GDT: Trades & Free Agency -- Off-season edition

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ULF_55

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Yeah he's pretty bad to have around I guess. Should find a guys who doesn't like the contact and can do what Bertuzzi does to really do that rinse and repeat thing you're talking about.

He was brutal for almost half the season.

Winning isn't based on doing well.

It's based on outscoring your opponent.

The scoring wasn't there but that's probably a reason why he's not being priced out of TOR. Hopefully TOR can use the lack of scoring as leverage in negotiations

Yeah, he's coming in maybe low because ... he didn't accomplish ... but man look at that WOWYs.

Depends on whether you want success or an indicator of success.
 

LaPlante94

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Apr 12, 2011
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He was brutal for almost half the season.

Winning isn't based on doing well.

It's based on outscoring your opponent.



Yeah, he's coming in maybe low because ... he didn't accomplish ... but man look at that WOWYs.

Depends on whether you want success or an indicator of success.
New player on new team taking half the season to get comfortable with his role on the team. At least when he wasn't scoring he was doing things that helped his linemates get chances or score themselves.
 

thusk

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He got traded here in 2018/19 season and played 30 regular season games which is almost half the season. Plenty of time to learn the systems and we lose in 7 games to Boston and Muzzin played in all 7 games.

Year 2 he missed 3/5 games and we lose in 5. Again, this is against a team that had PLD as their leading scorer with 49 points in 70 games. Korpisalo or a rookie Merzlikins was their goalie. No excuses here even if Muzzin missed 3 games. Ekholm first season they swept a much better LA team and funny enough Korpisalo was the goalie for LA.

Year 3 he misses 1 game in a 7 game series against a team that wasn't a playoff team but only got a chance was because of Covid.

Year 4 which is the last time he really played hockey and might be his last time playing hockey ever he played all 7 games and we lose.

Muzzin is just as good as Ekholm and we made that trade like Edmonton did. Only difference is Edmontons stars have carried them to the 2nd round in the 1st season that trade was made and in year 2 they are 1 win away from going to the cup finals. The excuses are getting out of hand for this group, especially when trying to blame everywhere else. We have 3 guys who are making 11 million dollars plus and we really try and blame depth scoring, defence and goaltending because these players shutdown after game 3 every year. It doesn't matter where they play, any team that has 3 players being paid like a top 5-10 player and can't carry out of the 1st round after all these years is gonna be criticized and rightfully so.
a new player need half of season to feel comfortable in a new team. Look like that rule doean't work when doean't go in your side?!?!?!


he get injured in 2nd period of gm 6 vs mtl and it was the turning point of the series... Muzzin get injured and suddently a team who didn't score a single pp goal in 16 period... The 1st 2 pp they had after Muzzin injury ( #1 leafs player on PK) surprise 2 goal allowed... and who made the mistake on OT? the guy who took the biggest part of Muzzin responsabilities in Dermott.

PS in 2020 leafs was totally trash and would probably missed playoff if covid 19 didn't happenned... and they replaced Muzzin with Marincin just to show you how great leafs D was amaizing!!!
 
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Americanadian

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Keep in mind much of the audience is probably ignorant of what is going on, and spend their time doing useful endeavors and aren't here or browsing the web for this crap.

Such losers that know as much about free agency as paid failed journalists.
Shouldn't a journalist fill in those gaps for the average audience rather than suggesting the Leafs sign all the names they've heard of?
 

ULF_55

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New player on new team taking half the season to get comfortable with his role on the team. At least when he wasn't scoring he was doing things that helped his linemates get chances or score themselves.

I've heard that argument before.

Trade Deadline ... so we should be okay with players Leafs GM's over the years acquired because they need half a season to adjust?

We can't decide that we only hold players accountable when it suits our arguments right?

He was so frustrating to watch ... he had so many opportunities that he just flubbed.

I can see some giving him a second chance, and yeah maybe he actually earns his contract ... this upcoming season. Maybe based on Leafs overpays, he earned $5.5mm, but okay let's just blame it on Keefe ... like we do at work, in a joking manner, blame the guy who left.
 

Zero1

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Supposedly Jordan Schmaltz who's known for calling some things says the Leafs and Bertuzzi are looking at a 3yr x 4.75 million a year deal. If that's true at all, that would be some great work by Treliving.

I do that deal all day. I would even give him another year of term if the deal had little to no trade protection.
 
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thusk

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I've heard that argument before.

Trade Deadline ... so we should be okay with players Leafs GM's over the years acquired because they need half a season to adjust?

We can't decide that we only hold players accountable when it suits our arguments right?

He was so frustrating to watch ... he had so many opportunities that he just flubbed.

I can see some giving him a second chance, and yeah maybe he actually earns his contract ... this upcoming season. Maybe based on Leafs overpays, he earned $5.5mm, but okay let's just blame it on Keefe ... like we do at work, in a joking manner, blame the guy who left.

watch who had the most inpact amount player being trade at TDL, most of the time its player on a secondary role who just working hard.

but im agree i would not resign Bertuzzi too because honestly i think mcmann can bring similar thing at much lower price. you add knies who will play in top 6, cowan who will step in. Not sure if Toronto really need Bertuzzi anymore.

I would have an interest to resign Domi at the right price but not on Bertuzzi
 
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LeafSteel

GO LEAFS GO!!!
Mar 5, 2014
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Robertson-Holmberg-Dewar

Rielly-Roy
McCabe-Liljegren
Benoit-Chatfield/Desharnais

You’re welcome Treliving……. :)

Just having some fun folks.

No need to spazz out over likelihood, salary cap, and OMFG what about Cowan, Minten, and wutdidja-get-for-Marner-and-why-aren’t-they -in-the-lineup?????

Bored out of my tits and waiting for the Draft and UFA opening.

Cheers.
 
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LeafChief

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I like Robertson but don't think he's long for this organization. I wonder how a Robertson for Kaliyev deal would work out.
 

Americanadian

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One possibility for a Marner deal with futures involved is a prospect swap as a secondary trade similar to what Nashville did in the Ellis trade. Nashville traded Ryan Ellis for Nolan Patrick and Phillip Myers then flipped Patrick to VGK for Glass.

With there being rumors of Jiricek being unhappy in CBJ that could possibly be a target in prospect swap if a Marner deal is centered around futures. Jiricek appears to be having a monster (pun) playoffs for Cleveland with 3 goals/9 point in 9 games. He is currently playing in the conference finals.
 

Brobust

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Sep 29, 2017
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Yeah he's pretty bad to have around I guess. Should find a guys who doesn't like the contact and can do what Bertuzzi does to really do that rinse and repeat thing you're talking about.

Yeah, he was either snakebit or his teammates were flubbing prime net front chances that he was setting up.

Kind of a disaster season and he still put up some respectable numbers.
 

BertCorbeau

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My only concern with Bert is skating as he gets at the end of his prime and beyond.

He’s not a fast player and that can carry some risk in his effectiveness.

Re-upping Bert probably means the Robertson is moved though.
 
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LaPlante94

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Apr 12, 2011
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a new player need half of season to feel comfortable in a new team. Look like that rule doean't work when doean't go in your side?!?!?!


he get injured in 2nd period of gm 6 vs mtl and it was the turning point of the series... Muzzin get injured and suddently a team who didn't score a single pp goal in 16 period... The 1st 2 pp they had after Muzzin injury ( #1 leafs player on PK) surprise 2 goal allowed... and who made the mistake on OT? the guy who took the biggest part of Muzzin responsabilities in Dermott.

PS in 2020 leafs was totally trash and would probably missed playoff if covid 19 didn't happenned... and they replaced Muzzin with Marincin just to show you how great leafs D was amaizing!!!
Again, you're trying to say we couldn't beat a Columbus team who had PLD as their best forward and Seth Jones as their best d man because Muzzin only played half a season here.

Again, another series where we played a no playoff team but lucked out because of Covid and we still lose. Apparently Muzzin getting injured in Game 6 is why we lost after we had a 3-1 series lead. Guess what team only scored 6 goals in the final 3 games of that series. If you guess the team with the 11 million dollar players you would be correct.

We had 3 11 million dollar players that year in 2020. We have no excuses if we were to ever miss the playoffs. You're clearly failing to see the point that if you pay 3 players 11 million they should be able to carry you past bad teams in a playoff series. They can't carry us past bad teams or good teams. So why are we paying them?
 

LaPlante94

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Apr 12, 2011
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I've heard that argument before.

Trade Deadline ... so we should be okay with players Leafs GM's over the years acquired because they need half a season to adjust?

We can't decide that we only hold players accountable when it suits our arguments right?

He was so frustrating to watch ... he had so many opportunities that he just flubbed.

I can see some giving him a second chance, and yeah maybe he actually earns his contract ... this upcoming season. Maybe based on Leafs overpays, he earned $5.5mm, but okay let's just blame it on Keefe ... like we do at work, in a joking manner, blame the guy who left.
That's just how it is and why making a lot of moves at the TDL is a bad move. Bertuzzi went from playing on a team that was in your face and always attacking the net to a team that likes to play on the perimeter. Was also a big part of the PP net front and we don't use him there. Even though it wouldn't matter because again, we stay on the perimeter on the PP as well. One of the most important parts of the game is being able to retrieve pucks and that's exactly what he does and he does it very well.

You can easily blame it on Keefe. He doesn't know how to get the best out of all his players. Also having a lot of the players with different linemates all the time doesn't help.
 

Gabriel426

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Jun 30, 2015
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That's just how it is and why making a lot of moves at the TDL is a bad move. Bertuzzi went from playing on a team that was in your face and always attacking the net to a team that likes to play on the perimeter. Was also a big part of the PP net front and we don't use him there. Even though it wouldn't matter because again, we stay on the perimeter on the PP as well. One of the most important parts of the game is being able to retrieve pucks and that's exactly what he does and he does it very well.

You can easily blame it on Keefe. He doesn't know how to get the best out of all his players. Also having a lot of the players with different linemates all the time doesn't help.
He is so set in his mind that The LEAFS WILL WIN THE CUP WITH THE CORE and that it is the system from the coach and depth players that cause THE CORE not to perform.

Also Bert played on the PP1, where he really didn't with the Leafs b/c they team need to cater to the Forever student and his 11mil caphit, can't have him not get his PP points or it will look horrible....
 

horner

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May 22, 2007
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Joshua-Tavares-McMann
Robertson-Holmberg-Dewar

Rielly-Roy
McCabe-Liljegren
Benoit-Chatfield/Desharnais

You’re welcome Treliving……. :)

Just having some fun folks.

No need to spazz out over likelihood, salary cap, and OMFG what about Cowan, Minten, and wutdidja-get-for-Marner-and-why-aren’t-they -in-the-lineup?????

Bored out of my tits and waiting for the Draft and UFA opening.

Cheers.
What is the fascination with lindholm he is going to cost you 6 or 7 million dollars.
 
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meefer

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I guess I woke up a bit grumpy this morn, but I'm kinda siding with @LaPlante94 and the 3 11M can't push it over the line argument, which soon becomes 4 at 11M...shakes head in disgust.

Question: What do the following numbers represent?
18, 32, 53 and 95?

Answer: Where our best players sit on the list of P/60 in the playoffs over the last 5 seasons. Nylander 18th, Matthews 32nd, Marner 53rd and JT 95th.

ESP/60 last 5 playoffs: Willy sits 11th overall, Matthews 26th, 53rd for Marner (how's that for consistency?) and 99th for JT.

Of course there are 'reasons' why they've scored at such a poor rate. Really? Over a 5 year period? The 2nd highest paid player, soon to be the highest paid player, sitting at 32nd and 26th and there are reasons for this continuing disappointment? FFS, in G/60 over the past 5 playoffs the best goal scorer in the NHL sits in 64th place - behind JT for crying out loud (57th) - and there are reasons? MM and his sterling 192nd place position, reasons...really? Credit to Willy sitting in 9th place.

Of the 4 JT would be the obvious choice for me to move, but also the hardest to move not just because of his NT clause. I might try to convince him to go for 1 year and promise to bring him back at a lower cap hit, take one for the team JT, but it is hard to imagine.

MM falls into second place, and is the more probable candidate to be traded. It just hasn't worked here. In the playoffs he has been a failure for the TMLs, full stop. I know it's been discussed in this thread, but to my eyes if Chicago were willing I'd move him for Seth Jones + in a heartbeat. Use the 1.5M extra and Brodie's 5M and sign a RD of some quality. I don't care if it's Demelo, Roy, Montour, Pesce, pick your poison (I hesitate on Tanev due to age) and move on. A right side having Jones, one of the above, and Lily/Boosh/whomever, is better than anything I've seen in years. And heck, if you can do better than Jones +, by all means do it. But, please move MM.

Willy, Willy, Willy...what to do with Willy? 11.5M dollar/28 year old Willy. Signed until the 31/32 season is over Willy. IMO the most talented, overall, of the core 4 Willy. The guy who can pull me out of my seat better than the others, and who I suspect causes more coaching grey hairs than any of the others, Willy. People moaning about JT's contract and how it is tying the hands of the team today I think will be slitting their wrists when William's contract nears its end. To be fair (Letterkenny anyone) he's been our best playoff performer, which ain't saying much, but to be fair his results in the playoffs, especially at his expired contract number, have been good. But for me, not good enough to warrant 11.5M through 31/32. Yet, here we are. And for heavens sake, if there is anyone in the organization who thinks WN can play C, then give him the opportunity over an extended period of time, not this rinky dink shyte that we've witnessed. I think the hardest to move.

Leaving AM. Arguably, the finest player to wear the Maple Leaf crest, ever. Certainly, the finest goal scorer. But not in the playoffs relative to his regular season production. While I hugely admire his scoring ability, for me his defining moment as a player came during the Montreal series when he was grabbed from behind and manhandled behind the Montreal net (can't remember who it was, Savard?) and all he did was smile. Perhaps an unfair assessment of a player's future, but for me it was the moment I said to myself that this wasn't going to be the player to lead this team to a Cup. I just couldn't connect that reaction to that moment in time and come up with something that resembled a guy that could lead a team and that the team could rally around. I still don't see it. I'd trade him. Identify the best potential young C you can, on a team that would be attracted to what AM can offer, and make the change. As an example:

Matthews to LA for Kempe, Byfield, 1st, + ... adjust as required.

If LA could ever fix the head case that is PLD, their C depth would be frighteningly good. If they terminate or are able to trade him, it's still frightening, and minus Kempe's number, the resigning of Byfield, Clarke taking over from whatever Roy will be signing for this FA season, it's doable.

If the Leafs identify Byfield as a future #1C, grab him and sign him to a much friendlier deal than what Dubas offered the kids when they hit RFA status. Sign Lindholm and run with something like

Kempe Lindholm Nylander
McMann Tavares Jarnkrok
Knies Byfield Robertson/Cowan...I would expect that this line is sheltered, but eventually pushes to 2nd line status as the season progresses or by next season, with Cowan eventually earning the RW spot over Robertson whether this year or next.
I covet Jack McBain and would push hard to acquire him.
Minten McBain Dewar/Reaves...As Minten matures into what he should be, I can see him and McBain offering solid 3rd/4th line C value for many years to come.

Rielly Demelo
McCabe Jones
Benoit Liljegren

Talbot/Brossoit/Nedeljkovic
Woll
Jones/Murray

******

And while I'm at it, because I'm grumpier after having written this crap, I'd dangle the 2 1sts and whatever to Seattle if I could get Shane Wright. Moving forward, cost controlled C depth of Lindholm, Byfield (if he's the guy), Wright, McBain, Minten, ohh it is to dream.

Goddamit, why do I waste my time and yours, now I'm really grumpy. This fricken team.
 

Legion34

Registered User
Jan 24, 2006
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I would take klingberg/barrie back on short term 1 million dollar deals as 6D PP qb.

Might be easier to get 2 defensive D (Pesce. Roy. Demelo. Lub Tanev) then try to get into a bidding war on Montour.

I would look to try to move Lilly for Morgan frost. Assuming Marner is staying (just for this)

Bert. Matthews. Nylander
Knies. Frost. Marner
Robby Tavares. Mcmann
Dewar. Holmberg. Reeves

Reilly. Roy
McCabe. Tanev
Benoit. Klingberg

Woll
Brossoit

Could work
 
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