a lot to start with, but I dont think signing Copp, Compher and Chiarot to those contracts was a great idea.

 

[Divine]

Trading Hronek and signing Holl seems to be a pretty big miss

 

[GMR]

Who forced Yzerman to waste $23MM AAV on Vrana (buyout), Holl, Chiarot, Copp, Husso, and Petry?

That's $23MM that you're getting virtually no value from. 25% of the cap for nothing.



They're literally wasting $23MM in cap space on replacement or below replacement level players. Yzerman hasn't helped himself either.

I’m sure he regrets most, if not all of those signings. I said earlier in this thread that next year is the make or break year for me for playoff qualifying. If they miss again, his blame should increase significantly. He shouldn’t have immunity even if he is Steve Yzerman.

 

[OurlordAndSaviorKuch]

Yzer didn’t have Stammer and Heddy to build around when he got to Detroit. Not to mention it wasn’t just Yzer that built what we have here. JBB and our scouting department deserves a lot of credit as well.

I don’t think you could ever expect the same results in Detroit that we have had here at least not in the same timeline.

 

[PettersonHughes]

Yzer didn’t have Stammer and Heddy to build around when he got to Detroit. Not to mention it wasn’t just Yzer that built what we have here. JBB and our scouting department deserves a lot of credit as well.

I don’t think you could ever expect the same results in Detroit that we have had here at least not in the same timeline.

Not to mention that Vasi had taken over your crease since 2016 shortly after Hedman came up. The current Wings may have star forwards (Larkin/ DeBrincat/ Raymond/ Compher as #2 C) and strong D candidates, but are still waiting for that #1 goalie (Lyon's 18-16 but all their goalies have GAA above 3). From an outsider perspective the Wings did add lots of quality but it would suck if they got stuck in mediocrity, e.g. like the Sabres.

 

[Ezekial]

Trading Hronek and signing Holl seems to be a pretty big miss

This comparison seems like a pretty big miss as well.

 

[norrisnick]

Cap space has zero impact on their failures this season.

Cap space is overrated as is “weaponizing” it.

And neither as much as those young players acquired via the "weaponizing"...

Not to mention that Vasi had taken over your crease since 2016 shortly after Hedman came up. The current Wings may have star forwards (Larkin/ DeBrincat/ Raymond/ Compher as #2 C) and strong D candidates, but are still waiting for that #1 goalie (Lyon's 18-16 but all their goalies have GAA above 3). From an outsider perspective the Wings did add lots of quality but it would suck if they got stuck in mediocrity, e.g. like the Sabres.

Handy that the Wings have two top 10 goalie prospect atm.

 

[Schennanigans]

They don’t have any talent or any upcoming that resembles any of the great players they had when they were elite.