GDT: Trades & Free Agency -- Off-season edition

[Dion TheFluff]

looking at this past year, here is the amount of goals the Leafs and the teams in the conference finals got from their blueline.

TML - 17 goals
DAL - 36 goals
EDM - 48 goals
FLA - 36 goals
NYR - 44 goals

as others have stated in the thread its pretty easy to cover the forwards when your blueline isn't a threat to score at all.

Hopefully Tre can address this, this off-season with a guy like Montour or even Seth Jones who actually had pretty good underlying relative numbers on an awful Chicago team (especially if a bit was retained).

 

[Legion34]

looking at this past year, here is the amount of goals the Leafs and the teams in the conference finals got from their blueline.

TML - 17 goals
DAL - 36 goals
EDM - 48 goals
FLA - 36 goals
NYR - 44 goals

as others have stated in the thread its pretty easy to cover the forwards when your blueline isn't a threat to score at all.

Hopefully Tre can address this, this off-season with a guy like Montour or even Seth Jones who actually had pretty good underlying relative numbers on an awful Chicago team (especially if a bit was retained).

I would want jones for free if we are taking that hit. I just don’t see them doing it. They need players. And they don’t care about the cap.

Marner for jones would be terrible.

I honestly think buy low on klingberg as pp1 is an ok idea.

 

[BertCorbeau]

looking at this past year, here is the amount of goals the Leafs and the teams in the conference finals got from their blueline.

TML - 17 goals
DAL - 36 goals
EDM - 48 goals
FLA - 36 goals
NYR - 44 goals

as others have stated in the thread its pretty easy to cover the forwards when your blueline isn't a threat to score at all.

Hopefully Tre can address this, this off-season with a guy like Montour or even Seth Jones who actually had pretty good underlying relative numbers on an awful Chicago team (especially if a bit was retained).

I think part of this is it’s a systems thing .. Keefe likes to use the point men more as puck movers than shooters in the O zone. Rather than force low percentage shots to the net (even if there’s traffic), move it around to maintain possession and try to open up space down low for the forwards to get one.

Should be interesting to see if this changes under Berube

 

[Fogelhund]

I honestly think buy low on klingberg as pp1 is an ok idea.

You didn't see enough of him the first time around?

Gustafsson is the better idea.

 

[Fogelhund]

looking at this past year, here is the amount of goals the Leafs and the teams in the conference finals got from their blueline.

TML - 17 goals
DAL - 36 goals
EDM - 48 goals
FLA - 36 goals
NYR - 44 goals

as others have stated in the thread its pretty easy to cover the forwards when your blueline isn't a threat to score at all.

Hopefully Tre can address this, this off-season with a guy like Montour or even Seth Jones who actually had pretty good underlying relative numbers on an awful Chicago team (especially if a bit was retained).

Interesting, but understand that we outscored every one of those teams in the regular season.

Also note... the top eight teams with D scoring, were Colorado, Calgary, Carolina, Montreal, Edmonton, Ottawa, NYR and Detroit. Half the teams didn't even qualify for the playoffs.... So this isn't some stat, that is a predictor for success.

 

[TMLAM34]

To Toronto: Jakob Chychrun + Shane Pinto + OTT 2nd Rounder
To Ottawa: Mitch Marner

Saw this online, at first my thought was “hell no” but I’ve warmed up to the idea. It would be better if that 2nd was Detroit’s 1st instead.

 

[Legion34]

You didn't see enough of him the first time around?

Gustafsson is the better idea.

Gus left already. He wouldn’t come back. I don’t disagree that Gus at 1 mill would be better.

But a right shot consistent 10’goal ppqb in sheltered minute could work. He is primed for a 1 million prove it deal to make his money back in the spot light.

To Toronto: Jakob Chychrun + Shane Pinto + OTT 2nd Rounder
To Ottawa: Mitch Marner

Saw this online, at first my thought was “hell no” but I’ve warmed up to the idea. It would be better if that 2nd was Detroit’s 1st instead.

I would do that. Maybe batherson instead.

 

[Menzinger]

Interesting, but understand that we outscored every one of those teams in the regular season.

Also note... the top eight teams with D scoring, were Colorado, Calgary, Carolina, Montreal, Edmonton, Ottawa, NYR and Detroit. Half the teams didn't even qualify for the playoffs.... So this isn't some stat, that is a predictor for success.

I think it's not so much that leading the league in D scoring is a formula for success, but rather the Leafs being so bad at it has played a part in constraining their success.

If most of the time, 40% of the team's skaters on the ice at every given moment can't be relied on for any offense that's a big problem in a tight playoff series.

Imo getting more puck movement and mobility for the D needs to be a big priority from the front office

 

[thusk]

Again, you're trying to say we couldn't beat a Columbus team who had PLD as their best forward and Seth Jones as their best d man because Muzzin only played half a season here.

Again, another series where we played a no playoff team but lucked out because of Covid and we still lose. Apparently Muzzin getting injured in Game 6 is why we lost after we had a 3-1 series lead. Guess what team only scored 6 goals in the final 3 games of that series. If you guess the team with the 11 million dollar players you would be correct.

We had 3 11 million dollar players that year in 2020. We have no excuses if we were to ever miss the playoffs. You're clearly failing to see the point that if you pay 3 players 11 million they should be able to carry you past bad teams in a playoff series. They can't carry us past bad teams or good teams. So why are we paying them?

If you're thinking than playing with 2 Ahlers in your top 4 unstead of of real top 4 will not affect your team because you're having 3 11 players, it's not how it's working.

Tampa having a great team, since mcdonaugh is gone they strugggling and didn't look like the same and they still. They lost one key D and Vasilevskiy/and team defensively D became unable to get the job done and allowed 2X more goal... you can have the same kind impact in your offensive

 

[Dion TheFluff]

I think part of this is it’s a systems thing .. Keefe likes to use the point men more as puck movers than shooters in the O zone. Rather than force low percentage shots to the net (even if there’s traffic), move it around to maintain possession and try to open up space down low for the forwards to get one.

Should be interesting to see if this changes under Berube

when Berube won the cup, he got 46 goals from his blueline. Obviously need some personal change but maybe a more aggressive system could help with that as well to.

Interesting, but understand that we outscored every one of those teams in the regular season.

Also note... the top eight teams with D scoring, were Colorado, Calgary, Carolina, Montreal, Edmonton, Ottawa, NYR and Detroit. Half the teams didn't even qualify for the playoffs.... So this isn't some stat, that is a predictor for success.

no but was more so referring that it is far easier for good and well structured teams to shutdown our forwards when we only have 1 maybe 2 threats to be able to score from the backend.

 

[Menzinger]

I think part of this is it’s a systems thing .. Keefe likes to use the point men more as puck movers than shooters in the O zone. Rather than force low percentage shots to the net (even if there’s traffic), move it around to maintain possession and try to open up space down low for the forwards to get one.

Should be interesting to see if this changes under Berube

True though I'd still say personnel played a role, once Brodie fell off a cliff, McCabe was the second best puck mover on the team which wasn't ideal.

 

[thusk]

looking at this past year, here is the amount of goals the Leafs and the teams in the conference finals got from their blueline.

TML - 17 goals
DAL - 36 goals
EDM - 48 goals
FLA - 36 goals
NYR - 44 goals

as others have stated in the thread its pretty easy to cover the forwards when your blueline isn't a threat to score at all.

Hopefully Tre can address this, this off-season with a guy like Montour or even Seth Jones who actually had pretty good underlying relative numbers on an awful Chicago team (especially if a bit was retained).

exactly ehat i'm saying for years...Dman are here to create space for your foward, if they can be dangerous...your foward need to do the same thing with like 2x less space on the ice

Interesting, but understand that we outscored every one of those teams in the regular season.

Also note... the top eight teams with D scoring, were Colorado, Calgary, Carolina, Montreal, Edmonton, Ottawa, NYR and Detroit. Half the teams didn't even qualify for the playoffs.... So this isn't some stat, that is a predictor for success.

but in playoff you having less space... So if your def can get involve and create space to your foward, it will be harder to score than regular season. It's like your attacking a 3v5 all gane long

 

[SprDaVE]

I would want jones for free if we are taking that hit. I just don’t see them doing it. They need players. And they don’t care about the cap.

Marner for jones would be terrible.

I honestly think buy low on klingberg as pp1 is an ok idea.

Klingberg on a min cap hit for 1 year is a safe bet. That's about as high as I go for him though. But if you're willing to re-sign him to that, why not just keep/play Timmins?

Jones is a terrible idea regardless of the price it takes to acquire. His contract is an anchor and I don't think he'll ever live up to his deal. Chicago would need to add quite a bit for me to even start listening.

 

[darrylsittler27]

If Marner agrees to be traded im open to First rounders,2nds and top prospects in return. We have no picks in the draft next year, so for us, this is the final year of the build. Anything we draft next year wont make the team for 5 years at least. Finding good defensemen is hard and no one gives them away. We have to start growing our own. Pesche and Zadorv are two I think we can get and sign.

 

[rumman]

If Marner agrees to be traded im open to First rounders,2nds and top prospects in return. We have no picks in the draft next year, so for us, this is the final year of the build. Anything we draft next year wont make the team for 5 years at least. Finding good defensemen is hard and no one gives them away. We have to start growing our own. Pesche and Zadorv are two I think we can get and sign.

Agreed, if a top D amn or package of young quality players aren’t available I’d rather recoup picks that watch him walk for nothing, of course resigning him is the worst case scenario imo……..

 

[Menzinger]

While there's little risk with Klingberg on a one year ultra cheap deal, it still locks him into a starting roster spot that could potentially go to a much better player.

He looked shakey even when healthy last season....

 

[hamzarocks]

If we dont go after Saros then Gibson os a good target

Gibson@50% retained for our 2024 1st

At 3.2M gibson is more easy to hold and if he doesnt bounce back as expected he can still be dealt

If he bounces back, then he is a great starter to add

 

[Dreakmur]

Agreed, if a top D amn or package of young quality players aren’t available I’d rather recoup picks that watch him walk for nothing, of course resigning him is the worst case scenario imo……..

We can always swap those picks for players later.

 

[mydnyte]

Cant wait to hear the offseason stories
-Matthews puts on muscle
-JT has been working on his skating
-Marner is working on his shot

I think JT (at least at one point) led the team in burst speed breaks …or whatever that stupid stat is called

 

[Torontonian]

Glad people are starting to see the importance of having quality D-mans and not just the one dimensional play tough and hard and think you’ll win with a D-core like that, we been getting pieces like that for 3 years now.

Not saying you need all Cale Makars, but you need solid two way dman that can move the puck and do something in the o-zone when they get it.

Toronto in the Matthews era so far has done such a piss poor job of building a d-core.

 

[mydnyte]

I don’t resign Domi or Bert (and not Bert at all) until after we shore up the defence, because the top RHD that we need will not come cheap, it will be a bidding war.

 

[mydnyte]

Tre should really look to make a deal with the Blue Jackets and try to snag one of
Voronkov, Marchenko and/or Chinakhov even if it means taking a gamble on Elvis (he did look like a future #1 at one point, but the Jackets are a mess) though i’d rather Tarasov. Those 3 forwards are going to break out huge soon, and I’d love to ‘steal’ one or 2 of them in a deal.

 

[rumman]

We can always swap those picks for players later.

True that…….

 

[Fogelhund]

Gus left already. He wouldn’t come back. I don’t disagree that Gus at 1 mill would be better.

But a right shot consistent 10’goal ppqb in sheltered minute could work. He is primed for a 1 million prove it deal to make his money back in the spot light.



I would do that. Maybe batherson instead.

I had thought we chose to not sign him... but I can't find anything to support that now. It was clear then, and is still now, that we would have been better with him, than Klingberg though. Frankly, I would have kept Schenn too.... really good results with Morgan, especially in the playoffs... just weird. Schenn had a bad year though.... no guarantee that would have happened here though.

I don’t resign Domi or Bert (and not Bert at all) until after we shore up the defence, because the top RHD that we need will not come cheap, it will be a bidding war.

So much depends on if we move one of the Four forwards.... What cap space we will have, what comes back... It's just a massive unknown right now.

 

[Fogelhund]

Glad people are starting to see the importance of having quality D-mans and not just the one dimensional play tough and hard and think you’ll win with a D-core like that, we been getting pieces like that for 3 years now.

Not saying you need all Cale Makars, but you need solid two way dman that can move the puck and do something in the o-zone when they get it.

Toronto in the Matthews era so far has done such a piss poor job of building a d-core.

Balance man.... you need a bit of everything in your lineup. Not all small skill. Not all big grit. Hopefully some big skill too.... We never seem to strike a balance.