Trades and Free Agency Thread - Push all the chips in?

[Judas Tavares]

I've never been big on the Hall train and I've soured on Granlund. The Nashville neuter factor really gets me. What is it with that franchise and just wrecking forwards. Their top scorer in the past 14 years has had 64 points. I get a defensive brand of hockey but like cmon.

I just fear that Granlund will have been neutered so much he will just come here and be a guy that doesn't score or create enough, and defensively isn't what we really need. Like just a warm meh body.

 

[Fogelhund]

Arizona -> Stats -> Sort by Hits -> Christian Fischer

Make it happen Dubas

LOL

Those are a lot of hits... to go along with his ONE assist in 29 games, 39.4% CF and -9.4% Relative Corsi.

I mean, if you can't do anything useful in hockey, you might as well hit people.

 

[Dreakmur]

If Hall's value has taken a hit this bad. The Leafs definitely should be in on him.

I can see this guy flourish on a line with Matthews or Tavares.

Hall would drag those two lines down. They need muckers to work effectively, and that’s not Hall. If we wanted to use him on the third line, that would probably work pretty well.

Simmonds-Matthews-Marner
Hyman-Tavares-Nylander
Hall-Kerfoot-Mikheyev
Thornton-Engvall-Spezza

 

[LeafGrief]

You just need a good team for him. He didn't just stop being a good player. He's still producing shots and chances at pretty much elite levels. Sometimes, a bad situation is a bad situation and he's not producing goals or points like he should be. He literally carried the Devils to the playoffs in 17-18 and was by far their best player in that series, and then the following year he got injured for over 3/4 of the season.

This isn't to say he's going to be an MVP level player if/when acquired, but the way people talk about him is really bizarre. This is like Phil Kessel never being a Stanley Cup winner talk.

Maybe it is Kessel talk. If Hall ends up in a Leafs jersey, I will cheer for him. I'm certainly not basing this around too much logic. But I'm not really interested in paying for what he did when he shot the lights out 4 years ago. He was never that player before and hasn't been since. He's been worse and worse every season since he won the Hart and regardless of whether or not his injuries are what caused it, that's just not the player he is. I know that when I say he's got the loser smell it's pretty silly, but I can't help but feel people on the other side are just fixated on the Hart trophy to the point where they're ignoring that how he plays is still within his control. Sorry, but I'm not going to just ignore how he's played because Buffalo is a tire fire.

 

[Menzinger]

LMAO

If you can get Hall without a 1st or top prospect going the other way, you need to do it.

The guys a 1st line player still in his prime. Everyone looks terrible on Buffalo right now. I don't think it's necessarily indicative of who they are as players.

Hall's biggest problem is that he was drafted by a putrid Oilers organization and then played for a lousy Devil's (and now Sabres) team. It's not as if he was the GM of those teams too. A good player can only do so much in a terrible situation

 

[Martin Skoula]

If you can get Hall without a 1st or top prospect going the other way, you need to do it.

The guys a 1st line player still in his prime. Everyone looks terrible on Buffalo right now. I don't think it's necessarily indicative of who they are as players.

Hall's biggest problem is that he was drafted by a putrid Oilers organization and then played for a lousy Devil's (and now Sabres) team. It's not as if he was the GM of those teams too. A good player can only do so much in a terrible situation

His fitness and conditioning is 100% under his control and it's clear he hasn't taken it seriously this year. The guy has clearly lost a step, whether that's from his knee injuries, lack of effort in the gym, or just half assing it on the ice doesn't really matter to me that much.

He's still worth looking at if he comes cheap and doesn't have an ego about his spot in the lineup, but it's not 100% Buffalo making him look bad right now.

 

[aingefan]

I wouldn’t mind seeing Hall acquired for a first (maybe conditional on games played or something), so long as the Leafs don’t have to pay the assets for the needed double retention .

 

[Marshy]

I watched the Sabres-Pens game last night and it wouldn't surprise me if Buffalo was thinking of paying the double retention assets.

 

[4thline]

TSN also said basically everyone on Arizona is available

Freddy+? for Raanta @50% + (if we want a depth player)

If the deal was done today it saves us ~1.1million in absolute value cap (3-4 in deadline cap), and because of the bonus structure of each is essentially dollar neutral for the Yotes.

Andersen remaining- 38.8% of 5m cap, 1m salary = 1.94m cap / 388k salary
Raanta remaining- 38.8% of 4.25m cap, 2m salary= 1.65m cap / 776k salary

Aftermath
Yotes- Andersen+ 50% Raanta =2.765m cap / 776k salary
Leafs- 50% Raanta = 825k cap / 338k salary

Only questions are
Is there anything else Arizona has that we want?
How does Arizona value dollar less cap space?
Is there a way for us to take back non-cap money to make the deal cash for cap space?

 

[aingefan]

I watched the Sabres-Pens game last night and it wouldn't surprise me if Buffalo was thinking of paying the double retention assets.

He’s buddies with some of the team, could conceivably be the third wheel on his line.
Less pressure, maybe helps him go off.
Get Ullmark in there....Freddy maybe?

 

[Puckstuff]

Freddy+? for Raanta @50% + (if we want a depth player)

If the deal was done today it saves us ~1.1million in absolute value cap (3-4 in deadline cap), and because of the bonus structure of each is essentially dollar neutral for the Yotes.

Andersen remaining- 38.8% of 5m cap, 1m salary = 1.94m cap / 388k salary
Raanta remaining- 38.8% of 4.25m cap, 2m salary= 1.65m cap / 776k salary

Aftermath
Yotes- Andersen+ 50% Raanta =2.765m cap / 776k salary
Leafs- 50% Raanta = 825k cap / 338k salary

Only questions are
Is there anything else Arizona has that we want?
How does Arizona value dollar less cap space?
Is there a way for us to take back non-cap money to make the deal cash for cap space?

This makes a lot of sense, he's better and cheaper then Freddie and he's also a UFA. The analytics on this guy are good too.

For Arizona they get a cheaper goalie in actual dollars and we will be able to give them a future player ranging from a 2nd to a top 5-10 prospect not named Lilly, Sandin or Robertson or Amirov.

Andersen + 2nd would be ideal.

 

[Fogelhund]

Freddy+? for Raanta @50% + (if we want a depth player)

If the deal was done today it saves us ~1.1million in absolute value cap (3-4 in deadline cap), and because of the bonus structure of each is essentially dollar neutral for the Yotes.

Andersen remaining- 38.8% of 5m cap, 1m salary = 1.94m cap / 388k salary
Raanta remaining- 38.8% of 4.25m cap, 2m salary= 1.65m cap / 776k salary

Aftermath
Yotes- Andersen+ 50% Raanta =2.765m cap / 776k salary
Leafs- 50% Raanta = 825k cap / 338k salary

Only questions are
Is there anything else Arizona has that we want?
How does Arizona value dollar less cap space?
Is there a way for us to take back non-cap money to make the deal cash for cap space?

Raanta has been injured three times this year, with LBI (x2) UBI (x1). It seems to be happening a lot this year, not sure if this is Covid time off related with goalies. He is currently week to week. I don't mind Raanta... just not sure on his health.
Ullmark is practising with Buffalo right now, and has a lower cap hit.

Hall + Ullmark (both 50% retained) for Andersen + 1st, + B/C prospect Reduces our Cap by $176,000

If you went this route, I think you'd hope that you could resign Ullmark.

 

[MrGroove]

If Hall does join leafs, similar scenario occured with Gaborik to Kings (for 2nd,3rd and Frattin) That worked out well for them on their cup run.
Also keep in mind that Hall is wearing #4. which he wore in edmonton. he would’ve worn 9 but Jack has that number. Jersey numbers play a role for many players psychologically. Look at Nylander...Even go back and see how Gilmour reversed his #39 to 93 in Toronto and broke records!
Hall’s MVP year he wore 9. On the coyotes he wore 91. Here he won’t be able to wear 4,9 or 91 here. I see him picking something with a 9 maybe 90 or 98! Of course he could pick 67 as that was our last cup year...

 

[ToneDog]

If you can get Hall without a 1st or top prospect going the other way, you need to do it.

The guys a 1st line player still in his prime. Everyone looks terrible on Buffalo right now. I don't think it's necessarily indicative of who they are as players.

Hall's biggest problem is that he was drafted by a putrid Oilers organization and then played for a lousy Devil's (and now Sabres) team. It's not as if he was the GM of those teams too. A good player can only do so much in a terrible situation

Don't think Friedman included retention so it could be a first or a top prospect IMO.

 

[Judas Tavares]

I just find it funny that Hall can still be adored for what he did 3 years ago but Matthews can go on a 5-game goalless drought and be washed based on hockey fan logic.

 

[Marshy]

Hall has 14 playoff games to his resume over 2 playoffs -- both pretty recently.

Pretty good performer with 12 points.

6 points in 5 games in 2018 in NJ.
6 points in 9 games in 2020 in AZ.

 

[4thline]

I just find it funny that Hall can still be adored for what he did 3 years ago but Matthews can go on a 5-game goalless drought and be washed based on hockey fan logic.

If you're meaning from a Leaf fan perspective, I can't speak to idiots souring on Matthews but personally I see Hall less as being "adored" and more as being an opportunistic potentially high reward move, kind of like a super galchenyuk

Gally-
Best case- returns to peak, borderline 1st line F
Middle case- serviceable top 9 forward
Worst case- depth tweener

Price paid- fair for a depth tweener

Hall
Best case- returns to peak, MVP level
Middle case- top line forward
Worst case- top 6 forward

Price being discussed- fair for a top 6 forward rental

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[Ziggdiezan]

Have the leafs been accruing cap space this year with all the LTIRs they have been using?

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I wouldn't be surprised if someone claims him. Not a bad 7th defenseman, is still relatively young, and is cheap.

 

[Twine Tickler]

Carlo Coliacovo mad a good point on Leafs Lunch today. Buffalo parted ways with players like ROR and Bogo and most NHL fans at the time were writing both of those players off. Both contributed heavily to their teams Stanley Cup run's, especially ROR who won the conn smythe. we cannot write off BUF player because their team is dogshit.

They are the team I'd like to exploit if possible. Their players could not be lower in value. The idea that Taylor Hall's value has dipped below a 1st rounder is banana's. I am not even a pro Taylor Hall guy, but that's f***ing ridiculous. Guy hasn't forgotten how to play, he has played on horrible teams his whole career. I'd be all over this if that is the current price

 

[Amadeus]

Carlo Coliacovo mad a good point on Leafs Lunch today. Buffalo parted ways with players like ROR and Bogo and most NHL fans at the time were writing both of those players off. Both contributed heavily to their teams Stanley Cup run's, especially ROR who won the conn smythe. we cannot write off BUF player because their team is dogshit.

They are the team I'd like to exploit if possible. Their players could not be lower in value. The idea that Taylor Hall's value has dipped below a 1st rounder is banana's. I am not even a pro Taylor Hall guy, but that's f***ing ridiculous. Guy hasn't forgotten how to play, he has played on horrible teams his whole career. I'd be all over this if that is the current price

Hall is not a bad player but the stench of losing has followed him pretty much everywhere. He's not a consistent taking the charge player and probably not worth the cost.

I still see a lot of potential with Rasmus Ristolainen though. He's got all the tools. With the right coaching and development, he can be a top 4 RHD.

 

[SHANNYPLAN]

Leafs - Flames - Red Wings
Leafs In: Sam Bennet (750k ret)
Leafs Out: Nick Petan, 2nd & 4th

Flames In: Nick Petan & 2nd
Flames Out: Sam Bennett

Red Wings In: Leafs 4th
Red Wings Out: 750k Ret

Leafs - Kings
Kurtis MacDermid
For
Calle Rosen & Mac Hollowell

Bennett - Matthews - Marner
Nylander - Tavares - Simmonds
Mikheyev - Engvall - Hyman
Thornton - Kerfoot - Spezza
Robertson - Galchenyuk - Sabbourin

Rielly - Brodie
Muzzin - Holl
Dermott - Bogosian
MacDermid - Liljigren

 

[mydnyte]

If you're meaning from a Leaf fan perspective, I can't speak to idiots souring on Matthews but personally I see Hall less as being "adored" and more as being an opportunistic potentially high reward move, kind of like a super galchenyuk

Gally-
Best case- returns to peak, borderline 1st line F
Middle case- serviceable top 9 forward
Worst case- depth tweener

Price paid- fair for a depth tweener

Hall
Best case- returns to peak, MVP level
Middle case- top line forward
Worst case- top 6 forward

Price being discussed- fair for a top 6 forward rental

people think Hall is elite, really?

since 2018-19
Gally
GP = 141
Goals = 28

Hall
GP = 129
Goals = 29

 

[Twine Tickler]

Hall is not a bad player but the stench of losing has followed him pretty much everywhere. He's not a consistent taking the charge player and probably not worth the cost.

I still see a lot of potential with Rasmus Ristolainen though. He's got all the tools. With the right coaching and development, he can be a top 4 RHD.

In fairness to Hall, he has had to be "The Guy" on every team he has played for. If not the #1, He is expected to be the #2. Similar to Kessel when he was in TO, It was always too steep of a task for him to carry the team, and up until the day he was traded, he as well was kind of a loser. Gets dealt, becomes a complimentary sniper and excels. Even getting real consideration for Conn Smythe on one of the runs. Hall would be our 5th best forward. He would be in a very similar spot as Phil, and for the first time in Taylor's career he would be relied on to be a secondary scorer. Not a primary goal scorer. Again, if that price that Elliot is reporting is true...I'd throw a 1st and a B-Level Prospect for 50% retention and find some other way to make the remaining money work. Really is a no brainer at that point IMO