Trades and Free Agency - 2022-23 Season Edition

[ACC1224]

Is this a trade thread or a Liljegren thread ? Also we can’t add Timo while keeping our core 4 together so why keep bringing it up? It’s not gonna happen

Amen to that.
A player who is pretty much on the untouchable list, shouldn't even be mentioned in this thread.

 

[Grinner]

Do you think you'll get anywhere near value for someone that everybody knows you can't keep? As I said, how much are you willing to spend on a short rental?

Many of the teams that seem to be in on Meier are looking at him long term. So if you want Meier you still need to out bid those teams

 

[Martin Skoula]

you'd swap william for meier for a measily 1.5M?

Why?

Much rather keep Nylander in a vacuum but if we don’t go deep it won’t be Dubas making the trade and the goodwill he built up with Nylander won’t be worth anything for keeping him out of a UFA bidding war.

Meier at 8.5x8 + multiple 1sts worth of value from a Nylander trade vs Nylander at 10+ would be hard to turn down for a new GM looking to make his mark. Ideally we make the conference finals at least, Dubas stays, and Nylander signs for 9 for a guy that’s gone to bat for him and kept his word on not trading him.

 

[4thline]

There are rumors that Conor Garland might be getting bought out in the summer.
His buyout structure is around 800k for the next two years and then $1.89M until 2030.
Ask the Canucks to retain around $1.8M and you would have a better version of Kerfoot.
Place him to be the offensive driver on the third line and I think you could unlock Engvall's offensive potential (dude is getting no help). Not to mention, Garland is solid defensively.



I wouldn't want him to be my only upgrade, but it's a decent move I think.

Missed this post earlier. Solid outside of the box thinking.

 

[Judas Tavares]

Not having a 2023 2nd is a bit tough. I could see a lot of prices being a 2023 2nd + B prospect. Without it you may need to upgrade to a 1st or better prospects or multiple picks.

It was worth it to get Gio but there have been a few too many extra picks out the door of late....

 

[nuck]

First, I'd much rather keep Willy than Meier.

Second, if you are only keeping one or the other past this year, regardless of which, you are really looking at a rental for the remainder of this season, and how much are you willing to give up for that?

His only value to anyone is as a rental because he isn't a $10M player. However Willie isn't either but they don't know his expectations so the trade off might be predicated on how much less than Nylander Meier can be re-signed for or if Willie even wants to extend this summer vs hit the market as a UFA.

He is a different style from Willie which may impact a desire to keep him as may Willie's value on the trade market next summer. And of course the cost to acquire trumps all. In terms of how much they might be willing to give up, whats a Stanley Cup worth? More than what Horvat cost the Isles and Meier is likely to be less than Horvat.

I don't expect them to acquire him, but Meier would create options next summer with how much they are willing to let Nylander's camp knock them around at the negotiation table. The mere presence of Meier on the club takes away some of Nylander's leverage. I definitely don't see them costing similar money and TM would be cheaper to sign as a Leaf than as a UFA. However if they actually won then I think KD moves heaven and earth to create a "big 5".

 

[leafsfan5]

You're reaction just show exactly what i said... yes he had been good, most of the time on a 3rd pair as 5th a was able to raise his game to play a top 4 role when peiple get injured... its exactly what you're expecting from an excellent 5th.

Like you're talking, you're look like a guy considerating himself smarter than keefe and leafs coach


Wheres liljegren should be better, because hes get better stats from athletic?

It is possible tha playing with AM, marner, JT, nylander helping you to get better offensive stats than suzuli, caufield, dvorak, anderson, hoffman or whatever?

It is possible playing with same player who are pretty great defensivly helping you to look better defensivly

It is possible than getting more puck possession will raise both of offensive and defensive stats bybplay more offensive situation and less defrnsive one?

It is possible than playing a lot against player like bergeron, crosby or whatever big part of the season vs few time, it is possible that will affect both of your offensive and defensive stats?

If you still considerate romanov is also 1 year younger... seriously tell me where liljegren should better playing with by a far a better team, against weaker opposition and most easier situation 1 year older...

When i said liljegren is the most overrated leafs player, its an other excellent exwmple of it

Timothy Liljergen stats when playing with David Kampf (165 minutes of 5v5 action):
GF - 5
GA - 0
xGF%: 50.75% (which is an increase on Kampf's xGF of 49%, so he gets better with Lilly)

Timothy Liljergen stats when playing with Alex Kerfoot (153 minutes of 5v5 action):
GF - 5
GA - 3
xGF%: 58.57%

Timothy Liljergen stats when playing with Pierre Engvall (139 minutes of 5v5 action):
GF - 5
GA - 2
xGF%: 60.90%

So when he's playing with our main bottom 6 guys he still dominates in both actual production and xGF%. How could this be?!

 

[kb]

Meier scenario 2

Timo gets 8.5, Samsonov 5, Holmberg and Timmins 1.1 each, Knies 950k
Murray traded, 21 man roster.

Meier-Matthews-Nylander
Knies-Tavares-Marner
xxx-yyy-Jarncrok
McMann-Holmberg-xxx

Rielly-Brodie
Sandin-Liljegren
Gio-Timmins
xxx

Samsonov
Woll

xxx's 800k apiece
The yyy at 3C - as much as 4.2m.

It's very easy to get lost in "5 forwards making 49", without stopping to consider that 5 forwards is almost half the F group, and that it translates into "7 forwards making 55.1" by adding a 4m 3C plus Jarncrok. That leaves 5 budget players.

For comparison
2022 Colorado - Cogliano (1m) O'Connor (725) Newhook (ELC) Aube-Kubel (1m) Sturm (725), Helm making almost 4 but overpaid, next contract 1m
2021 Tampa - Colton (700), Goodrow (925), Maroon (900k), Coleman at 1.9
2020 Tampa- replace Colton with Paquette
2019 St. Louis - Sundqvist (700), Maroon (1.75), Barbashev (741/ ELC), Thomas (ELC), Blais (ELC)
2018 Washington - Beagle (1.75), Connolly (1.5), Vrana (ELC), Smith-Pelley (650), Stephenson (650), Chiasson (660)
2017 Pittsburgh - Guentzel (ELC), Sheary (ELC), Rust (640), Wilson (625), Rowney (612) (plus Bonino and Fehr at ~2m each)
2016 Pittsburgh - Sheary (ELC), Rust (640), Kuhnakl (525), Cullen (800) (plus Bonino and Fehr at ~2m each)

Again the issue is that you are including players on the Leafs roster the players that SJ would require in a deal like Knies and Holmberg. Depth will be gone.

What is being traded to SJ? Remember the SJ ask is for a first, a top prospect, and 2 B+ prospects. In Leaf terms, since the 1st is going to be so low, it will cost the Leafs at least their top 3 prospects. That may not even be able to get it done.

 

[4thline]

Again the issue is that you are including players on the Leafs roster the players that SJ would require in a deal like Knies and Holmberg. Depth will be gone.

What is being traded to SJ? Remember the SJ ask is for a first, a top prospect, and 2 B+ prospects. In Leaf terms, since the 1st is going to be so low, it will cost the Leafs at least their top 3 prospects. That may not even be able to get it done.

And both addressed in follow up posts. 1st+Minten+Niemela+ gives us a shot at not including those. And if we do, I have faith in replacing them as the budget pieces.

What are your thoughts on the bottom half of the post? All of those teams left crippled by relying on cheap depth

 

[Apex Predator]

The only way Leafs get Timo is if Dubas is going all in and doesn’t care about next season. He will figure it out if he’s still around.

I think Dubas is thinking like he will be here next year thus I don’t think Timo is a realistic target.

 

[Warden of the North]

Worried about Knies future with the Leafs at this point.

 

[ULF_55]

Enough with the Liljegren discussion in this trade thread.

 

[Namikaze Minato]

I WANT TO TRADE LILJEGR......

oh okay, nevermind.

 

[ER89]

Much rather keep Nylander in a vacuum but if we don’t go deep it won’t be Dubas making the trade and the goodwill he built up with Nylander won’t be worth anything for keeping him out of a UFA bidding war.

Meier at 8.5x8 + multiple 1sts worth of value from a Nylander trade vs Nylander at 10+ would be hard to turn down for a new GM looking to make his mark. Ideally we make the conference finals at least, Dubas stays, and Nylander signs for 9 for a guy that’s gone to bat for him and kept his word on not trading him.

solid reasoning.

 

[ToneDog]

Not holding my breath for Timo, Kane, Toews, Jenner, Buch, ROR, Tank. My target would be Crouse (if cost is reasonable) and/or Bertuzzi (if cost is less than a second).

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

I wonder if the Leafs will try to add Nyquist as an under the radar type addition. Just like Nash was, he's out until the playoffs start and therefore has no impact on the cap. The difference being that Nyquist is a way better player than Nash was

 

[thusk]

Timothy Liljergen stats when playing with David Kampf (165 minutes of 5v5 action):
GF - 5
GA - 0
xGF%: 50.75% (which is an increase on Kampf's xGF of 49%, so he gets better with Lilly)

Timothy Liljergen stats when playing with Alex Kerfoot (153 minutes of 5v5 action):
GF - 5
GA - 3
xGF%: 58.57%

Timothy Liljergen stats when playing with Pierre Engvall (139 minutes of 5v5 action):
GF - 5
GA - 2
xGF%: 60.90%

So when he's playing with our main bottom 6 guys he still dominates in both actual production and xGF%. How could this be?!

You can say everything with stats without taking in consideration every part of the game... those stats still incomplete...

Against who he was playing when he played with those guy? 1st, second, 3rd or 4th line

When he was playing with those player the most exemple : when the team leading by 3+ goal is not the same than when they was trailing

Where? In an offensive faceoff, better chance to have great number than in a defensive faceoff...

Just some exemple

Its the reason why every team paying people to have their own avanced stats...

The answer you need talk about, despite every stats around liljegren until beggining of last season, why leafs still not fully confident in lilly? And please dont tell me its because the whole organisation are just stupis.

 

[PROUD PAPA]

I wonder if the Leafs will try to add Nyquist as an under the radar type addition. Just like Nash was, he's out until the playoffs start and therefore has no impact on the cap. The difference being that Nyquist is a way better player than Nash was

He's awful in the playoffs. The price would have to be very low.

 

[Warden of the North]

Friedman thinks Philly is getting ready to move JvR.

Any interest if the price is negligible? I hadn't really thought about him much but could he be a fit as a middle 6 LW? UFA this summer

 

[showtime8]

This thread should only be about trading for Jake McCabe and Taylor Raddysh.

You kill 2 birds with one stone.

You get a really quality depth winger, who has scored 14 goals this year, played 28 games for the Soo Greyhounds and on a contract for under 800k for this year and next year.

You also get a quality top 4 defenseman who can solidify playing beside L*****n and you lock him in for the next couple years (this year +2).

Friedman thinks Philly is getting ready to move JvR.

Any interest if the price is negligible? I hadn't really thought about him much but could he be a fit as a middle 6 LW? UFA this summer

Can't skate well enough for what this team is built on. Isn't physical enough to play on the 3rd line. I don't see it.

 

[notdoneyet]

To Toronto: Pavel Buchnevich + Noel Acciari

To St. Louis: 2023 1st Round Draft Pick + Alex Kerfoot + Nick Robertson + Fraser Minten


Bunting - Matthews - Marner
Buchnevich - Tavares - Nylander
Engvall - Acciari - Jarnkrok
Aston Reese - Kampf - Holmberg

Rielly - Liljegren
Sandin - Brodie
Giordano - Holl

Samsonov - Murray

Still only 2 scoring lines
In order for us to win the cup this year we need three scoring lines

 

[jaric1862]

This thread should only be about trading for Jake McCabe and Taylor Raddysh.

You kill 2 birds with one stone.

You get a really quality depth winger, who has scored 14 goals this year, played 28 games for the Soo Greyhounds and on a contract for under 800k for this year and next year.

You also get a quality top 4 defenseman who can solidify playing beside L*****n and you lock him in for the next couple years (this year +2).



Can't skate well enough for what this team is built on. Isn't physical enough to play on the 3rd line. I don't see it.

I 100% agree with you on this trade. Makes a lot of sense.

I wouldn’t mind if the forward in the trade was Domi or Lafferty either.

 

[SprDaVE]

Friedman thinks Philly is getting ready to move JvR.

Any interest if the price is negligible? I hadn't really thought about him much but could he be a fit as a middle 6 LW? UFA this summer

My interest wouldn't be high at all, even at 50%-75% retention.

 

[notdoneyet]

Again the issue is that you are including players on the Leafs roster the players that SJ would require in a deal like Knies and Holmberg. Depth will be gone.

What is being traded to SJ? Remember the SJ ask is for a first, a top prospect, and 2 B+ prospects. In Leaf terms, since the 1st is going to be so low, it will cost the Leafs at least their top 3 prospects. That may not even be able to get it done.

2024 first
Niemela
Abramov
Anderson

 

[stickty111]

SOURCE: Sharks Want 3 Pieces for Meier?

What do the San Jose Sharks want in a trade for Timo Meier? It sounds like three pieces. “What I’m hearing is a first-rounder — and one Grade-A or two Grade-B prospects, or one good prospect and a young, established NHL player,” a source from outside the San Jose Sharks organization told San...

sanjosehockeynow.com

“What I’m hearing is a first-rounder — and one Grade-A or two Grade-B prospects, or one good prospect and a young, established NHL player,” a source from outside the San Jose Sharks organization told San Jose Hockey Now.

So our packages would be in this scenario

1st+ Knies, 1st + Minten and Niemela
Or
Niemela/Minten +Sandin/Liljegren

It's tough but I would do the 1st, Minten + Niemela package
Or the Niemela/Minten package along with Sandin
Other teams can beat it but we can be absolutely be in play if thats the rumored ask. Cap is doable as others mentioned