Post-Game Talk: What do you guys have planned for 12:30 on Saturday?

[Heaton]

If Mrazek was going to get a start, it should have been one of the last two games.

Since March he has completely imploded. Not only with the stats but just with his positioning, angles, rebound control.

I understand the idea of putting your hopes on the one guy who is to thank for even giving us the chance to put ourselves in a playoff position, but I don't agree with it based on recent play.

Funny enough, had Mrazek played more over the 3 months that Howard was the worst goalie in the league, we would have clinched last week.

 

[Heaton]

Dude, the score was 1-5 and the game was over by the time the kids got to play. Everyone probably gave up at that point.

But hey, keep defending the Captain because of his "leadership". His "leadership" that has been worth 35 points and a -15 in the last 70 games, being arguably the least efficient point producing top 6 forward in the entire NHL, terrible defensive play, and a bad team. He's basically David Legwand from 2 years ago (who we all hated), except he's playing 19/20 minutes per game instead of 16.

It's easy to defend Z because of the way this team was constructed and how the team is being managed. A competent coach would not be playing Z as much as he is, thus magnifying his shortcomings. Instead, we had a terrible roster created by Holland and a rookie coach close bordering on incompetence. Couple that with the players playing poorly and here we are. Kinda hard to blame the players in this case when it's not Z's job to tell Blashill how to coach the team.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Funny enough, had Mrazek played more over the 3 months that Howard was the worst goalie in the league, we would have clinched last week.

That's nice.

Though we could always make the argument that if Mrazek played more often he may have fallen off even sooner. The hypothetical game, and everything. At this point, it is pretty irrelevant since we have one game where we control our destiny and two goaltenders with big question marks.

 

[Bench]

You could point to a dozen things that would have this team clinched right now. But so could the Bruins and Flyers.

 

[Heaton]

That's nice.

Though we could always make the argument that if Mrazek played more often he may have fallen off even sooner. The hypothetical game, and everything. At this point, it is pretty irrelevant since we have one game where we control our destiny and two goaltenders with big question marks.

Not really. We have one goalie who has had a rough March, the other had a rough season. Starting Howard on Saturday makes sense, but people really need to stop acting like Mrazek has been bad for months. Basically, I'd rather go with the goalie who got us here.

 

[Bench]

Yeah, play Mrazek. Live and die by the sword, ya know?

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Not really. We have one goalie who has had a rough March, the other had a rough season. Starting Howard on Saturday makes sense, but people really need to stop acting like Mrazek has been bad for months. Basically, I'd rather go with the goalie who got us here.

He's been bad since March, which is the problem.

I understand living and dying based on what he has done this season but not only was he slumping, but he just has been unable to get it going since. I think both strategies can be valid.

 

[Reddwit]

Well it seems like you missed the point here.

Like I said I'm not trying to point blame here nor defend anyone for that matter.

I just feel there is a lack of evidence that supports the idea that playing the kids more will lead to a different outcome than what we have seen all season.

As I shared, the bruins took further control of the game in third when the kids saw their ice time spike. You can blame it on "everyone giving up" but then I would counter that these young guys lack the hunger necessary. If they want more ice time they should prove they deserve it. And furthering the possession game in Boston's favour is the opposite of proving they deserve more minutes.

LOL, so the young guys are supposed to further the possession when the 3-4 veterans on the ice with them have no interest in being there?

And what kind of denial are you in if you think Athanasiou hasn't proved he deserves more minutes? He's top of the league in P/60 and is a serviceable PKer as a rookie.

Not even Babcock stifled his rookies this much. Tatar got more minutes as a 21 year old under Babcock. But you don't think Athanasiou is being handle too conservatively? Ok, man.

 

[Bench]

No, you can't see validity in two opinions. You must choose. This is Sophie's Choice. There can only be one! You cannot die, McCloud!!!

 

[Heaton]

He's been bad since March, which is the problem.

I understand living and dying based on what he has done this season but not only was he slumping, but he just has been unable to get it going since. I think both strategies can be valid.

Again, not quite. He's had a few really terrible games in March, but also some very good ones. I understand why the team is going with Howard, I just don't agree with it. Howard's time in Detroit is going to be limited, it's the same reason why not playing Mantha or the other pieces of the future is extremely detrimental. We're sacrificing long term development for short term 'success'. When success means another notch on the wall that ultimately is meaningless.

 

[Bench]

Heaton is all hot and bothered for a rebuild.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Again, not quite. He's had a few really terrible games in March, but also some very good ones. I understand why the team is going with Howard, I just don't agree with it. Howard's time in Detroit is going to be limited, it's the same reason why not playing Mantha or the other pieces of the future is extremely detrimental. We're sacrificing long term development for short term 'success'. When success means another notch on the wall that ultimately is meaningless.

Mrazek had the worst stats among goaltenders to start at least 5 games in March.

The Mantha situation is different because he can be put in the roster in place of a lot of different fringe guys, and with his play previously there is no reason to keep him out. I also don't see that much of a long-term negative having Mrazek not start in the playoffs, considering he had a ton of starts this season and already has playoff experience. Mantha has not played many games in the NHL and has zero playoff experience.

 

[Heaton]

Mrazek had the worst stats among goaltenders to start at least 5 games in March.

I'd attribute that to a rookie headcoach's overreaction and knee-jerk pulls on a couple occasions. Especially in the Montreal game, that killed his stats for the month.

The Mantha situation is different because he can be put in the roster in place of a lot of different fringe guys, and with his play previously there is no reason to keep him out. I also don't see that much of a long-term negative having Mrazek not start in the playoffs, considering he had a ton of starts this season and already has playoff experience. Mantha has not played many games in the NHL and has zero playoff experience.

If we had a chance to win the cup, you'd have a point, but what is the benefit of starting Howard in the playoffs? Unless it's to boost his trade value (like Holland would ever trade him! ).

 

[Claypool]

I'd attribute that to a rookie headcoach's overreaction and knee-jerk pulls on a couple occasions. Especially in the Montreal game, that killed his stats for the month.

Maybe if he was playing better he wouldn't have been getting pulled.

 

[sarcastro]

Heaton is all hot and bothered for a rebuild.

Running Mrazek out there to get slaughtered if he's in a serious funk could be more detrimental than anything long term.

I'm fine rolling with Jimmy tomorrow. We'd see both goalies in the playoffs anyway, especially if it's the Caps.

 

[Heaton]

Maybe if he was playing better he wouldn't have been getting pulled.

I'm pretty fascinated with how this shift has happened. People clamored for Howard to play when he was incapable of winning for 3 months, Mrazek has a few bad games and the same people are completely against Mrazek playing.

I get that the season is on the line, so playing Howard since he's been better (outside of last game) makes complete sense. But thinking playing Mrazek makes no sense? I mean, when do you play Mrazek again if that's the criteria we're going on?

The real question comes if Howard plays bad and the Wings lose, yet back in to the playoffs. I'd love to see that type of debate.

 

[Heaton]

Heaton is all hot and bothered for a rebuild.

Doesn't even have to be a rebuild, but staying country club status quo is getting us no where.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

Doesn't even have to be a rebuild, but staying country club status quo is getting us no where.

Nowhere is somewhere.

-Ken Holland

 

[TheRatPoisoner]

Yeah, play Mrazek. Live and die by the sword, ya know?

Think this pretty accurately sums up the Mrazek v.s Howard debate right about now.

 

[BinCookin]

I'm pretty fascinated with how this shift has happened. People clamored for Howard to play when he was incapable of winning for 3 months, Mrazek has a few bad games and the same people are completely against Mrazek playing.

I get that the season is on the line, so playing Howard since he's been better (outside of last game) makes complete sense. But thinking playing Mrazek makes no sense? I mean, when do you play Mrazek again if that's the criteria we're going on?

The real question comes if Howard plays bad and the Wings lose, yet back in to the playoffs. I'd love to see that type of debate.

Emotion drives this board. Most posters are literally hating and loving minute to minute. Zetterberg is horrible... then he assists on a goal and everyone cheers.

People also exaggerate just a little.

Howard and Mrazek both played well to begin the season. They alternated starts. Then Howard faltered and Mrazek became the starter. Then Mrazek faltered and now Howard is the starter.

Basically its 2 goalies competing for time. (i don't care who has been better for the season)

One is signed for 3 years, 1 on his rookie season. (first full season)

This is not a "oh noes"... "why can't we trade howard.. OMG his caphit, we have Mrazek now". That is an overreaction to short term good play of Mrazek. I have always been on board the Keep Howard at least 2 more year, sign Mrazek to a 2 year bridge. Then we will have a large track record to determine if Mrazek is our Goalie for the next 10 years.

People around here hate Holland because of one of his main assets... Patience. It doesn't work out when we want changes fast. Changes are slow in the Red Wings world. And I will be very surprised if Howard is moved in the next 18 months.

It really doesn't matter who the starter is for this playoffs. When one gets bombed, we will switch to our 2nd goalie. Until he gets bombed. Then we switch back. They have to keep competing forever.

Mrazek is not garbage, and nor is Howard. Anyone who is selling you one side is simply impatient. I will agree with the 2 year conclussion. And am ok with 7 Mil invested in our goalie tandem until that point is reached.... and so is Holland!

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Bin, if we want to move forward with Mrazek we can't have Howard's cap hit hurting us, especially with Datsyuk potentially leaving, Franzen on LTIR forever, and Zetterberg+Kronwall declining with big salaries. Howard has been serviceable and good for stretches, but that isn't enough to justify his price tag going forward.

 

[mindfly]

I have planned to watch the wings lose so they miss the playoffs. Even though I like the Red Wings I would like to see them miss the playoffs for once

 

[SoupNazi]

I have planned to watch the wings lose so they miss the playoffs. Even though I like the Red Wings I would like to see them miss the playoffs for once

So we get that magical 14th pick instead of the 15th?

That's a great strategy.

 

[The Zermanator]

I have planned to watch the wings lose so they miss the playoffs. Even though I like the Red Wings I would like to see them miss the playoffs for once

But seriously, that's just silly.

 

[aar000n]

So we get that magical 14th pick instead of the 15th?

That's a great strategy.

Just think the next lidstrom is waiting for us