HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #88: 2024 Off-Season Thread

[Mrb1p]

Ottawa is a specific example of a team that tried to trade/sign there way out of a rebuild (one already delayed by trading their 2019 1st (became 4th OA) for Duchene). They moved a top 10 pick in 2022 and their highest pick in 2023 was in the 4th round. And they've already moved the guys they traded for. And after making the moves they did (DeBrincat, Chychrun, and dumping Zaitsev's and Murray's salaries so they could make moves focused on the short and medium term), they got bottom 10 finishes, a rental soon to be 31 year old Ullmark, a soon to be 34 year old Nick Jensen and a couple of mid round picks/prospects.

They're a prime example of bad management, that's it.

 

[417]

Ottawa is a specific example of a team that tried to trade/sign there way out of a rebuild (one already delayed by trading their 2019 1st (became 4th OA) for Duchene). They moved a top 10 pick in 2022 and their highest pick in 2023 was in the 4th round. And they've already moved the guys they traded for. And after making the moves they did (DeBrincat, Chychrun, and dumping Zaitsev's and Murray's salaries so they could make moves focused on the short and medium term), they got bottom 10 finishes, a rental soon to be 31 year old Ullmark, a soon to be 34 year old Nick Jensen and a couple of mid round picks/prospects.

Agreed but what they failed to notice during all of those years was that their rebuild wasn't yielding success.

They just kept figuring that just stockpiling high picks would eventually pay off. It doesn't because that's just one aspect of building a team.

 

[Captain Mountain]

Agreed but what they failed to notice during all of those years was that their rebuild wasn't yielding success.

They just kept figuring that just stockpiling high picks would eventually pay off. It doesn't because that's just one aspect of building a team.

I'm not sure why you're drawing those conclusions.

-I'm not sure they "failed to notice" that the rebuild wasn't yielding success. That's why they traded for guys and made UFA signings to fill holes.
-Ottawa never really stockpiled high picks. They've been one of the more aggressive teams in the NHL on the trade market during their rebuild. I'm not sure any team in the NHL in the cap era has ever traded more top-10 picks than they have in the last decade.

 

[sampollock]

One team that is reportedly interested [in Arthur Kaliyev] is the Montreal Canadiens. THN writer Adam Proteau suggested the Canadiens as a potential destination for Kaliyev and it makes sense.

As Proteau says in his article, Montreal is still in the early stages of its rebuild and has the room to give Kaliyev a real shot at a significant role.

Kaliyev can certainly play a top-9 role and maybe even a top-6 role if he impresses in training camp.” - Via The Hockey News

 

[Sasha Orlov]

Look at it this way: every minute someone else plays is a minute less Josh Anderson plays.

So true

 

[junyab]

He has a multiple 30+ goals seasons, a 44 one, he's been roughly PPG over the last ~150 games, he's massive too. He'd be an asset for any team.

Like the Jackets and Jets?

 

[sampollock]

As much as I'd like to see the Habs look to get him, I just want him to come back feeling better. Mental health problems suck.

Hopefully he can just take his time and recover at his pace.

very good post. I do want KH to try to get him though

 

[le_sean]

One team that is reportedly interested [in Arthur Kaliyev] is the Montreal Canadiens. THN writer Adam Proteau suggested the Canadiens as a potential destination for Kaliyev and it makes sense.

As Proteau says in his article, Montreal is still in the early stages of its rebuild and has the room to give Kaliyev a real shot at a significant role.

Kaliyev can certainly play a top-9 role and maybe even a top-6 role if he impresses in training camp.” - Via The Hockey News

No thanks. Just a PP merchant. He adds nothing else

 

[WeThreeKings]

One team that is reportedly interested [in Arthur Kaliyev] is the Montreal Canadiens. THN writer Adam Proteau suggested the Canadiens as a potential destination for Kaliyev and it makes sense.

As Proteau says in his article, Montreal is still in the early stages of its rebuild and has the room to give Kaliyev a real shot at a significant role.

Kaliyev can certainly play a top-9 role and maybe even a top-6 role if he impresses in training camp.” - Via The Hockey News

Habs have already shown they have 0 interest in no heart no hustle guys

 

[sampollock]

Habs have already shown they have 0 interest in no heart no hustle guys

which guy you figure they should try for? Necas?

 

[Habs Halifax]

So they would probably talk to Suzuki before doing the deal. Fair enough. I understand Suzuki would probably welcome a player like Laine IF he's (Laine) ready to invest his talent to perform.

The 2 year term is key. It's exactly the years where we do have cap space. After that, it might get tricky with several guys finishing their ELC or bridge contracts.

So yeah, we use the cap space on a legit talent like Laine and we have MSL and Suzuki to help him reach the level he should be at. 2 years is not much risk IMO.

Lots of fans think Laine should not be in Montreal with the pressure and I get that angle but I see another angle. A city that can support Laine and his skill and he has a center to work with (Suzuki or Dach). Best centers Laine has played with is Scheifele. That's it. I think we can get Laine back to star level and we do have the cap space, futures, and management to make it work. If Kovalev can do well in Montreal, so can Laine.

 

[morhilane]

One team that is reportedly interested [in Arthur Kaliyev] is the Montreal Canadiens. THN writer Adam Proteau suggested the Canadiens as a potential destination for Kaliyev and it makes sense.

As Proteau says in his article, Montreal is still in the early stages of its rebuild and has the room to give Kaliyev a real shot at a significant role.

Kaliyev can certainly play a top-9 role and maybe even a top-6 role if he impresses in training camp.” - Via The Hockey News

Can he PK?
Can he play in his own zone?
Does he put in a 100% effort every shift?

The answers are all no.
And I really doubt the Habs have any interest.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Would not shock me if none of the waiver exempt defense start the year in Montreal . I can see something like
Guhle-Barron
Matheson -Savard
Wifi-waiver pickup RD
Harris

Same here. If I had to put money on it, I would say we lean on the younger ones in the AHL and the older ones in the NHL. It's exactly how we managed Xhekaj and Barron so why would that be different than the others.

I don't think we touch the Matheson/Guhle pairing this season. Maybe the season after.

Who plays with Savard? Could be one of Xhekaj or Harris. Outside chance it's Struble or Engstrom. Hutson will have to really shine offensively and also be OK on D to earn that spot over the others IMO. In fact, I would love the development we get with Hutson/Reinbacher playing together in Laval.

Like the Jackets and Jets?

List the top centers Laine has played with in his career so far? Scheifele? Then who? A guy like Laine needs a good center and when he played with Scheifele, he produced.

Same usage/management issue the Kings had with Dubois. Trade big assets for him, sign him to the big 8 year deal, and then play him 15 min/game on the 3rd line expecting results. Come on man.

Laine with Suzuki fits. Think about it. Keep Slaf with them and move Caufield with Dach.

 

[Nico Cauzuki]

Do we have a date on when Laine is leaving the program or nobody knows?

Im pretty sure a few teams would be interested in him 2 years is not a big risk the reward is much higher

 

[Spring in Fialta]

Both are useless, that’s the comparison.

What good is 0.8 PPG when you never play and now can’t even mentally handle the Columbus market

Can you post a link that show that Laine's mental struggles are related to the Columbus market or even just from media pressure in general?

It's not the first time you've said this, you've been asked to show where you got this from and you've never provided anything. Yet you keep repeating it.

Post a link or stop spouting shit that you don't even know if it's true.

 

[Habs Halifax]

which guy you figure they should try for? Necas?

Laine. 2 year term is manageable and assets to acquire would be something we can afford.

Ducks and Canes are asking too much for Necas and Zegras. Looks like they are after a hockey trade and we are interested in using our futures or parts we can spare.

McGroarty likely doesn't fill our top 6 hole right away but would be a good add to our F pool.

Laine makes the most sense to me.

 

[Hannibal]

All this Laine talk gives me urticaire caliss.

No more reclamation project or negative valued player.

The guy got burned out in Winnipeg and CLB but you guys want him in MTL LOL

 

[McGees]

Lots of fans think Laine should not be in Montreal with the pressure and I get that angle but I see another angle. A city that can support Laine and his skill and he has a center to work with (Suzuki or Dach).

They can support him with online trolling, memes and death threats maybe?
I kid but really if a player doesn't leave it all on the ice, or have exceptional character or ability to consistently get them out of their seats, the fans won't get behind him...
Can he be that guy? Only if his stint in the player assistance program has reset him and he has found a rejuvenated thirst for his career.

 

[le_sean]

Can you post a link that show that Laine's mental struggles are related to the Columbus market or even just from media pressure in general?

It's not the first time you've said this, you've been asked to show where you got this from and you've never provided anything. Yet you keep repeating it.

Post a link or stop spouting shit that you don't even know if it's true.

Is he not in the NHL assistance program? For drug/alcohol related issues? I’d imagine it’s just because he likes to have fun, not some type of dependency? And I assume people become dependent because their lives are so wonderful and they are so happy? He’s not in the right frame of mind to be scrutinized every time he touches the ice, that much is obvious. This isn’t the place for him. Paying $9m a year for a guy that plays 50 games and needs babysitting is just poor team building.

 

[417]

I'm not sure why you're drawing those conclusions.

Because I live in the city and follow the team very closely. Pierre Dorion has said a lot of things over the years when he was GM and they were rebuilding.

I'm not just fabricating things. You don't remember his famous "The rebuild is done" press conference?

Even the fanbase kept saying the same things. "Another top 5-10 pick" and then poof! We're a playoff team.

Doesn't quite work like that.

-I'm not sure they "failed to notice" that the rebuild wasn't yielding success. That's why they traded for guys and made UFA signings to fill holes.

Yes because they thought they were finished "rebuilding" and that adding aDuchene or a Debrincat or a Chyrchrun was the piece to get them over the top, not recognizing that the core of their team was poorly constructed and the coaching was awful and was clearly showing them that they weren't there yet.

-Ottawa never really stockpiled high picks. They've been one of the more aggressive teams in the NHL on the trade market during their rebuild. I'm not sure any team in the NHL in the cap era has ever traded more top-10 picks than they have in the last decade.

From 2016 to 2023, while Pierre Dorion was GM, the Ottawa Senators picked in the 1st round 9 times.

of those 9 times

3 times was in the top 5 (Tkachuk, Stutzle, Sanderson)

2 times was in the in the lottery (Brown, Boucher)

4 times in outside the top 17 (Bowers, Bernard-Docker, Thomson, Greig).

I'd say 5 picks inside the top 10 within a 4 year span, is a lot of high picks.

If the Montreal Canadiens are still picking inside the top 5-10 in 2 years from now...something is wrong.

 

[Deus ex machina]

Look at it this way: every minute someone else plays is a minute less Josh Anderson plays.

Can't it be 20 seconds less for 3 other players?

 

[junyab]

Same here. If I had to put money on it, I would say we lean on the younger ones in the AHL and the older ones in the NHL. It's exactly how we managed Xhekaj and Barron so why would that be different than the others.

I don't think we touch the Matheson/Guhle pairing this season. Maybe the season after.

Who plays with Savard? Could be one of Xhekaj or Harris. Outside chance it's Struble or Engstrom. Hutson will have to really shine offensively and also be OK on D to earn that spot over the others IMO. In fact, I would love the development we get with Hutson/Reinbacher playing together in Laval.



List the top centers Laine has played with in his career so far? Scheifele? Then who? A guy like Laine needs a good center and when he played with Scheifele, he produced.

Same usage/management issue the Kings had with Dubois. Trade big assets for him, sign him to the big 8 year deal, and then play him 15 min/game on the 3rd line expecting results. Come on man.

Laine with Suzuki fits. Think about it. Keep Slaf with them and move Caufield with Dach.

I'm not a fan of bumping CC off the top line after taking a team-friendly deal. Especially for Laine, with all his baggage.

 

[le_sean]

I'm not a fan of bumping CC off the top line after taking a team-friendly deal. Especially for Laine, with all his baggage.

Didn’t you hear? He has no baggage. Montreal is the perfect place for a guy like him.

 

[Deus ex machina]

Ottawa is a specific example of a team that tried to trade/sign there way out of a rebuild (one already delayed by trading their 2019 1st (became 4th OA) for Duchene). They moved a top 10 pick in 2022 and their highest pick in 2023 was in the 4th round. And they've already moved the guys they traded for. And after making the moves they did (DeBrincat, Chychrun, and dumping Zaitsev's and Murray's salaries so they could make moves focused on the short and medium term), they got bottom 10 finishes, a rental soon to be 31 year old Ullmark, a soon to be 34 year old Nick Jensen and a couple of mid round picks/prospects.

I think that's an oversimplification.
The problem with Ottawa is not that they made trades, it's the trades they made. That and goaltending.
Debrincat was 2 years away from being UFA and didn't want to be there.
They got Chychrun when they already had Sanderson and Chabot.

If you have holes to fill to complete the rebuild, doesn't matter if you fill them by drafting or trade, as long as you get the right players.
Going by drafting only takes more time and is wasting prime years of some of your players when the rebuild is almost complete.

 

[yianik]

One team that is reportedly interested [in Arthur Kaliyev] is the Montreal Canadiens. THN writer Adam Proteau suggested the Canadiens as a potential destination for Kaliyev and it makes sense.

As Proteau says in his article, Montreal is still in the early stages of its rebuild and has the room to give Kaliyev a real shot at a significant role.

Kaliyev can certainly play a top-9 role and maybe even a top-6 role if he impresses in training camp.” - Via The Hockey News

First McGroar , who has skating issues and maybe attitude ( put me in coach but only top 6 ) and now Khaliyev who is a slow as molasses kind of guy, is he not ?. Slow skaters don't seem to fit what Hughes is interested in let alone " entitled " kids.

I'm thinking it's BS . For one doesn't sound like the kind if players Hughes wants. Second thing is since when has Hughes had leaks and the Calgary 1st, Mesar and Barron/ Harris is kind of specific. If it came out of the Jets then guessing Hughes won't do business with them.

And I don't like either of those guys for the reasons given.