Prospect Info: Tyler Boucher (RW/LW) - Don`t sleep on Tyler Boucher

[Xspyrit]

Thats a great pick if he is, just cant over pay him into his mid thirties.

I find that Anderson is a glorified Colin Greening, he has the vision/passing and skills of a bottom-6 forward but has a big body and skates like the wind so people are automatically "enamored" and see him as a power forward. It's not wrong but maybe more like a 3rd line pwfd?

If Boucher becomes the same type of player, it would actually be a good outcome considering what has happened since the draft. It would be better than Brian Lee 2.0

As long as we never overpay Boucher for more than what he is, then ok. Hopefully he will be good defensively at least. Anderson is also nothing special in that department

Probably a good comparison, he'll score, he'll hit, he'll fight, but at times looks like he isn't engaged. Will likely get a lot of penalties because of how hard he hits & because of those hits will likely have to fight a lot. Unlike Anderson though I think Bucher will be much harder on other players & be a pain in the ass to play against & more of a pest or agitator & instigator. Boucher also has decent vision & is a pretty good passer something he doesn't get much credit for.

You are describing Chris Neil, which I would much rather Boucher becomes than Anderson. If you forget one minute about the 10th OA pick and that Cole Sillinger or Jesper Wallstedt were available, it would be a great outcome.

Caveat, I, personally, think Anderson is one of the most overrated, overplayed players in the league, I wouldn't trade future considerations for him. He has made any line he's played on worse ever since his 47 point career season , while I understand it's a valuable player, I personally don't think it's a sought after projection.

Skillset is the sought after unicorn, have never seen the value Anderson gets by pundits on the ice. I hope Boucher will be more valuable than Anderson, outside of his flukey year.

His contract is totally unattractive, any GM giving a valuable asset for him is crazy desperate or is a total dinosaur

Anderson makes 5.5 AAV for 4 years (0.43 PPG career)
Joseph makes 2.95 AAV for 4 years (0.35 PPG career)

And there's some talk that Joseph might be overpaid... so imagine how overpaid Anderson is.

 

[R2010]

Anderson is about a realistic ceiling, we'd have to be happy with that outcome disregarding the position of the pick. Similar trajectories.

A ~20 goal, ~30-35 point power forward who jumps up and down the lineup.

Caveat, I, personally, think Anderson is one of the most overrated, overplayed players in the league, I wouldn't trade future considerations for him. He has made any line he's played on worse ever since his 47 point career season , while I understand it's a valuable player, I personally don't think it's a sought after projection.

Skillset is the sought after unicorn, have never seen the value Anderson gets by pundits on the ice. I hope Boucher will be more valuable than Anderson, outside of his flukey year.

A lot of people act like people are Boucher haters. He just wasn't a good pick at 10. We'd all be happy with him if he were a late 1st or early 2nd. We'd say he has the tools but a rough start. Like Jarventie (though different). The issue is at #10 there were a lot of good players there - many of whom have bypassed him as a prospect. Not that he won't be valuable.

There's also the opportunity cost of what could've been acquired for a #10 overall pick from Seattle or whatever.


Anyways your Anderson comment is right on the money. I personally think he is one of the most overrated players in the league. His hockey sense is atrocious. He's not far off from Zaitsev in his decisionmaking.

 

[bert]

A lot of people act like people are Boucher haters. He just wasn't a good pick at 10. We'd all be happy with him if he were a late 1st or early 2nd. We'd say he has the tools but a rough start. Like Jarventie (though different). The issue is at #10 there were a lot of good players there - many of whom have bypassed him as a prospect. Not that he won't be valuable.

There's also the opportunity cost of what could've been acquired for a #10 overall pick from Seattle or whatever.


Anyways your Anderson comment is right on the money. I personally think he is one of the most overrated players in the league. His hockey sense is atrocious. He's not far off from Zaitsev in his decisionmaking.

While I agree it seems like there were better options but we simply don't know yet. Everyone wrote him off. Most people around here forget these players are human beings. He moved teams, countries, leagues and cities mid year last year and has battled injuries. He finally seems to be getting settled and is being used like how he will be in the NHL. He was also always going to be a bit of a project. He is going to have a longer development curve. People need to be more patient.

 

[R2010]

While I agree it seems like there were better options but we simply don't know yet. Everyone wrote him off. Most people around here forget these players are human beings. He moved teams, countries, leagues and cities mid year last year and has battled injuries. He finally seems to be getting settled and is being used like how he will be in the NHL. He was also always going to be a bit of a project. He is going to have a longer development curve. People need to be more patient.

Sure but the same could be said for other players drafted just after him who were in that range (e.g. Lucius). Boucher has had a really bad statistical couple of seasons since the draft. He's not been good. He's having a good WJC and he's had some good games with Ottawa. Hopefully he turns out as a 3rd liner. But with his performance to date he's very unlikely to ever be a top six forward. There are always exceptions to the rule but rarely are players future top six Fs without being a leading point producer at some level.

If he keeps it up you never know - maybe he'll become a good and valuable 3rd line winger. That'd be good value if he were a late 1st etc... At #10 you're hoping to have seen glimpses of a top six forward by this point. There's loads of glimpses you can see of that kind of profile in the next ~10 or so picks following him.

It is what it is. Some people are overboard and certainly I'm sure he's seen some of the unfortunate comments which is a bit sad. He can't control where he was picked. Almost feel bad for him with all the added pressure Ottawa put on him.

 

[bert]

Sure but the same could be said for other players drafted just after him who were in that range (e.g. Lucius). Boucher has had a really bad statistical couple of seasons since the draft. He's not been good. He's having a good WJC and he's had some good games with Ottawa. Hopefully he turns out as a 3rd liner. But with his performance to date he's very unlikely to ever be a top six forward. There are always exceptions to the rule but rarely are players future top six Fs without being a leading point producer at some level.

If he keeps it up you never know - maybe he'll become a good and valuable 3rd line winger. That'd be good value if he were a late 1st etc... At #10 you're hoping to have seen glimpses of a top six forward by this point. There's loads of glimpses you can see of that kind of profile in the next ~10 or so picks following him.

It is what it is. Some people are overboard and certainly I'm sure he's seen some of the unfortunate comments which is a bit sad. He can't control where he was picked. Almost feel bad for him with all the added pressure Ottawa put on him.

Kinda strange to quote my post then follow it up with this..... Would you prefer Lucius? He's pretty one dimensional.

I think he is alot mentally tougher and has more upside than you do. Physical players take longer to develop, he has upside. Maybe you just dont want to see it.

 

[Oscar The Grouch]

Boucher has been unstoppable. Best player at the WJHC.

Spare me Bedard's useless points.

 

[Samsquanch]

Kinda strange to quote my post then follow it up with this..... Would you prefer Lucius? He's pretty one dimensional.

I think he is alot mentally tougher and has more upside than you do. Physical players take longer to develop, he has upside. Maybe you just dont want to see it.

Boucher will probably be the latest and greatest case of the usual suspects going full out drama queen when they disagree with a pick.

He's still a reach at #10 until he can prove otherwise - but ffs, can we at least not all agree that he's the type of player that you aren't going to be able to judge in full value until they turn pro/into a man beast thats able to play to his strengths? Were still years away.

The kid does many things very pro like. Like skating and shooting extremely well, and battling for every inch. He's going to be a massively strong and physically powerful man in his prime. And he seems to know exactly how to use it.

Like you said Bert, if you choose to ignore why he's a good prospect or what they see for him/the Sens in the big picture. That's your own choice to be ignorant.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Boucher will probably be the latest and greatest case of the usual suspects going full out drama queen when they disagree with a pick.

He's still a reach at #10 until he can prove otherwise - but ffs, can we at least not all agree that he's the type of player that you aren't going to be able to judge in full value until they turn pro/into a man beast thats able to play to his strengths? Were still years away.

The kid does many things very pro like. Like skating and shooting extremely well, and battling for every inch. He's going to be a massively strong and physically powerful man in his prime. And he seems to know exactly how to use it.

Like you said Bert, if you choose to ignore why he's a good prospect or what they see for him/the Sens in the big picture. That's your own choice to be ignorant.

That, and whether we like it or not, he’s a Sens prospect so why not get behind the pick instead of doubling down on our own preferred players who weren’t chosen.

Seems dumb. No one cares who we all wish we drafted at the time, it’s over, the ship has sailed and yet some folks are still standing at the dock shaking their fists at the sea.

Boucher is our guy and its great when he shines, or should be for Sens fans….

Boucher will probably be the latest and greatest case of the usual suspects going full out drama queen when they disagree with a pick.

He's still a reach at #10 until he can prove otherwise - but ffs, can we at least not all agree that he's the type of player that you aren't going to be able to judge in full value until they turn pro/into a man beast thats able to play to his strengths? Were still years away.

The kid does many things very pro like. Like skating and shooting extremely well, and battling for every inch. He's going to be a massively strong and physically powerful man in his prime. And he seems to know exactly how to use it.

Like you said Bert, if you choose to ignore why he's a good prospect or what they see for him/the Sens in the big picture. That's your own choice to be ignorant.

That, and whether we like it or not, he’s a Sens prospect so why not get behind the puck instead of doubling down on our own preferred players who weren’t chosen.

Seems dumb. No one cares who we all wish we drafted, it’s over.

Boucher is our guy and its great when he shines, or should be for Sens fans….

 

[Samsquanch]

That, and whether we like it or not, he’s a Sens prospect so why not get behind the pick instead of doubling down on our own preferred players who weren’t chosen.

Seems dumb. No one cares who we all wish we drafted at the time, it’s over, the ship has sailed and yet some folks are still standing at the dock shaking their fists at the sea.

Boucher is our guy and its great when he shines, or should be for Sens fans….


That, and whether we like it or not, he’s a Sens prospect so why not get behind the puck instead of doubling down on our own preferred players who weren’t chosen.

Seems dumb. No one cares who we all wish we drafted, it’s over.

Boucher is our guy and its great when he shines, or should be for Sens fans….

Agree 100%. Drafted by the Sens? Your one of us now, so lets shut up about where they got drafted because they didn't have any control over that.

There's probably an uncomfortable amount of Sens "fans" that are actively rooting against the poor kid to fail, just so they can feel vindicated for their own personal vanity and having been right about their opinion.
Lots that won't admit it because they don't even realize its happening on a subconscious level.

But regardless too many people are so convinced that they know better than gurus like Mann and Dorion who've been literally scouting for their entire careers - and they might be looking for different things in players than you personally are. Trade secrets.

And those disgruntled posters make some embarrassing (and very public) hot takes on the players. And instead of pumping the breaks after the dust settles, we see far too many folk here doubling down on their opinions more often than not......

 

[Ice-Tray]

Agree 100%. Drafted by the Sens? Your one of us now, so lets shut up about where they got drafted because they didn't have any control over that.

There's probably an uncomfortable amount of Sens "fans" that are actively rooting against the poor kid to fail, just so they can feel vindicated for their own personal vanity and having been right about their opinion.
Lots that won't admit it because they don't even realize its happening on a subconscious level.

But regardless too many people are so convinced that they know better than gurus like Mann and Dorion who've been literally scouting for their entire careers - and they might be looking for different things in players that you personally are.

And those posters make some embarrassing (and very public) hot takes on players. And instead of pumping the breaks, we see far too many folk here doubling down on their opinions more often than not......

Yeah I hear you…

I’m old enough to know that watching Bob Villa and understanding how to build a deck not only doesn’t make you able to build a deck, but also doesn’t mean that you’d build a better deck than someone who has been doing it as a job for a decade.

Just lots of searching for validation on the internet, when the truth is; no one cares. Thanks for all of your amateur scouting, but I hope you enjoy it because it carries zero weight and doesn’t enter the arena with those who are paid to do it.

It’s supposed to be just for fun, but like you said folks end up double and tripling down on their own opinions and can’t seem to find their way back to the sports team that we cheer for.

Supposed to be fun and entertaining, and a forum for debate…. Seems like a forum for if experts on everything these days.

 

[OD99]

Yeah I hear you…

I’m old enough to know that watching Bob Villa and understanding how to build a deck not only doesn’t make you able to build a deck, but also doesn’t mean that you’d build a better deck than someone who has been doing it as a job for a decade.

Just lots of searching for validation on the internet, when the truth is; no one cares. Thanks for all of your amateur scouting, but I hope you enjoy it because it carries zero weight and doesn’t enter the arena with those who are paid to do it.

It’s supposed to be just for fun, but like you said folks end up double and tripling down on their own opinions and can’t seem to find their way back to the sports team that we cheer for.

Supposed to be fun and entertaining, and a forum for debate…. Seems like a forum for if experts on everything these days.

Quoting you just because it was last post.

The bashing that several seem to be so upset about regarding Boucher is OK when directed at posters who don't think Boucher was a good pick?

The guy had a good game putting in a couple of rebounds and he is now a lock for middle 6 F on Sens? So others shouldn't form opinions early but when he finally shows a glimmer of promise we are to now all agree he is going to score at the NHL level (20 goals is a lot)?

Talk about egos and needing to be right...jeesh. Let's see him have a strong finish to the season, follow it up with a good TC and then an impactful season in the A next year before calling for the, "sorry Boucher!" chants.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Quoting you just because it was last post.

The bashing that several seem to be so upset about regarding Boucher is OK when directed at posters who don't think Boucher was a good pick?

The guy had a good game putting in a couple of rebounds and he is now a lock for middle 6 F on Sens? So others shouldn't form opinions early but when he finally shows a glimmer of promise we are to now all agree he is going to score at the NHL level (20 goals is a lot)?

Talk about egos and needing to be right...jeesh. Let's see him have a strong finish to the season, follow it up with a good TC and then an impactful season in the A next year before calling for the, "sorry Boucher!" chants.

When did trying to be ‘rational’ as in down play everything, become a better position than being bullish towards your prospects?

I think the over all point is that there are lots of negative posts about the player, and posters wanting to be right about it, rather than posting about the positives and being hopeful that he builds on it.

It’s a division on these boards on most topics, and gets played out over and over again.

To me, hey he’s shown signs of being a potential NHLer, let’s explore that and boost his positive showings… other feel the need to constantly downplay them and play up the negatives, along with their general displeasure of the pick.

This is a Sens fan forum, so one should expect push back towards negativity thrown at the team and players, no matter how ‘reasonable’ a person thinks they are being.

Fanatics…. Fans…. You know

 

[JD1]

I’m old enough to know that watching Bob Villa and understanding how to build a deck not only doesn’t make you able to build a deck, but also doesn’t mean that you’d build a better deck than someone who has been doing it as a job for a decade.

Sounds like Mrs. Ice Tray has a story to tell about that time...

Hmmm. 19 year old 1st rounder getting PP time and already 3 goals at the WJC.

Typically we'd be pretty excited about that.

 

[Samsquanch]

When did trying to be ‘rational’ as in down play everything, become a better position than being bullish towards your prospects?

I think the over all point is that there are lots of negative posts about the player, and posters wanting to be right about it, rather than posting about the positives and being hopeful that he builds on it.

It’s a division on these boards on most topics, and gets played out over and over again.

To me, hey he’s shown signs of being a potential NHLer, let’s explore that and boost his positive showings… other feel the need to constantly downplay them and play up the negatives, along with their general displeasure of the pick.

This is a Sens fan forum, so one should expect push back towards negativity thrown at the team and players, no matter how ‘reasonable’ a person thinks they are being.

Fanatics…. Fans…. You know

Well said

 

[RickyLafleur]

Looking good at the WJC, but we still need to see more consistency from him before I start changing my tune on him. It is certainly possible that his game translates better in the NHL than it would in a lower league, however, I still think we should temper our expectations for this young lad as he still hasn't played very much in the last couple of years.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Ya but Cole Silinger amirite

 

[OD99]

DELETE.

 

[OD99]

When did trying to be ‘rational’ as in down play everything, become a better position than being bullish towards your prospects?

Who mentioned rational?

I think the over all point is that there are lots of negative posts about the player, and posters wanting to be right about it, rather than posting about the positives and being hopeful that he builds on it.

This would require the bullish posters to be mind readers - or maybe they just want to think the people who haven't liked Boucher's development believe this?

I think the idea that fans want him to be bad is a figment of the imaginations of those who just can't believe Boucher may not be what they want him to be.

There is a group that keep pushing the narrative and putting words in the mouths of posters who have basically the same feelings on the player.

"He hasn't been great and it doesn't look good but let's see how he develops" VS "He has been fine, because XYZ hasn't been in his favour, let's see how he develops"

To me, hey he’s shown signs of being a potential NHLer, let’s explore that and boost his positive showings…

Sure - how does calling out people who have a differing opinion boost his showings? Why even feel the need to do that after 1 good showing?

This is a Sens fan forum, so one should expect push back towards negativity thrown at the team and players, no matter how ‘reasonable’ a person thinks they are being

Same goes for the gumdrop and rainbow crowd. There is no difference other than perception

.Fanatics…. Fans…. You know

I certainly do - I am a proud one myself.

 

[ksens]

Quoting you just because it was last post.

The bashing that several seem to be so upset about regarding Boucher is OK when directed at posters who don't think Boucher was a good pick?

The guy had a good game putting in a couple of rebounds and he is now a lock for middle 6 F on Sens? So others shouldn't form opinions early but when he finally shows a glimmer of promise we are to now all agree he is going to score at the NHL level (20 goals is a lot)?

Talk about egos and needing to be right...jeesh. Let's see him have a strong finish to the season, follow it up with a good TC and then an impactful season in the A next year before calling for the, "sorry Boucher!" chants.

The "Sens fans cheering against Boucher" is a strawman to make them feel better about their ridiculous projections. I don't see Sens fans cheering against him at all. I see people:

a) Still annoyed that we used a top-10 pick on Boucher. I can see how many want this to be water under the bridge, and of course Boucher had no control over where he was drafted.

b) Sick of the over the top cheerleading and ridiculous comparisons to established NHL players. This thread is full of this nonsense with people with homer glasses welded to their faces trying to convince people that a middling CHL player is in fact the next Tom Wilson.

Glad that he's had a good WJC so far. Hope he builds on that and finishes strong in the OHL and is able to make a transition to the pros and take a regular shift in Belleville next year and continue to progress and turn into an NHL player one day. That is a realistic scenario, and would be a good outcome at this point.

But for some people any take that doesn't involve him immediately and magically developing into a top 6 power forward at the NHL level is "cheering against him".

 

[Do Make Say Think]

But for some people any take that doesn't involve him immediately and magically developing into a top 6 power forward at the NHL level is "cheering against him".

Ya but have you seen Cole Sillinger? Our scouts are so damn stupid!

/s

 

[Samsquanch]

The "Sens fans cheering against Boucher" is a strawman to make them feel better about their ridiculous projections. I don't see Sens fans cheering against him at all. I see people:

a) Still annoyed that we used a top-10 pick on Boucher. I can see how many want this to be water under the bridge, and of course Boucher had no control over where he was drafted.

b) Sick of the over the top cheerleading and ridiculous comparisons to established NHL players. This thread is full of this nonsense with people with homer glasses welded to their faces trying to convince people that a middling CHL player is in fact the next Tom Wilson.

Glad that he's had a good WJC so far. Hope he builds on that and finishes strong in the OHL and is able to make a transition to the pros and take a regular shift in Belleville next year and continue to progress and turn into an NHL player one day. That is a realistic scenario, and would be a good outcome at this point.

But for some people any take that doesn't involve him immediately and magically developing into a top 6 power forward at the NHL level is "cheering against him".

If your so damn sick of hearing fans being excited about their own team, then why are you here then anyways on a fan message board for the team? Cant you go and be unenthusiastic about something else in your life where we dont need to hear you whine?

Trust me when we say that we are equally sick of your type polluting every thread with your rainy day garbage. So I guess we will just have to both live with it then, eh?

 

[aragorn]

Yeah I hear you…

I’m old enough to know that watching Bob Villa and understanding how to build a deck not only doesn’t make you able to build a deck, but also doesn’t mean that you’d build a better deck than someone who has been doing it as a job for a decade.

Just lots of searching for validation on the internet, when the truth is; no one cares. Thanks for all of your amateur scouting, but I hope you enjoy it because it carries zero weight and doesn’t enter the arena with those who are paid to do it.

It’s supposed to be just for fun, but like you said folks end up double and tripling down on their own opinions and can’t seem to find their way back to the sports team that we cheer for.

Supposed to be fun and entertaining, and a forum for debate…. Seems like a forum for if experts on everything these days.

I just hired Bob Villa to build my new deck, are you aware he is over 90 yrs old now? I hope he doesn't die on me .... oh wait, he's only 76 yrs old .... whew ... he should be okay then .... right?

 

[jhutter]

Boucher will probably be the latest and greatest case of the usual suspects going full out drama queen when they disagree with a pick.

He's still a reach at #10 until he can prove otherwise - but ffs, can we at least not all agree that he's the type of player that you aren't going to be able to judge in full value until they turn pro/into a man beast thats able to play to his strengths? Were still years away.

The kid does many things very pro like. Like skating and shooting extremely well, and battling for every inch. He's going to be a massively strong and physically powerful man in his prime. And he seems to know exactly how to use it.

Like you said Bert, if you choose to ignore why he's a good prospect or what they see for him/the Sens in the big picture. That's your own choice to be ignorant.

If he shot “extremely well” I’d imagine he’d have more goals against 17 and 18 year olds in the OHL. A third of his goals this year are empty netters. His production is extremely disappointing.

I think there’d be far less opposition to him if there wasn’t so much cheerleading and hyperbole involved on the other side.

 

[Samsquanch]

If he shot “extremely well” I’d imagine he’d have more goals against 17 and 18 year olds in the OHL. A third of his goals this year are empty netters. His production is extremely disappointing.

I think there’d be far less opposition to him if there wasn’t so much cheerleading and hyperbole involved on the other side.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Who mentioned rational?

This would require the bullish posters to be mind readers - or maybe they just want to think the people who haven't liked Boucher's development believe this?

I think the idea that fans want him to be bad is a figment of the imaginations of those who just can't believe Boucher may not be what they want him to be.

There is a group that keep pushing the narrative and putting words in the mouths of posters who have basically the same feelings on the player.

"He hasn't been great and it doesn't look good but let's see how he develops" VS "He has been fine, because XYZ hasn't been in his favour, let's see how he develops"

Sure - how does calling out people who have a differing opinion boost his showings? Why even feel the need to do that after 1 good showing?

Same goes for the gumdrop and rainbow crowd. There is no difference other than perception

I certainly do - I am a proud one myself.

We seem to disagree on fundamentals, which is fine