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What to do with Morgan Rielly - TSN: Cut from squad.

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You can't send him down if he's a major contributor in the first 5 games. If he gets the minutes and clearly shows he belongs, it doesn't make much sense to send him down.

People talk about not rushing him, but if he shows he's ready, it's not rushing at that point. Rushing him means that you are putting him in the lineup when he's clearly not ready.

If he shows signs of slowing down and his minutes have to be slashed or whatever, then you send him down.

The only way you keep him is if he can play the minutes he should have to keep developing.
 
Leaf Army said:
Actually after looking up a bunch of players (outside of the elite top two pick kind of guys) I can't find many 18 year olds who progressed naturally in the NHL and got better year after year.

Most of them have their best years right off the bat and then regress.
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you think the reason for that is because they started in the nhl at 18? could be the case, but there are other factors as well.

i'm saying when he's 23, 24, 25 and beyond, it won't make one little bit of difference where he played when he was 18. he'll be the same player regardless.
 
5 games and send him back, no matter what.


Cap is going down, ELCs are becoming even more valuable. Don't burn a year of his ELC in a lockout shortened season.
 
SprDaVE said:
You can't send him down if he's a major contributor in the first 5 games. If he gets the minutes and clearly shows he belongs, it doesn't make much sense to send him down.

People talk about not rushing him, but if he shows he's ready, it's not rushing at that point. Rushing him means that you are putting him in the lineup when he's clearly not ready.

If he shows signs of slowing down and his minutes have to be slashed or whatever, then you send him down.

The only way you keep him is if he can play the minutes he should have to keep developing.
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Young players are notoriously streaky. 5 games is a pretty small sample size. Also I'm sure there's some aspect of his game (likely on the defensive end) that the coaching staff will want him to improve going into next season. I just personally think it will be easier for him to make those adjustments at the Junior level as opposed to against full time NHLers.

I also want him to get a shot at some playoffs action. I'm assuming MJ would trade him to a contender. It can help with building him as a leader.

+ I don't see the point in wasting a year on his ELC for a shortened season that we have no hope of doing well in.
 
I trust that Carlyle is a very good evaluator of NHL readiness, much better than any of us I would think. If he is, in this shortened lead-up to the season with no pre-season games, being put in positions and played with others in a way that tells us he is going to stick with the big club for now - he MUST look pretty ready for it!

I haven't gotten even the slightest hint of a comment from any player, coach or evaluator of any of the usual "growing pains" of a young player . . . and not even one comment about his size, etc. So if a relatively smaller skilled player goes through camp with no comments about what he needs to work on, what does it tell me?

He is NHL ready.

Play the kid, reevaluate after 5 games, and in all probability, he sticks.
 
Frankie said:
you think the reason for that is because they started in the nhl at 18? could be the case, but there are other factors as well.

i'm saying when he's 23, 24, 25 and beyond, it won't make one little bit of difference where he played when he was 18. he'll be the same player regardless.
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Sometimes yes. But not always.

There's a big difference between a 23 year old who is now a five year NHL veteran making huge money compared to a 23 year old second or third year player just coming off an entry level contract.

Money, expectations and pressure all affect young players. It's impossible for it not too. I just think 18 year old players get a lot of that too fast.

I think there's a clear trend that 18 year olds peak early and then have trouble adjusting to the money, pressure and added expectations that come with their second contract when they're still only 21 or 22 years old.
 
Leaf Army said:
Sometimes yes. But not always.

There's a big difference between a 23 year old who is now a five year NHL veteran making huge money compared to a 23 year old second or third year player just coming off an entry level contract.

Money, expectations and pressure all affect young players. It's impossible for it not too. I just think 18 year old players get a lot of that too fast.

I think there's a clear trend that 18 year olds peak early and then have trouble adjusting to the money, pressure and added expectations that come with their second contract when they're still only 21 or 22 years old.
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First of all you have no idea of his upbringing so to assume that money and other influences would affect his game is a huge stretch. I know him and he is a very focused and mature individual. Morgan has always had huge expectations placed on him at every level. At major bantam in his WHL draft year, his first year in midget AAA, his first year of jr etc, in every test he has shown that no only could he handle the pressure and expectations but that he raised his game to suit the level of play. This is a very special player who sees the ice better than his peers. The trade deadline in the WHL is
 
Leaf Army said:
Sometimes yes. But not always.

There's a big difference between a 23 year old who is now a five year NHL veteran making huge money compared to a 23 year old second or third year player just coming off an entry level contract.

Money, expectations and pressure all affect young players. It's impossible for it not too. I just think 18 year old players get a lot of that too fast.

I think there's a clear trend that 18 year olds peak early and then have trouble adjusting to the money, pressure and added expectations that come with their second contract when they're still only 21 or 22 years old.
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First of all you have no idea of his upbringing so to assume that money and other influences would affect his game is a huge stretch. I know him and he is a very focused and mature individual. Morgan has always had huge expectations placed on him at every level. At major bantam in his WHL draft year, his first year in midget AAA, his first year of jr etc, in every test he has shown that no only could he handle the pressure and expectations but that he raised his game to suit the level of play. This is a very special player who sees the ice better than his peers. The trade deadline in the WHL has past and there will be no playoffs for Morgan. The question then remains is he better then the other players in camp? If so he stays!
 
I see very little value in letting him go to MJ to lose for the last 20 games. If this were an ordinary camp, in Sep, it makes sense to send him down. Let him play and dominate for a full season. But we have a great D coach in Carlyle and he might as well take the 6th spot and get some quality PP time with NHL players.

On the 2nd PP he may line up with:

Kulemin - Grabs - Kadri
Liles - Rielly

That looks great to me. MJ is 45 games into a 66(?) game schedule. Whats the point in sending him back to a last place team?
 
33 games in the Dub + 8 in the WJC + potentially 48 Regular season Leafs games + Potentially some AHL playoff games = 89+ games. That amount of games could wear a kid out, especially after only playing 23 last year. It also increases the risk of injury, especially with the condensed schedule of the NHL. Send him back to Moose Jaw.
 
IF he is good enough he is old enough. At least give him 5 games then re-valuate him, that is fair for all involved. Personally I think that playing in juniors for the entire season benefit him the most long term, even more so seeing as he missed a large part previously because of injury.
 
Terrence said:
33 games in the Dub + 8 in the WJC + potentially 48 Regular season Leafs games + Potentially some AHL playoff games = 89+ games. That amount of games could wear a kid out, especially after only playing 23 last year. It also increases the risk of injury, especially with the condensed schedule of the NHL. Send him back to Moose Jaw.
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I'd rather see him ride the pines once every 5 or 6 games here then go back to a train wreck team in junior. I don't see what he has to gain going there.
 
Is there a chance he could be traded in the WHL and maybe have a shot at the Memorial Cup?
 
The Naz said:
I'd rather see him ride the pines once every 5 or 6 games here then go back to a train wreck team in junior. I don't see what he has to gain going there.
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Your're right in the sense that he is pretty much done with Junior hockey. However, there's no harm done in sending him back.

And what's the reward of him being here? We probably aren't making the playoffs regardless of whether he's in the lineup or not. So what's the point of risking wearing him out, or potentially getting injured. The risk is not worth the potential reward, imo.
 
It isn't his offense.

Here is the issue.Is he ready defensively? Can To. afford a slow start? If management's goal is the playoffs,they will play the 6 best defensive dmen. Myself,I send him down for more development.With Phaneuff,Liles,Gardiner we have offense from the backend.
 
I'd give him 5 games limited ice. Let him know what he's up against when (not if) he makes the jump. Rielly will learn tons just by sitting on the bench, in the dressing room, and watching the game closeup.
Then IMO send him down after a very lengthy chat on how to further his game, what his strengths and weaknesses are. Let him know that if he keeps on track, the NHL is there for his taking. Boost him up.
 
Burning a year of his ELC for a 48 game schedule makes the decision more complicated then normal.

You'd have to believe that in order to go down this road management has to believe he will not only play but be able to contribute regularly to a team that hopes to challenge for a playoff spot.
 
Terrence said:
Your're right in the sense that he is pretty much done with Junior hockey. However, there's no harm done in sending him back.

And what's the reward of him being here? We probably aren't making the playoffs regardless of whether he's in the lineup or not. So what's the point of risking wearing him out, or potentially getting injured. The risk is not worth the potential reward, imo.
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He will play 25+ mins a night for MJ. He will play 8-12 mins a night for TOR. In a sheltered role, with likely, Komisarek or Franson. Franson may not be too aggressive but he is 6'5" and strong enough to defend himself and others. He has less chance of injury if he isn't on the ice as much. If he isn't the focus of goons and is off the ice for the strongest opposition.

The only benefit I see in him being in MJ is that when the season is done, he goes right to the Marlies without burning a year. He can be coached by another great coach in Eakins and play some sheltered minutes in the playoffs. But I still think he's best off with the best coach, and with stronger partners to play with.

I just see no benefit in MJ. This isn't status quo for asset assessment. We aren't sending him down for a full season. We are sending him down for 20 games of a lost season.
 
Mess said:
Burning a year of his ELC for a 48 game schedule makes the decision more complicated then normal.

You'd have to believe that in order to go down this road management has to believe he will not only play but be able to contribute regularly to a team that hopes to challenge for a playoff spot.
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My opinion is based solely on Rielly's benefit only. Not for the ELC considerations. If that's what they want to take into consideration, that's another story. But I think for his benefit, he is better off in Carlyle's hands then anywhere else. I really think we are talking about a real blue chip prospect. He may as well have the best coach. I don't think there is anything left for him in MJ. Not on a losing team.
 
If we hold Rielly down in junior again next year, and maybe for a couple of AHL seasons after that, his ELC will last forever!
 
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