Training Camp continued

[kb]

Just the angle of the picture.

But Liljegren and Sandin are together against each other....and Rasmus is 5'11"

 

[ULF_55]

See that's the thing. I don't think it's necessary to ice your best lineup in game one. I think it's necessary to qualify for the playoffs yes, but more importantly, it's learning/teaching/training towards having your best possible lineup in the playoff and what that could be. Putting Malgin on Waivers, just to ice your best lineup in game one, might not be the wisest. Malgin gets claimed, and you've lost that option. Malgin has been fantastic in pre-season, and last year in Europe, but we really need some regular season games to see if that's the case for a bigger sample, against legit NHL teams. If he's good enough, (and Robertson too) it's gives you options to maybe move a guy like Kerfoot.

It would be foolish to move Kerfoot for an unproven Malgin or Robertson, but if they prove they are roster worthy, to create that best lineup, then you have options. Imagine Dubas moves Kerfoot, stuck Malgin/Robertson in the lineup, and then they weren't good enough?

The regular season is a journey, no real need to worry about game one rosters. Robertson is likely in the lineup in game two anyway, when they can use an emergency call up.



Tavares is in 4A.

It was preseason!

If he misses 10 NHL games, it doesn't mean he's sitting on the bench like Leivo for half the season.
He just turned 21, and has proven very little in the NHL.

 

[ULF_55]

I'd move Marner to 1C.
Is Tavares not listed?

Click on it ... my mature eyes can see it just fine then.

 

[ULF_55]

FYI thats not just Dom's rankings. His model is an input but that's a bunch of eye tests joining together for a ranking.

They look reasonable, couple I question that must be influenced by draft position and hype.

 

[ULF_55]

But Liljegren and Sandin are together against each other....and Rasmus is 5'11"

Skates on?

1 inch difference in height?

 

[LeafSteel]

Thanks....missed it, print is a little small for me.

I missed it too, but I blame the Steelers game on Sunday for my eyes not functioning properly........

 

[ACC1224]

I missed it too, but I blame the Steelers game on Sunday for my eyes not functioning properly........

Was away all weekend, feel fortunate that I missed both the Jays and Steelers debacle.

 

[zeke]

Here's Dom's model's ranking of the top 100 players - well, not exactly since I'm taking it from the team pages that adjust the number for projected ice time - but close enough:

(Might be missing a few injured guys)

1.Matthews 6.2
2.McDavid 5.8

3.Makar 4.8
3.MacKinnon 4.8
5.Rantanen 4.7
6.Marchand 4.6
6.Marner 4.6
6.M.Tkachuk 4.6
6.Pastrnak 4.6

10.Gaudreau 4.4
11.Shesterkin 4.3
11.Bergeron 4.3
13.Kaprizov 4.2
13.Hellebuyck 4.2
15.McAvoy 4.1
16.Robertson 4.0
17.Kucherov 3.9
18.Draisaitl 3.8
18.Hedman 3.8
20.Vasilevskiy 3.7
20.Saros 3.7
20.Barkov 3.7
23.Fox 3.6
23.Stamkos 3.6

25.Hintz 3.5
26.Josi 3.4
26.Ekblad 3.4
26.Crosby 3.4
29.Panarin 3.3
29.Aho 3.3
31.Sorokin 3.2
31.Forsberg 3.2
31.Toews 3.2
31.Fiala 3.2
35.Huberdeau 3.1
35.Lindholm 3.1
35.Landeskog 3.1
35.Pacioretty 3.1
35.Ehlers 3.1
35.Guentzel 3.1

41.Meier 3.0
42.Point 2.9
42.Carlson 2.9
42.Heiskenen 2.9
42.Tavares 2.9
42.Stone 2.9
42.Pavelski 2.9
42.Andersen 2.9
49.P.Kane 2.8
49.Zibanejad 2.8
49.Markstrom 2.8
49.Duchene 2.8
49.Demko 2.8
49.Boldy 2.8
49.Bunting 2.8
56.Ovechkin 2.7
56.Nylander 2.7
56.Kuemper 2.7
56.Theodore 2.7
56.Marchment 2.7
56.Buchnevich 2.7
62.Slavin 2.6
62.Weegar 2.6
62.Kadri 2.6
62.Svechnikov 2.6
62.Pettersson 2.6

67.Miller 2.5
67.Debrincat 2.5
67.Reinhart 2.5
67.Zuccarello 2.5
67.Thomas 2.5
72.Malkin 2.4
72.Letang 2.4
72.Kyrou 2.4
72.Nichushkin 2.4
72.DeAngelo 2.4
72.Grzelcyk 2.4
72.Jarvis 2.4
72.Bratt 2.4
80.Rielly 2.3
80.Teravainen 2.3
80.Eichel 2.3
80.Hamilton 2.3
80.Hertl 2.3
80.Garland 2.3
80.Spurgeon 2.3
80.Kreider 2.3

88.Connor 2.2
88.Tarasenko 2.2
88.Hanifin 2.2
88.Lundell 2.2
88.Ek 2.2
88.Rust 2.2
88.Mangiapane 2.2
88.Gibson 2.2
88.Fleury 2.2
97.O'Reilly 2.1
97.Q.Hughes 2.1
97.Seider 2.1
97.Jarry 2.1
97.Andersson 2.1
97.Marchesseault 2.1
97.Zegras 2.1
97.Verhaeghe 2.1

 

[zeke]

They look reasonable, couple I question that must be influenced by draft position and hype.

I'm still waiting for that perfect ranking I agree with!

My biggest issues in their ranking is some guys with fairly empty offensive stats (especially PP stats) too high.

 

[IPS]

Here's Dom's model's ranking of the top 100 players - well, not exactly since I'm taking it from the team pages that adjust the number for projected ice time - but close enough:

(Might be missing a few injured guys)

1.Matthews 6.2
2.McDavid 5.8

3.Makar 4.8
3.MacKinnon 4.8
5.Rantanen 4.7
6.Marchand 4.6
6.Marner 4.6
6.M.Tkachuk 4.6
6.Pastrnak 4.6

10.Gaudreau 4.4
11.Shesterkin 4.3
11.Bergeron 4.3
13.Kaprizov 4.2
13.Hellebuyck 4.2
15.McAvoy 4.1
16.Robertson 4.0
17.Kucherov 3.9
18.Draisaitl 3.8
18.Hedman 3.8
20.Vasilevskiy 3.7
20.Saros 3.7
20.Barkov 3.7
23.Fox 3.6
23.Stamkos 3.6

25.Hintz 3.5
26.Josi 3.4
26.Ekblad 3.4
26.Crosby 3.4
29.Panarin 3.3
29.Aho 3.3
31.Sorokin 3.2
31.Forsberg 3.2
31.Toews 3.2
31.Fiala 3.2
35.Huberdeau 3.1
35.Lindholm 3.1
35.Landeskog 3.1
35.Pacioretty 3.1
35.Ehlers 3.1
35.Guentzel 3.1

41.Meier 3.0
42.Point 2.9
42.Carlson 2.9
42.Heiskenen 2.9
42.Tavares 2.9
42.Stone 2.9
42.Pavelski 2.9
42.Andersen 2.9
49.P.Kane 2.8
49.Zibanejad 2.8
49.Markstrom 2.8
49.Duchene 2.8
49.Demko 2.8
49.Boldy 2.8
49.Bunting 2.8
56.Ovechkin 2.7
56.Nylander 2.7
56.Kuemper 2.7
56.Theodore 2.7
56.Marchment 2.7
56.Buchnevich 2.7
62.Slavin 2.6
62.Weegar 2.6
62.Kadri 2.6
62.Svechnikov 2.6
62.Pettersson 2.6

67.Miller 2.5
67.Debrincat 2.5
67.Reinhart 2.5
67.Zuccarello 2.5
67.Thomas 2.5
72.Malkin 2.4
72.Letang 2.4
72.Kyrou 2.4
72.Nichushkin 2.4
72.DeAngelo 2.4
72.Grzelcyk 2.4
72.Jarvis 2.4
72.Bratt 2.4
80.Rielly 2.3
80.Teravainen 2.3
80.Eichel 2.3
80.Hamilton 2.3
80.Hertl 2.3
80.Garland 2.3
80.Spurgeon 2.3
80.Kreider 2.3

88.Connor 2.2
88.Tarasenko 2.2
88.Hanifin 2.2
88.Lundell 2.2
88.Ek 2.2
88.Rust 2.2
88.Mangiapane 2.2
88.Gibson 2.2
88.Fleury 2.2
97.O'Reilly 2.1
97.Q.Hughes 2.1
97.Seider 2.1
97.Jarry 2.1
97.Andersson 2.1
97.Marchesseault 2.1
97.Zegras 2.1
97.Verhaeghe 2.1

Just as expected, it's pretty stupid!

 

[zeke]

Just as expected, it's pretty stupid!

what's funny is I bet most of your objections come down to saying "but this guy scores more points than that guy, he should be higher!"

 

[IPS]

what's funny is I bet most of your objections come down to saying "but this guy scores more points than that guy, he should be higher!"

Not even close.

 

[zeke]

Not even close.

hmm.

 

[IPS]

hmm.

You agree with how many D rank ahead of Rielly on that garbage stat?

 

[zeke]

You agree with how many D rank ahead of Rielly on that garbage stat?

there's definitely a couple (like Deangelo and Grzlcyk) who imo the model hasn't quite been able to separate out usage from I don't think, as they've been much more sheltered than Rielly every year.

 

[IPS]

there's definitely a couple (like Deangelo and Grzlcyk) who imo the model hasn't quite been able to separate out usage from I don't think, as they've been much more sheltered than Rielly every year.

And apparently the "model" can't separate a beastly 2-way center like O'Reilly from quite a large handful of wingers who are average/below average defensively.

 

[zeke]

And apparently the "model" can't separate a beastly 2-way center like O'Reilly from quite a large handful of wingers who are average/below average defensively.

I mean, both offense and defense are important.

But yeah, guys who face extreme tough matchups are definitely the hardest ones to isolate value for.

Dom's model does a pretty good job of isolating usage but I usually personally tweak it a bit for both guys that face very tough usage and are a bit underrated as well as guys who face very easy usage and get a bit overrated.

 

[ULF_55]

You agree with how many D rank ahead of Rielly on that garbage stat?

My thought was how easy it would be to get a better defender than Rielly.

Overrated much?

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Just the angle of the picture.

sandin looks TINY like one of other guys tag along bros .. lily and engval are monsters

 

[diehardleafsfan9878]

Is Liljegren standing on Malgin or something? Because Engvall is 6'5".

Nhl has Liljegren listed at 6'1 now, but even comparing Nylander and sandin, Nylander is listed at 6', sandin at 5'11, there is more than 1 inch between those 2

 

[Niagara Bill]

So you don't like people being paid appropriately?

You are joking, right!
Can anyone not get paid properly if they receive $9,500,00.00 rather than $9,600,000.00.

 

[Niagara Bill]

I don't understand the issue here. Our cap specialists are able to go full wizard mode on the cap. That's a good thing. You can always make wiggle room by shedding from the bottom up. I like how we have 100% utilization.

The only thing left is to find a good GM to pair with these elite cap specialists. The current flat cap number is more than enough to win with that core so when I see these flat cap excuses pop up, all I see is the GM sucks at building around the core.

He does a good job finding guys for sure, but it is so tight that we get hamstrung. IMHO, bad bargaining to to protect a cushion. It seemed insignificant at the time that JT got 11.2m or 11.3, or MM git 10.4 or 10.3. But now it makes a difference.
Wizard mode is risky. We will have to move a player we do nit with to move to keep being wizards. It would be better to be a wizard with an additional $300,000 or 400,000. If our goaltending plan doesn't work, we are toast. No money left.

 

[stickty111]

Way different response than what McDavid gave

 

[zeke]

He does a good job finding guys for sure, but it is so tight that we get hamstrung. IMHO, bad bargaining to to protect a cushion. It seemed insignificant at the time that JT got 11.2m or 11.3, or MM git 10.4 or 10.3. But now it makes a difference.
Wizard mode is risky. We will have to move a player we do nit with to move to keep being wizards. It would be better to be a wizard with an additional $300,000 or 400,000. If our goaltending plan doesn't work, we are toast. No money left.

it's actually harder to wizard great bargains on elite talent rather than wizard great bargains on depth talent.

 

[Fogelhund]