Speculation: Trade Rumor/Speculation Thread XXIII: Getcha' pitchforks ready.

[darko]

Vanek's a lot younger than both Jagr and Iginla. Last year's playoffs Jagr was having a real problem keeping up. Iginla is not nearly the player he used to be. Pens missing Dupuis--Vanek slots right in on Crosby's line. Don't see the problem there. Keep in mind that when you get a goal scorer like Vanek--your main competition doesn't get him. Vanek's a legit 1st line player. Whoever trades for him will find a spot--there will probably be holes to fill with what goes back to the Isles.

Didn't even realise he played in the series against Rangers last season until like half way through. Total non factor.

 

[NYR Viper]

Stewart has one year left on his contract after this year. It's like kicking the can down the road for us and he has every reason to be motivated next year because he'll be playing for his next contract. We may have the same situation next year moving him.

And that would be fine if you can get assets with him. Like I said, it allows for another year of development for players like Miller, Fast and Kristo. If he plays well, keep him. If not, there will be teams interested.

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

The more I think about it, the more comfortable I become with a deal like Chris Stewart + for Callahan.

Stewart comes in and plays 2/3RW, add's size which this team needs desperately and some bite to the forward corps. He is not a consistent player but he has an underrated shot and he knows how to score goals which this team will also need. He is a good skater as well which will fit this system.

I am hopeful they could pull out a good young prospect like Schmaltz/Vanelli + a pick, maybe Edmonton's 2nd from the Pajaarvi deal in the off-season.

See how Stewart plays. If he plays well, he can be looked at to re-sign. If not, then you have yet another asset to move next year while giving the younger players like Fast, Miller and Kristo more time to develop either in the AHL or with a bit more sheltered minutes.

It's a deal for both the current and the future.



Turning to the Girardi deal, I think Anaheim makes the most sense from the teams rumored. They have a ton of forward prospects either close to, or in the NHL currently. Etem, Rakell, Noesen, Friberg, Kerdiles and they have a good, young puck moving prospect in Theodore. Palmieri is already in the NHL and would be a solid addition as well.

Something like:

Etem/Rakell + Theodore + 1st

They add (2) pieces that look to be on their ways to having NHL futures + a pick that should as well in the 1st. Unless Vatanen is available, which I HIGHLY doubt, this makes sense.

If he is available:

Vatanen + forward prospect/1st

I agree with your premise. All of this is lightyears better than losing either of them for nothing, which is possible due to injury or the unwillingness of other teams to pay up. On one hand I want as much as possible for either of these two players because god damit they are tough, homegrown gamers. Something this team was starved for a decades time. We finally got a few and are about to trade all of them away. I want some ****ing substance in return.

Reading that Cally is 99% gone is tough to swallow. While im not deluded as to what his true skill set is, he's still our Captain and theres a reason for that. I just hope what the Rangers get back for him is enough to make me feel satisfied.

Girardi is another story. I dont think itll be difficult getting fair or great return for him, but the hole thats left will rear its ugly head soon after. This guy has quietly gone about his business for years and as much as he is revered here, he is also under appreciated. If the Rangers know they have to let both of them go they need to formulate a plan around that as a package for the future. And they need deliver on that with precise foresight. Personally i think Girardi will be re-signed and should be.

 

[Larrybiv]

maybe Boyle gets dealt, Miller goes to center and Fast gets recalled or maybe Lindberg gets a game or 2.

Boyle has recently upped his game and I just think that he is quietly VERY valuable in the role he plays. Even though he doesn't play like he's 6'7", he does hit (albeit not resounding), gets a lot of shots off (albeit in the goalies belly) wins key FO's and is solid on PK. With Cally apparently gone, he'll be longest tenured Ranger under Hank........I think. He'll be a nice, cheap enough contract moving forward and God knows we cannot afford to be SMALLER!

And if I recall correctly, wasn't he one of our better players in last year's PO's?

 

[darko]

And if I recall correctly, wasn't he one of our better players in last year's PO's?

He had back to back good playoff series.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Stewart has one year left on his contract after this year. It's like kicking the can down the road for us and he has every reason to be motivated next year because he'll be playing for his next contract. We may have the same situation next year moving him.

I've read this a couple of times and I have to say I don't get it at all. Using this logic what's the magic cutoff point where a player becomes useful? 2 years left under contract? 3?

If we trade Cally for Stewart +, we get another year of a useful player plus another asset. If, Stewart does well and is reasonable in his contract demands, he may be part of the long term future. If not, sure, this time next year you trade him again next year and get another "+" or two in return.

So, instead of losing Callahan for nothing, you either get a useful player plus another asset you otherwise wouldn't have - or you get multiple assets you otherwise wouldn't have, but they come in a year apart. I'm good with that.

And that would be fine if you can get assets with him. Like I said, it allows for another year of development for players like Miller, Fast and Kristo. If he plays well, keep him. If not, there will be teams interested.

The point about time for Miller, Fast and Kristo (and Duclair and Buchnevich?) is a good one as well.

 

[NYR Viper]

I agree with your premise. All of this is lightyears better than losing either of them for nothing, which is possible due to injury or the unwillingness of other teams to pay up. On one hand I want as much as possible for either of these two players because god damit they are tough, homegrown gamers. Something this team was starved for a decades time. We finally got a few and are about to trade all of them away. I want some ****ing substance in return.

Reading that Cally is 99% gone is tough to swallow. While im not deluded as to what his true skill set is, he's still our Captain and theres a reason for that. I just hope what the Rangers get back for him is enough to make me feel satisfied.

Girardi is another story. I dont think itll be difficult getting fair or great return for him, but the hole thats left will rear its ugly head soon after. This guy has quietly gone about his business for years and as much as he is revered here, he is also under appreciated. If the Rangers know they have to let both of them go they need to formulate a plan around that as a package. Personally i think Girardi will be re-signed and should be.

The hole on the #1RD spot is going to be tough to fill, yes. But, like I have said before, the Rangers are lucky enough to have (2) 1st pairing LD's in McDonagh and Staal. Ride them. Stralman has fit in well playing with Staal. DO they keep him at a much reduced cost to Girardi? He is younger.

You have to see what they get back. Is Vatanan really in play from Anaheim? If so, that's a possible replacement with a strong defensive d like McDonagh or Staal.

Do they look to the off-season and see some players who can possibly be had on shorter term contracts for less money? Dan Boyle. Matt Greene.

Are they as good as Girardi? No. But they won't cost as much nor anywhere near the term. Maybe they like Niskanen to add some more puck-moving ability to the right side. Maybe they see a couple of players who may be available via trade?

 

[darko]

I've read this a couple of times and I have to say I don't get it at all. Using this logic what's the magic cutoff point where a player becomes useful? 2 years left under contract? 3?

If we trade Cally for Stewart +, we get another year of a useful player plus another asset. If, Stewart does well and is reasonable in his contract demands, he may be part of the long term future. If not, sure, this time next year you trade him again next year and get another "+" or two in return.
So, instead of losing Callahan for nothing, you either get a useful player plus another asset you otherwise wouldn't have - or you get multiple assets you otherwise wouldn't have. I'm good with that.


The point about time for Miller, Fast and Kristo (and Duclair and Buchnevich?) is a good one as well.

Even if it turns out to be a revolving door type situation it sure is better than letting a guy walk for nothing or getting saddled with a ridiculous contract that will hurt you down the road.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Hemsky should only be a contingency plan for if Zuccarello all of a sudden doesn't want to play here. Even as a rental, he would slot in on Brassard and Poo's line. That would be a disaster at ES in their own end. Figuring Callhan gets traded, that is.

I would do a 4th rounder or less. After seemingly hitting on two third rounders this past draft, this FO may hold a bit more value in those high picks.

Callahan was a 4th round pick. Should we always keep those? Hagelin a 6th. Lundqvist a 7th. A 3rd is a 3rd. Just because we MAY have gotten lucky (still way too early to tell), doesn't mean we should let that stop us from trading one to add a piece at the deadline. If Hemsky can be had for a 4th? Sure. If not I would still give a 3rd.

 

[E-Train]

So, instead of losing Callahan for nothing, you either get a useful player plus another asset you otherwise wouldn't have - or you get multiple assets you otherwise wouldn't have. I'm good with that.

It's the most logical approach to the current situation. If it ends up being 3 assets for a rental Callahan, you have to do it. Girardi is a much more difficult problem to solve. Even with a great return, replacing a top pair RD will be difficult.

 

[NYR Viper]

Even if it turns out to be a revolving door type situation it sure is better than letting a guy walk for nothing or getting saddled with a ridiculous contract that will hurt you down the road.

I mean hypothetcially here would be the "worst case scenario" for involving Stewart:

To STL:
Callahan

To NYR:
Stewart
Schmaltz
EDM 2nd '14




To X:
Chris Stewart

To NYR:
1st '15

Stewart easily returns a 1st at a deadline as a rental. Big bodied, tough goal scoring winger.

 

[Larrybiv]

I've seen posts, way back when the thought of Cally being dealt........"no way, he ain't going anywhere", and my original thought was.......I think it's VERY possible.

Where am I going with this? I think there is NO WAY Dan is going anywhere as we absolutely cannot disturb our defensive core now heading into PO's. We've upgraded by subtracting Del Zippo and now we're set. Also, especially that nobody's sure what's going to happen with Marc going into his final year, next year.

Carolina is looming, but we have time to deal with that.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Even if it turns out to be a revolving door type situation it sure is better than letting a guy walk for nothing or getting saddled with a ridiculous contract that will hurt you down the road.

Yup. And as important as Cally has been to this team over the years, at that point we'd be talking about a revolving door at 3rd line RW, which is pretty much par for the course for all teams in the cap era.

Note - I'm NOT saying CALLY is a 3rd liner, but at this point he is our 3rd best RW. If he goes, Nash and MZA will get more minutes and the guy who replaces him will then slot in as more of a "traditional" 3rd line player.

 

[NYR Viper]

It's the most logical approach to the current situation. If it ends up being 3 assets for a rental Callahan, you have to do it. Girardi is a much more difficult problem to solve. Even with a great return, replacing a top pair RD will be difficult.

I know the Rangers have liked Dan Boyle for quite a while. He may not be the same player he was but he is still a very useful top-4 d-man who can move the puck. He is available in free agency. 37 years old so he won't require a long-term commitment. Maybe they like that idea to pair him with either Staal or McDonagh.

That's the great thing about having Staal and McDonagh. You don't NEED to have a top-pairing RD to play with them. Hell, Stralman has played VERY well with Staal. He is not close to a top-pairing guy.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Agree.

If I had to take a stab at it I'd say 75-80 mill in 5 years time.

It is going to be 71 million this year. Barring a major economic meltdown (which is very possible), the cap could be 80m as soon as 2016-2017.

 

[Todd Harvey]

Brooklyn, from what I've seen, they (rightly) have certain restrictions here. Rumors are such a grey area to begin with, and it being the internet and all, ya know, people say anything LOL.

Let's assume Im a blabbering idiot and nothing I say will happen LOL. I can tell you, in my experience, there are people who bust their ass on this stuff, are truly wired in not only reporting, but being fed information constantly, because teams have gotten very good managing this whole information game in the twitter world, and they are roundly ABUSED on line on a daily basis. They can break stories, or pick up a strong scent of a deal that happens in some form months or years down the road, and that person is lambasted the entire time for cluelessness, or worse, creating fiction for selfish (readership) purposes. And when a deal goes down, no one ever goes back and remembers who broke it and deserves credit. Not that I seek any. I just love talking about it, always have. Better than anything, time has a way or proving who is/isn't right with these things. And they're such fluid situations, Im always reminded of the Odd Couple episode where Cosell is killing Oscar for his Joe Namath 'retirement' exclusive. And Oscar finally says in his defense, "He changed his mind!". haha... so ya never know with his stuff.

Hey, whereabouts in Bklyn? Born & raised....

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

It's the most logical approach to the current situation. If it ends up being 3 assets for a rental Callahan, you have to do it. Girardi is a much more difficult problem to solve. Even with a great return, replacing a top pair RD will be difficult.

Agreed.

Given Girardi's reported reasonable demands, you either need to get a haul for him or lock him up. "Chris Stewart +" is not better than Girardi at 6x$5.75MM.

In Cally's case, given his crazy asking price and diminished importance on this team, you need to move him for the best possible offer, even if that put you in a position where you may then need to make another deal a year down the line. "Chris Stewart +" is WAY better than Cally at 7x$6.85MM.

 

[darko]

It is going to be 71 million this year. Barring a major economic meltdown (which is very possible), the cap could be 80m as soon as 2016-2017.

That's a big jump in such a short time (63 to 80 in 3 years). Hope you are right.

 

[NYR Viper]

I've seen posts, way back when the thought of Cally being dealt........"no way, he ain't going anywhere", and my original thought was.......I think it's VERY possible.

Where am I going with this? I think there is NO WAY Dan is going anywhere as we absolutely cannot disturb our defensive core now heading into PO's. We've upgraded by subtracting Del Zippo and now we're set. Also, especially that nobody's sure what's going to happen with Marc going into his final year, next year.

Carolina is looming, but we have time to deal with that.

Sather clearly said that part of the reason they brought in Klein was to give them options moving forward on the right side. This is what he was talking about. Insurance.

 

[darko]

I know the Rangers have liked Dan Boyle for quite a while. He may not be the same player he was but he is still a very useful top-4 d-man who can move the puck. He is available in free agency. 37 years old so he won't require a long-term commitment. Maybe they like that idea to pair him with either Staal or McDonagh.

That's the great thing about having Staal and McDonagh. You don't NEED to have a top-pairing RD to play with them. Hell, Stralman has played VERY well with Staal. He is not close to a top-pairing guy.

What sort of FA contract do you see Dan Boyle getting? I'm thinking something like 3/20.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Brooklyn, from what I've seen, they (rightly) have certain restrictions here. Rumors are such a grey area to begin with, and it being the internet and all, ya know, people say anything LOL.

Let's assume Im a blabbering idiot and nothing I say will happen LOL. I can tell you, in my experience, there are people who bust their ass on this stuff, are truly wired in not only reporting, but being fed information constantly, because teams have gotten very good managing this whole information game in the twitter world, and they are roundly ABUSED on line on a daily basis. They can break stories, or pick up a strong scent of a deal that happens in some form months or years down the road, and that person is lambasted the entire time for cluelessness, or worse, creating fiction for selfish (readership) purposes. And when a deal goes down, no one ever goes back and remembers who broke it and deserves credit. Not that I seek any. I just love talking about it, always have. Better than anything, time has a way or proving who is/isn't right with these things. And they're such fluid situations, Im always reminded of the Odd Couple where Cosell is killing Oscar for his Joe Namath 'retirement' exclusive. And Oscar finally says in his defense, "He changed his mind!". haha... so ya never know with his stuff.

Hey, whereabouts in Bklyn? Born & raised....

Park Slope - but born and raised in Prospect Heights (looooong before it gentrified into Park Slope NE).

And you didn't answer my question there, my Brooklyn brother.

 

[Gardner McKay]

That's a big jump in such a short time (63 to 80 in 3 years). Hope you are right.

It was a big jump this year from 64-71. Even if it only rises 2.5 million the next 2 years, it will be at 76 million which will be within the 75-80 million range you originally suggested. Now do I think we should spend money on contracts that may look bad now but will look good in a few years because the cap is projected to go up significantly over the next 3-5 years? No. Not at all. If something does happen and the cap doesn't go up as projected then you are stuck holding a grenade with no pin.

 

[Larrybiv]

I mean hypothetcially here would be the "worst case scenario" for involving Stewart:

To STL:
Callahan

To NYR:
Stewart
Schmaltz
EDM 2nd '14




To X:
Chris Stewart

To NYR:
1st '15

Stewart easily returns a 1st at a deadline as a rental. Big bodied, tough goal scoring winger.

That's an awesome scenario, then again maybe even better yet, he matures into a more involved,consistent 25/65 that crunches a few bodies along the way, as we need that.

 

[NYR Viper]

What sort of FA contract do you see Dan Boyle getting? I'm thinking something like 3/20.

I would think 2 x 5 = 10 million

That's an awesome scenario, then again maybe even better yet, he matures into a more involved,consistent 25/65 that crunches a few bodies along the way, as we need that.

Exactly. It's possible, but I was trying to lay out the worst case

 

[RGY]

TB coach Cooper really danced around those questions about MSL