Proposal: Trade Proposal Thread: Part 77

[calder candidate]

This is kind of where my retention idea came from yesterday. I looked. So yeah, it's either $1M retention ish or a guy like Hakanpaa or Khudobin.

I still think the Stars are exploring their options if they let Klingberg walk. If we offer $1M retention or retain down to $5M, there is no better value the Stars can get for a top 4RD at that rate. Petry at $6.25M might make them look at other options more. And if we we get into a situation where retention is at play, we are not out of place to ask for a better return than both Toffoli and Lehkonen and I think the Stars get hooked on the idea of Petry at $5M. It's a strategy to get the best futures possible. I don't care if we can't retain on Drouin at the deadline. Minor problem.

Retaining on Drouin, Dadonov, Byron is a lot more important since team buying won’t have much space, retaining will leave get us more option and it will help improve return.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Retaining on Drouin, Dadonov, Byron is a lot more important since team buying won’t have much space, retaining will leave get us more option and it will help improve return.

It's important but not as important as the better return you will get with Petry on retention. Petry retention likely only blocks retention on Drouin (3 retention spots) and even with retention, you won't get much. Reality. Byron and Dadonov? Not sure... maybe a 2nd but Petry retention does not block that and then it expires with Byron and Dadonov which leaves 2 open spots for the next two years.

Price on LTIR after the season starts creates more than enough cap space for the next deadline.

I don't understand how some posters don't understand it.

Khudobin was cap buried by Dallas, I don't think anyone will be trading for a $3.3m AHL goalie. Also, he only played 15 games last season NHL/AHL combined and now I'm wondering what is going on with him.

The idea is that Khudobin is relatively cheap, crap and on an NHL deal. Perfect for the tank next year while keeping Primeau in the AHL to continue his development and Dallas will want to dump him and it will cost them something to move him.

I don't expect Price to play next year, so Allen, Monty, ?, Primeau...and preferably the ? should be two players on NHL deals since last year showed that getting 4 goalies injured in the season wasn't some freak luck with it happening to multiple teams last year (Habs, New Jersey, Ottawa). In the first round of the playoffs after a few games, 26 different goalies had played a game and two teams were on their 3rd goalies...

Yeah, Khudobin is not the one that comes to my mind coming the other way.

 

[calder candidate]

Dallas isn't trading a RD back for Petry. Their cap dumb will be Khudobin if there is a trade. And taking Khudobin allow the Habs to not call up Primeau next season.

Dallas Khudobin contract is only one year, Dallas won’t need cap relief this year… also they have Petrovic they play at RD or could also sign a RD for less than 1.5M$(No state taxes)
Mtl can just sign Montembeault if they want, don’t need Khudobin. I would take both of it help, I just think Dallas would want to get rid of a 2y vs. 1y for taking 3y and a RD would be better than G for MTL…
Keeping Barron in the AHL would be more important. Again taking khudobin isn’t a issue I just don’t know why Dallas is dumping a G with 1y when they need sign a#2 and they already have 19M$ of cap space and only Ottinger and Klingberg to resign. They need to relief next year with all the RFA to resign.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

No, I'm not touching Guhle.

What is your projection for Guhle? I like Guhle, but he’s more of a 2/3 to me. I don’t think Guhle, Anderson and Prime for 2nd is unreasonable at all and I like all 3 of those players. I’m fact I’m sure we’d have to add a 1st as well if anything.

 

[Heffyhoof]

By your own words, two more drafts is after the 2024 NHL Entry draft. Therefore you're literally saying the Habs will make "serious moves toward contention" starting in the offseason prior to the 2024-2025 season. Until the player(s) picked up in the 2023 and 2024 draft make an impact, it will be at least 2026-2027, likely after, 2027-2028 and onward.

Consider that it took Colorado a many years to first make the finals, and it took Tampa multiple playoff appearances and disappointments before they got anywhere (and they lost a final in 2015, no less) I think I'm being overly ambitious with the 2028 compete window.

Persisting as a mediocre team and constantly picking top15 is no different than being a crap team and constantly picking top10. Building a team takes more than picking high at the draft, ask Buffalo and Edmonton and Ottawa

You don't like Laine? That's fine, but in my opinion you're so invested in an archaic and failed model of team building that you won't agree to acquire any player of any age, not even 24 year olds with proven track records as impact players, because you think the mystery box of draft picks is much more valuable. It is not, and the lessons learned with the Galchenyuk and Kotkaniemi picks should be instructive enough.

Define what you mean by impact? Shane Wright is being drafted this year and therefore won't likely have an impact until 2026-2027 onward using your own logic. Or does Shane Wright get conveniently excluded from the criteria foisted on the coming picks?

Grabbing a turning 25 year old in Laine or your mystery RFA would put him at 28 getting on 29 by 2026-2027 which, again, by your own logic is when he's getting worse and on the down swing. So our very first year of contention, unless we trade Shane Wright for another more proven mystery RFA, Laine/MysteryRFA1 will already be getting much worse and we still won't have mystery RFA #1 RD.

Also, I'll say it again, the Montreal Canadiens made the Stanley Cup final last year. This is year one of them and their new core 'persisting' as a mediocre team. We are picking in the top 10 for the first time with this new core. Once or twice more isn't the apocalypse.

 

[Heineman Mineman]

Would be great to snag the 18th pick from Dallas. ..

Wonder how far up HuGo could move form 18 using 26, 33, Anderson, Dvorak, etc...

I'd prefer if we spread the return on two drafts. We already have a lot of picks in a draft where prospects are hard to evaluate because of COVID years. Our third round picks might be lottery tickets to a hidden Point nobody saw coming because of lack of games played.

Next year is supposed to be a good draft as well, so let's hope we can snag one to three additional first/second pick(s) at the TDL

 

[ngc_5128]

Khudobin was cap buried by Dallas, I don't think anyone will be trading for a $3.3m AHL goalie. Also, he only played 15 games last season NHL/AHL combined and now I'm wondering what is going on with him.

He had hip surgery last March that had him out for 6 months, and I don't think he was able to get back up to NHL speed all season. He might not ever get back there.

 

[Scotianhab]

What is your projection for Guhle? I like Guhle, but he’s more of a 2/3 to me. I don’t think Guhle, Anderson and Prime for 2nd is unreasonable at all and I like all 3 of those players. I’m fact I’m sure we’d have to add a 1st as well if anything.

You dont trade away top prospects like Guhle while your rebuilding.

 

[Nico Cauzuki]

habs need a young goalie, the farm needs a project

i know he still has alot to prove but personally i really like Jakub Dobes

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

You dont trade away top prospects like Guhle while your rebuilding.

...agreed...don't get why soo many Habs fans seem ready to usher him away already for more magic beans...

 

[WeThreeKings]

What is your projection for Guhle? I like Guhle, but he’s more of a 2/3 to me. I don’t think Guhle, Anderson and Prime for 2nd is unreasonable at all and I like all 3 of those players. I’m fact I’m sure we’d have to add a 1st as well if anything.

I think he can be a #1 (not in the PP1 sense, they'll need a dynamic powerplay force), but he's someone who's gonna play 25 minutes a night. Eat up ice. Shut down forwards. Throw hits. Be mean. Transition the puck up ice through first pass or skating it in.

 

[ReHabs]

Define what you mean by impact? Shane Wright is being drafted this year and therefore won't likely have an impact until 2026-2027 onward using your own logic. Or does Shane Wright get conveniently excluded from the criteria foisted on the coming picks?

Grabbing a turning 25 year old in Laine or your mystery RFA would put him at 28 getting on 29 by 2026-2027 which, again, by your own logic is when he's getting worse and on the down swing. So our very first year of contention, unless we trade Shane Wright for another more proven mystery RFA, Laine/MysteryRFA1 will already be getting much worse and we still won't have mystery RFA #1 RD.

Also, I'll say it again, the Montreal Canadiens made the Stanley Cup final last year. This is year one of them and their new core 'persisting' as a mediocre team. We are picking in the top 10 for the first proper time with this new core. Once or twice more isn't the apocalypse.

By Impact player I mean a PPG or near-PPG forward and equivalent quality as d-man or goalie. You know an impact player when you see one. Core players, star players, whatever you wanna call them.

I include Shane Wright in my analysis, why wouldn't I? We're not going to trade the 1OA and he will be part of the potential core and hopefully the star. But even so, as you can finally see, it isn't guaranteed that the player chosen 1OA (Wright) will be successful enough to become an impact player and even so -- we don't have even half of a competitive core yet even if he hits the ground running. Going to the mystery box year after year and hoping it will be all we have to do is the wrong move.

So this is precisely why we need to add impact players ASAP, so when the drafted youth do come in they are insulated behind the big, reliable core players and they can serve as the depth good teams have.

The Habs of the previous GM era were not well-built and did not have a competitive window. They got pummeled in the Stanley Cup Final so bad that Kucherov was probably drunk and partying before Game 5 even ended. We do not have a core, we have Suzuki and Caufield. We need to build a core. Waiting for two more years of drafts and hoping all those picks pan out is simply not going to bear fruit. Waiting is death, time marches forward.

 

[Scotianhab]

Player agent reveals who the Habs are selecting first overall

There has been much speculation about who the Habs will select first overall on July 7th when they host the

www.mapleleafsinsider.com

Jean Perron says Habs taking Slaf 1st overall.

 

[26Mats]

I'd prefer if we spread the return on two drafts. We already have a lot of picks in a draft where prospects are hard to evaluate because of COVID years. Our third round picks might be lottery tickets to a hidden Point nobody saw coming because of lack of games played.

Next year is supposed to be a good draft as well, so let's hope we can snag one to three additional first/second pick(s) at the TDL

Definitely important to try to put Allen, Dadonov, Drouin, and Byron in positions to have good seasons.

 

[Deebs]

What is your projection for Guhle? I like Guhle, but he’s more of a 2/3 to me. I don’t think Guhle, Anderson and Prime for 2nd is unreasonable at all and I like all 3 of those players. I’m fact I’m sure we’d have to add a 1st as well if anything.

It's absolutely disgusting to me

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

Player agent reveals who the Habs are selecting first overall

There has been much speculation about who the Habs will select first overall on July 7th when they host the

www.mapleleafsinsider.com

Jean Perron says Habs taking Slaf 1st overall.

 

[Scotianhab]

Oops meant to post that in the draft thread

 

[nhlfan9191]

By Impact player I mean a PPG or near-PPG forward and equivalent quality as d-man or goalie. You know an impact player when you see one. Core players, star players, whatever you wanna call them.

I include Shane Wright in my analysis, why wouldn't I? We're not going to trade the 1OA and he will be part of the potential core and hopefully the star. But even so, as you can finally see, it isn't guaranteed that the player chosen 1OA (Wright) will be successful enough to become an impact player and even so -- we don't have even half of a competitive core yet even if he hits the ground running. Going to the mystery box year after year and hoping it will be all we have to do is the wrong move.

So this is precisely why we need to add impact players ASAP, so when the drafted youth do come in they are insulated behind the big, reliable core players and they can serve as the depth good teams have.

The Habs of the previous GM era were not well-built and did not have a competitive window. They got pummeled in the Stanley Cup Final so bad that Kucherov was probably drunk and partying before Game 5 even ended. We do not have a core, we have Suzuki and Caufield. We need to build a core. Waiting for two more years of drafts and hoping all those picks pan out is simply not going to bear fruit. Waiting is death, time marches forward.

We do have a core imo. Suzuki/Wright/Caufield/Guhle will be the core we build around in my opinion. And if Wright and Guhle turn into something which they definitely should, it’s a pretty darn good young core.

 

[Habs Icing]

Anderson, Primeau, Flames 1st? Would you do this?

To answer your question let's look at some facts. The players selected at the #2 spot in the last 10 drafts:
Murray
Barkov
Reinhart
Eichel
Dubois
Patrick
Svechnikov
Kakko
Byfield
Beniers.

How many of those players are worth the package you're offering? Barkov and Svechnikov......maybe. Primeau could still be a prime #1 starter. So that's a chance of 2 in 10 or 20 % that you will get a player in return that will be better or as good as the package you give. Those are crapy odds.

 

[ReHabs]

We do have a core imo. Suzuki/Wright/Caufield/Guhle will be the core we build around in my opinion. And if Wright and Guhle turn into something which they definitely should, it’s a pretty darn good young core.

Suzuki hasn't hit 70 points
Caufield hasn't hit 50 points in his whole short career
Wright and Guhle haven't scored a single point in the NHL

This isn't a core, this is a hope and a dream.

And if Wright and Guhle become solid NHLers, the hope and dream is they become impact NHLers and not, say, the next Danault and the next Romanov.

Laine is better than any of them. That's my point. A proven impact NHLer on an RFA contract is worth so much more than any prospect or draft pick. And I don't even particularly like Fiala or Laine all that much.

 

[Kent Nilsson]

To answer your question let's look at some facts. The players selected at the #2 spot in the last 10 drafts:
Murray
Barkov
Reinhart
Eichel
Dubois
Patrick
Svechnikov
Kakko
Byfield
Beniers.

How many of those players are worth the package you're offering? Barkov and Svechnikov......maybe. Primeau could still be a prime #1 starter. So that's a chance of 2 in 10 or 20 % that you will get a player in return that will be better or as good as the package you give. Those are crapy odds.

lol what

 

[BaseballCoach]

I think he can be a #1 (not in the PP1 sense, they'll need a dynamic powerplay force), but he's someone who's gonna play 25 minutes a night. Eat up ice. Shut down forwards. Throw hits. Be mean. Transition the puck up ice through first pass or skating it in.

Absolutely. These are the core and almost-core pieces we need to hope to build upon:

Suzuki
Caufield
Wright or other 1OA pick
Guhle
Romanov
Price (if healthy)

These are the prospects whom we hope flourish, or at least most of them:
Heineman
Farrel
Barron
Harris
Primeau or Dobes
Poehling (hopefully)

These guys are useful to transition and/or to round out a top 9 and top 4 and not to be moved without a solid return:
Anderson
Dvorak
R. Pitlick
Edmundson

Still need two elite forwards and one elite D and maybe a goalie to replace Price. At most we culd get one from a trade (draft pick that works out)

 

[DiglettDangles]

I want less 2022 18OA and more Johnston/Bourque/Stankoven in here.

 

[danyhabsfan]

I want less 2022 18OA and more Johnston/Bourque/Stankoven in here.

Not available for Petry.

 

[ericd]

Josh Anderson (MTL) for Adrian Kempe and Jordan Spence (LA)