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Trades & Free Agency Thread - Still Too Soon Off-Season Edition

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Stephen said:
They're both bad contracts justified by pointing at each other, and built on the original sin of having to pay for Tavares on the UFA market.

In house though, Marner gives you the better bang for the buck from an offensive production POV, but again, we all know where he falls short.
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I disagree that Marner gives better bang for buck.

Marner has 0 pp goals in his last 72 games and 0 goals in his last 18 post-season games. There is more evidence that Marner rides the coat tails of his high scoring centers, rather than the other way around as both Tavares and Matthews have proved to be ppg players without elite linemates in the past (and without Marner).

The last time Marner played with non-elite linemates he was a 69 point player. Since before he signed his contract I've been saying I want to seen Marner play an extended time without Tavares and Matthews. We leaf fans have yet to see Marner lead his own line... he's always stitched to an elite goal scorer.

Play Tavares Matthews on a line together for a season.... I bet they put up 115 points each.
 
Antropovsky said:
I disagree that Marner gives better bang for buck.

Marner has 0 pp goals in his last 72 games and 0 goals in his last 18 post-season games. There is more evidence that Marner rides the coat tails of his high scoring centers, rather than the other way around as both Tavares and Matthews have proved to be ppg players without elite linemates in the past (and without Marner).

The last time Marner played with non-elite linemates he was a 69 point player. Since before he signed his contract I've been saying I want to seen Marner play an extended time without Tavares and Matthews. We leaf fans have yet to see Marner lead his own line... he's always stitched to an elite goal scorer.

Play Tavares Matthews on a line together for a season.... I bet they put up 115 points each.
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I get the frustration with Marner, but Marner played with Tavares his first season here and put up 47 goals, which is 9 more than his previous high. Then Marner gets paired with Matthews and he puts up 47 goals in 70 games. Maybe Marner is that good?
 
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showtime8 said:
I get the frustration with Marner, but Marner played with Tavares his first season here and put up 47 goals, which is 9 more than his previous high. Then Marner gets paired with Matthews and he puts up 47 goals in 70 games. Maybe Marner is that good?
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Great question.... I wondered the same, so I watched all Matthews goals this past year. What I take away from the highlights is that Matthews is an absolute beast of a player all by himself. He takes passes from any linemates, Holl, Rielly, Thornton, Tavares, Nylander and turns them into dangerous plays.

Do you watch these highlights and say wow Matthews wouldn't have scored nearly as much without Marner?

 
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Trade Kerfoot, Engvall, Dermott and Holl (For picks and cap-space)

Re-sign Nick Foligno
Re-Sign Zach Bogosian
Sign Barclay Goodrow
Sign Eric Haula
Sign Sean Kuraly
Sign Jani Hankanpaa

Foligno - Mathews - Marner
Goodrow - Tavares - Nylander
Mikheyev - Haula - Robertson
Kuraly - Spezza - Simmonds

Reilly - Brodie
Muzzin - Bogosian
Sandin - Hankanpaa
 
showtime8 said:
I get the frustration with Marner, but Marner played with Tavares his first season here and put up 47 goals, which is 9 more than his previous high. Then Marner gets paired with Matthews and he puts up 47 goals in 70 games. Maybe Marner is that good?
Click to expand...

Matthews scores 40 no matter who he plays with. Tavares career high in points only went up by 2 playing with Marner while Marners went up by nearly 30. Just think about it like this. If Marner had to carry a line with 2 other players who weren't the greatest do you think he looks as good? Tavares has done it his entire career. Matthews has shown he can score playing with anyone.
 
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Also Rumors that Colorado might dump Kadri...I think he's a great fit on the 3rd line.

Obviously, we have to be extra careful with him in the playoffs. I wonder if we can just do a deal around Kerfoot lmao
 
OVO16 said:
Also Rumors that Colorado might dump Kadri...I think he's a great fit on the 3rd line.

Obviously, we have to be extra careful with him in the playoffs. I wonder if we can just do a deal around Kerfoot lmao
Click to expand...

it worked so well the first time.
 
Antropovsky said:
Great question.... I wondered the same, so I watched all Matthews goals this past year. What I take away from the highlights is that Matthews is an absolute beast of a player all by himself. He takes passes from any linemates, Holl, Rielly, Thornton, Tavares, Nylander and turns them into dangerous plays.

Do you watch these highlights and say wow Matthews wouldn't have scored nearly as much without Marner?

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Not taking anything away from Matthews. I think he can score in a lot of different ways and spots on the ice.

But the narrative has been to crap on Marner for the last month or so. And all I'm trying to do is highlight the fact that he makes players around him better. I couldn't say one way or another if Matthews would have buried if he was playing with someone else.
 
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LaPlante94 said:
Matthews scores 40 no matter who he plays with. Tavares career high in points only went up by 2 playing with Marner while Marners went up by nearly 30. Just think about it like this. If Marner had to carry a line with 2 other players who weren't the greatest do you think he looks as good? Tavares has done it his entire career. Matthews has shown he can score playing with anyone.
Click to expand...

Or you can look at it like, Matthews career high in goals went up to 47 playing with Marner. And if Matthews didn't get injured or didn't get back to back shortened seasons, maybe we would be saying that Matthews would have been well over 50 and a lot of that thanks to Marner's playmaking ability.

I think you can have the conversation that Matthews is a very elite goal scorer & that he is a lot better with Marner on his wing. The 2 can be completely separate. Think about it like Ovechkin and Backstrom pairing. Would Ovi still score 40 goals a year playing with a 2nd line centre? Probably. Is he a lot better with Backstrom setting him up? Yeah.

The context is often negative because of the contract & playoff failures. But what often gets lost is how good of a player he is. The emotional side of being a fan is what really impacts our ability to like/dislike a player and how people choose to view him.
 
Barclay Goodrow is going to be overpaid after his exposure in Tampa and without basically replicating the dynamic that the TB 3rd line provides it's going to leave the Leafs (or another team) overpaying for a glorified "guy". He is a good fit on that line but multiple tiers below Gourde/Coleman.

If he is making an amount in the Engvall/Mikheyev range then he is a fine addition imo
 
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showtime8 said:
Not taking anything away from Matthews. I think he can score in a lot of different ways and spots on the ice.

But the narrative has been to crap on Marner for the last month or so. And all I'm trying to do is highlight the fact that he makes players around him better. I couldn't say one way or another if Matthews would have buried if he was playing with someone else.
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I get the point your trying to make...but watching Matthews goals in the video its hard to make the argument Matthews needs Marner or dirextly benefitted from him.
 
darrylsittler27 said:
Both will want raises The precedent has been set.
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I don't see how Andersen could ask for a raise when his past two seasons are .909 save% and 2.85 GAA and 0.895 and 2.96 GAA.

I still wouldn't mind having him back at 2.5m-3m, with a 52/30 type split with Campbell. I am not comfortable with just giving Campbell the net after one good season, there needs to be a goalie whose been a starter playing behind him in case his season isn't what we expect it to be.
 
I expect minimal turnover and us going at it with a similar squad once again.

Realistically:
Name 1 trade you expect the leafs to make.
Name 1-2 free agency signing we make.
Name which players get resigned.​

I'll go first -

Trade - Dermott traded for some picks.

Signings- Blake Coleman, Linus Ullmark

Re-Signings -
Forwards:
Hyman - No
Foligno - No
Galchenyuk - Yes, 1x1
R. Nash - No
Thornton - No, retires
Malgin - Yes, 750k 1 year.
Petan - No.
Noesen - Yes, 2way deal 1 year
Sabourin - No
Defence
Bogosian - Yes 1.5 x 1 year
Dermott- Traded
Hutton - No.
Rosen - No.
Duszak - Yes 2-way deal
Goalies
Andersen - No
Rittich - No
Woll - Yes, 2 year 2-way deal.
Vehivalainen - No.
 
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showtime8 said:
Or you can look at it like, Matthews career high in goals went up to 47 playing with Marner. And if Matthews didn't get injured or didn't get back to back shortened seasons, maybe we would be saying that Matthews would have been well over 50 and a lot of that thanks to Marner's playmaking ability.

I think you can have the conversation that Matthews is a very elite goal scorer & that he is a lot better with Marner on his wing. The 2 can be completely separate. Think about it like Ovechkin and Backstrom pairing. Would Ovi still score 40 goals a year playing with a 2nd line centre? Probably. Is he a lot better with Backstrom setting him up? Yeah.

The context is often negative because of the contract & playoff failures. But what often gets lost is how good of a player he is. The emotional side of being a fan is what really impacts our ability to like/dislike a player and how people choose to view him.
Click to expand...

Matthews had 14 goals in the 23 games Babcock coached that season and Babcock didn't play Marner with Matthews. Matthews was already well on pace to break his career high in goals that season when Babcock got fired. He literally stayed on this same pace even when Keefe put Marner on his wing so forgive me when I say I don't think Marner had this crazy impact to help Matthews get his career high in goals. Lets extend this to their last 2 playoff runs together. Matthews has 3 goals in 12 games against Columbus and Montreal. 2 teams people said weren't really playoff teams and were lucky because of the Covid stuff and what the league had to do. So we have this 11 million dollar playmaker on Matthews wing and he can only help Matthews get 3 goals? 1 powerplay goal btw in those 2 series which is even crazier. So his goal scoring in the regular season was already on a 50 goal pace even without Marner on his wing and then Marner gets put on his wing and that same pace keeps up. His playoff goal scoring though regresses when playing with Marner the last 2 years. How do we explain that?
 
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Mitch nylander said:
I expect minimal turnover and us going at it with a similar squad once again.

Realistically:
Name 1 trade you expect the leafs to make.
Name 1-2 free agency signing we make.
Name which players get resigned.​

I'll go first -

Trade - Dermott traded for some picks.

Signings- Blake Coleman, Linus Ullmark

Re-Signings -
Forwards:
Hyman - No
Foligno - No
Galchenyuk - Yes, 1x1
R. Nash - No
Thornton - No, retires
Malgin - Yes, 750k 1 year.
Petan - No.
Noesen - Yes, 2way deal 1 year
Sabourin - No
Defence
Bogosian - Yes 1.5 x 1 year
Dermott- Traded
Hutton - No.
Rosen - No.
Duszak - Yes 2-way deal
Goalies
Andersen - No
Rittich - No
Woll - Yes, 2 year 2-way deal.
Vehivalainen - No.
Click to expand...

You should have included who will Seattle take as well :)

Trade: Engvall for a crappy pick or two.
UFA signing: Chara
Expansion draft: Holl
Resignings: Foligno 3.0x1, Gally 1.2x1, mayyyyybe Thornton, Bogo 1.5x2, Dermott 2.0x3, Andersen 2.5x2 And probably some plugs like Malgin
 
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showtime8 said:
I get the frustration with Marner, but Marner played with Tavares his first season here and put up 47 goals, which is 9 more than his previous high. Then Marner gets paired with Matthews and he puts up 47 goals in 70 games. Maybe Marner is that good?
Click to expand...

They people that hate Marner will hate Marner .
They won't see the incredible talent that he is.
You can bitch about the contract but not the talent.
 
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