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Trades & Free Agency Thread - Still Too Soon Off-Season Edition

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Antropovsky said:
I disagree that Marner gives better bang for buck.

Marner has 0 pp goals in his last 72 games and 0 goals in his last 18 post-season games. There is more evidence that Marner rides the coat tails of his high scoring centers, rather than the other way around as both Tavares and Matthews have proved to be ppg players without elite linemates in the past (and without Marner).

The last time Marner played with non-elite linemates he was a 69 point player. Since before he signed his contract I've been saying I want to seen Marner play an extended time without Tavares and Matthews. We leaf fans have yet to see Marner lead his own line... he's always stitched to an elite goal scorer.

Play Tavares Matthews on a line together for a season.... I bet they put up 115 points each.
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The second year in the NHL he got 69 points and you are shitting on him wow just wow.

Mathews 2nd year in the league 63 points.

Marner
20 goals in 55 games is 30 goals over 82 games

Marner and Mathews had incredible seasons .

They both sucked in the playoffs .

If you don't like Marner you are probably going to have to cheer for another team because I hate to say it but management won't trade him.
 
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dubplatepressure said:
it worked so well the first time.
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see i agree, but naz at his contract is valuable enough to nab him again considering our ass cap situation imo.

Either way these guys better figure it out. There has NEVER been a time (ballard era notwithstanding) where the leafs have been hated this much by its own fans. Ever. I hope it continues until we see the second round and a bunch of regulation wins don't blind the fans.
 
ER89 said:
see i agree, but naz at his contract is valuable enough to nab him again considering our ass cap situation imo.

Either way these guys better figure it out. There has NEVER been a time (ballard era notwithstanding) where the leafs have been hated this much by its own fans. Ever. I hope it continues until we see the second round and a bunch of regulation wins don't blind the fans.
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People keep using the Capitals comparison. You know it took Ovechkin so long to win a championship
Ovi and co had to face Crosby/Malkin. All they did was win 2 Stanly Cups and been runner up once
Oveckin also had a team named Boston and Chara. Soon to be two time champion Tempa who also went to the finals in 2015

We lost to Habs and Columbus. It's very easy to hate this team

But most fans who watched this team for years are not surprised. Our core was never about competing. In fact the players who were remotely competitive and had edge like Kadri, Kapanen and even AJ. We have managed to trade them away and have nothing to show for yet in this line up

You want to bring a Vet in? sure. Bring in a veteran like Spezza, who can play and healthy
Instead, we bring in 38 year in Marleau, who was never known to be competitive. Thornton, who is 41. I mean if you were bring in a 41 year old, why didn't you go after Chara?
We bring in Simmonds, poor guy who hasn't been fully healthy in 5 years. Average game played in betwen is about 35 a season
We trade for a guy who has been unhealthy all season and been in decline in Foligno
Nash, sure why not. He hasn't played 3 months and will be ready for game 1 in playoffs
Jimmy Vesey, a player who couldn't earn a spot in Buffalo. Allow that to sink in for a second

You wonder why this team is so hateable. I can honestly say I hate everything about this team. Which says alot, last 20 years I think I missed maybe 20 games
I love the logo, hate the team right now. We hated Dion Phaneuf, he would be an welcome addition to this team
Kessel, sure he was one dimensional, but whatever he was good at, he brought it to playoffs too

I will take a Kessel over a Marner anyday now
 
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fahad203 said:
People keep using the Capitals comparison. You know it took Ovechkin so long to win a championship
Ovi and co had to face Crosby/Malkin. All they did was win 2 Stanly Cups and been runner up once
Oveckin also had a team named Boston and Chara. Soon to be two time champion Tempa who also went to the finals in 2015

We lost to Habs and Columbus. It's very easy to hate this team

But most fans who watched this team for years are not surprised. Our core was never about competing. In fact the players who were remotely competitive and had edge like Kadri, Kapanen and even AJ. We have managed to trade them away and have nothing to show for yet in this line up

You want to bring a Vet in? sure. Bring in a veteran like Spezza, who can play and healthy
Instead, we bring in 38 year in Marleau, who was never known to be competitive. Thornton, who is 41. I mean if you were bring in a 41 year old, why didn't you go after Chara?
We bring in Simmonds, poor guy who hasn't been fully healthy in 5 years. Average game played in betwen is about 35 a season
We trade for a guy who has been unhealthy all season and been in decline in Foligno
Nash, sure why not. He hasn't played 3 months and will be ready for game 1 in playoffs
Jimmy Vesey, a player who couldn't earn a spot in Buffalo. Allow that to sink in for a second

You wonder why this team is so hateable. I can honestly say I hate everything about this team. Which says alot, last 20 years I think I missed maybe 20 games
I love the logo, hate the team right now. We hated Dion Phaneuf, he would be an welcome addition to this team
Kessel, sure he was one dimensional, but whatever he was good at, he brought it to playoffs too

I will take a Kessel over a Marner anyday now
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exactly. Plus I liked dubas thought he was smart. But the dude makes ONLY reactionary moves. no foresight. Oh we lost because of leadership? Lets get a waste jumbo+simmonds (who has since doubled down on). Then lets pay up the ass for foligno instead of grabbing taylor hall, the better hockey player for CHEAPER.
 
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ER89 said:
exactly. Plus I liked dubas thought he was smart. But the dude makes ONLY reactionary moves. no foresight. Oh we lost because of leadership? Lets get a waste jumbo+simmonds (who has since doubled down on). Then lets pay up the ass for foligno instead of grabbing taylor hall, the better hockey player for CHEAPER.
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They don't call him boy blunder for nothin.
 
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showtime8 said:
Not taking anything away from Matthews. I think he can score in a lot of different ways and spots on the ice.

But the narrative has been to crap on Marner for the last month or so. And all I'm trying to do is highlight the fact that he makes players around him better. I couldn't say one way or another if Matthews would have buried if he was playing with someone else.
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But Marner has not make an average player look good.
He is getting paid 11mil, he should be able to make players like Soup, Engvall, Gally, Kerfoot into 40pts players.
Pretty much anyone who played with AM became a 20 goals scorer.
How many players had career seasons playing with JT?
 
Gabriel426 said:
But Marner has not make an average player look good.
He is getting paid 11mil, he should be able to make players like Soup, Engvall, Gally, Kerfoot into 40pts players.
Pretty much anyone who played with AM became a 20 goals scorer.
How many players had career seasons playing with JT?
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He hasn't played much with those players, has he?
 
Every loss next year will be a cut on Dubas. Enough cuts and he will be gone. And every idiot at MLSEL that supported his bs vision should be gone as well.
 
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fahad203 said:
People keep using the Capitals comparison. You know it took Ovechkin so long to win a championship
Ovi and co had to face Crosby/Malkin. All they did was win 2 Stanly Cups and been runner up once
Oveckin also had a team named Boston and Chara. Soon to be two time champion Tempa who also went to the finals in 2015

We lost to Habs and Columbus. It's very easy to hate this team

But most fans who watched this team for years are not surprised. Our core was never about competing. In fact the players who were remotely competitive and had edge like Kadri, Kapanen and even AJ. We have managed to trade them away and have nothing to show for yet in this line up

You want to bring a Vet in? sure. Bring in a veteran like Spezza, who can play and healthy
Instead, we bring in 38 year in Marleau, who was never known to be competitive. Thornton, who is 41. I mean if you were bring in a 41 year old, why didn't you go after Chara?
We bring in Simmonds, poor guy who hasn't been fully healthy in 5 years. Average game played in betwen is about 35 a season
We trade for a guy who has been unhealthy all season and been in decline in Foligno
Nash, sure why not. He hasn't played 3 months and will be ready for game 1 in playoffs
Jimmy Vesey, a player who couldn't earn a spot in Buffalo. Allow that to sink in for a second

You wonder why this team is so hateable. I can honestly say I hate everything about this team. Which says alot, last 20 years I think I missed maybe 20 games
I love the logo, hate the team right now. We hated Dion Phaneuf, he would be an welcome addition to this team
Kessel, sure he was one dimensional, but whatever he was good at, he brought it to playoffs too

I will take a Kessel over a Marner anyday now
Click to expand...

lets not forget toronto also had to face boston twice, which went to the finals one of thsoe (and had chara twice, if i recall) years and washington who actually won the cup the year they beat toronto. its easy to cherry pick and say washington had some tough teams before they won. well so did toronto.
 
Gabriel426 said:
But Marner has not make an average player look good.
He is getting paid 11mil, he should be able to make players like Soup, Engvall, Gally, Kerfoot into 40pts players.
Pretty much anyone who played with AM became a 20 goals scorer.
How many players had career seasons playing with JT?
Click to expand...

Okay, so are you on the side where Marner should be able to drive his own line?
 
shortfuze said:
lets not forget toronto also had to face boston twice, which went to the finals one of thsoe (and had chara twice, if i recall) years and washington who actually won the cup the year they beat toronto. its easy to cherry pick and say washington had some tough teams before they won. well so did toronto.
Click to expand...

Yup and CBJ and Habs, two real tough teams. Excuses, excuses, excuses.
 
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There's a 99% chance Blake Coleman is going to sign with Dallas, so just leave him off you're off-season wishlist
 
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Why anyone who says they hate this team confounds the heck out of me. Why are you here? What are you gaining by simply bitching? Offer something that can be discussed, argued, laughed at, enjoyed, mocked...anything other than saying "I hate this team", are you a masochist? You hate a supposed friend, you bail. You don't like where you live, you move. Your job sucks, you look for a new one. Hanging around here must be so depressing for you, look for something that brings you happiness, it seems not to be here.
 
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shortfuze said:
Columbus was a tough team. They swept Tampa 2 years ago. You know, the eventual champs.
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Then why do these people who also say Marner is such an amazing player who helped Tavares and Matthews say Columbus and Montreal were bad teams? How many years can you use the excuse we ran into a hot goalie? We run into hot goalies because our high powered offensive players have become so damn predictable it's just too easy for other teams goalies. It's also sad how people watch Tampa Bay and then actually try and compare us to them when we're nothing alike. Tampa can compete with any team regardless of the style of game they play and we clearly cannot. Then we make excuses and blame the refs, playoff rulebook lol, hot goalies and try and throw blame everywhere else except on what was actually the problem.
 
ACC1224 said:
He hasn't played much with those players, has he?
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He hasn’t and that’s the problem.
That’s something I mentioned when the Leafs lost to BJs. The scoring depth on the team sucks and I was hoping Keefe would experiment splitting the 10mil plus boys in three lines. But Keefe didn’t even bother.
 
I think Dubas might trade a Kerfoot or a Dermott (Soup?) so we can have a few picks this draft lol
 
shortfuze said:
Columbus was a tough team. They swept Tampa 2 years ago. You know, the eventual champs.
Click to expand...

Off the top of my head the team that beat TB had and lost Panarin, Bob, Dzingel, and Duchene; Kutch got suspended and Hedman was hurt. The team that beat the Leafs could barely score a goal and yes, lost to TB the next round. That TB team learned from their loss to CBJ and acquired Maroon, Goodrow, Coleman, Bogozian, and Schenn.
 
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OVO16 said:
There's a 99% chance Blake Coleman is going to sign with Dallas, so just leave him off you're off-season wishlist
Click to expand...

Which probably means they keep Goodrow if they can find cap space. Maybe they LTIR Stammer or Vassy this year to make it happen.;)
 
LaPlante94 said:
Then why do these people who also say Marner is such an amazing player who helped Tavares and Matthews say Columbus and Montreal were bad teams? How many years can you use the excuse we ran into a hot goalie? We run into hot goalies because our high powered offensive players have become so damn predictable it's just too easy for other teams goalies. It's also sad how people watch Tampa Bay and then actually try and compare us to them when we're nothing alike. Tampa can compete with any team regardless of the style of game they play and we clearly cannot. Then we make excuses and blame the refs, playoff rulebook lol, hot goalies and try and throw blame everywhere else except on what was actually the problem.
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i dont know, go ask those people.

you wrote all that and didnt say what the problem is.

whos using excuses? they didnt just run into hot goalies. they ran into good teams. boston twice (who went to the finals 1 year), washington who won the cup and columbus who was a good team and swept tampa. i get it that its easy to lay blame on everything but people seriously need to take a break from this cesspool of a leafs section and go outside. if being a GM was so easy we would all do the job. nothing wrong with being dissapointed. people need to use a little common sense and realize that it takes as much luck as it does skill to win a cup. and sometimes, just sometimes it takes patience. ive watched quite a lot of hockey in 35+ years and trust me id rather watch this team then some of those shitty ass leafs teams in the past.
 
ToneDog said:
Off the top of my head the team that beat TB had and lost Panarin, Bob, Dzingel, and Duchene; Kutch got suspended and Hedman was hurt. The team that beat the Leafs could barely score a goal and yes, lost to TB the next round. That TB team learned from their loss to CBJ and acquired Maroon, Goodrow, Coleman, Bogozian, and Schenn.
Click to expand...
goes to show you how tough columbus was with those guys moving on. losing players for whatever reason is part of the game, unfortunately.
 
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