HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #88: 2024-25 Season

[Boss Man Hughes]

Seravelli says Andersson is on the trade block. Why would Calgary trade him unless they know he won't re up with them. Calgary would want far more than the Habs would offer in a trade unless they are going to tank and take mostly draft picks.

MSN

 

[BaseballCoach]

Because I think playing his natural position is much better.

That is in reality case by case. It's not automatic and universal.

Why can't matheson play on the right?

Matheson played on the right in Florida and had some difficulty. He was moved to the left in Pittsburgh and results improved greatly.

Like I said, case by case.

Anyways he can't defend from the left side anyways.

Good job, Goebbels. Keep repeating the Big Lie. Matheson is actually a good defender per se, far above average defending against top scorers with his great skating and active stick. He breaks more cycles than any other D-man we have including Guhle. His issue is committing more turnovers than we would like. Turnovers are why he is not an $8M Norris contender. His gaffes are down this year, which is a good sign.

Guhle is the future while Matheson is just a patch job .

More Goebbels. Reality is that teams need MULTIPLE top-4 D. It's best when at least one of them can put up 50-65 points, and Mike is now in his third stgraight season of doing so.

Guhle does good on the right, he was also doing great on the left , so we should keep on the right? That makes no sense.

Happens sometimes that good LHD play the right side. Guhle seems to do well that way. This will allow us to have a great top-4 if Reinbacher and Hutson develop as expected.

You should always put players at their natural positions. That's where they learned from.

If we look for a trade , we can say we are looking for a RHD and if Matheson is in the Mix We can say Guhle and Hutson are in out top 4 for the future. Then we fix the right side with a trade.

( Just an example)

Give me someone truly just as good as Matheson but who shoots right, and I won't object. But I suspect the denigrators will be happy with a trade downwards talent-wise.

 

[Benstheman]

Hanifin and Theodore both took ~8.4% of the cap. Pietrangelo took 10.8% of the cap. I expect Andersson to push for something closer to 9-9.5m. You probably have to overpay in MTL due to the tax offset.​

Nah. Don't get fooled with his extraordinary start. He will come back to a more standard production, just like the rest of the team. He is not a no.1 D. He is more of a versatile complimentary top pair D. He is not Pietrangelo tier. I think he is more in the Theodore range. Bettre defensively but a tier below offensively.

 

[HuGort]

If Rantanen hits UFA we be all for him. But I heard this too many times before to not be skeptic. Rarely do players his caliber sign in Montreal

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

If Rantanen hits UFA we be all for him. But I heard this too many times before to not be skeptic. Rarely do players his caliber sign in Montreal

Habs probably need to pay him 12ish mill a year, maybe more.

Would be worth it to grab a player of that caliber.

 

[Intangir]

Crouse was a good suggestion.

Crouse'd be good to have, sure, but he'd cost a lot to acquire and I think we'd better hold off on using our assets for another winger.

We have Demidov coming, Roy and Mesar show promise although are far from sure things, and we've already got quite a mix at the NHL level as far as wingers go with Slaf, Caufield, and Laine for this year and next.

Dach as well to me isn't a true center. He can help out there in a pinch, but I just genuinely think he's best used as a right winger. Same is also true for Newhook as a middle-6 wing option.

Then you add-in Emil Heineman as a depth winger, potentially Luke Tuch in a couple of years, Florian Xhekaj too, and we start looking even more loaded at the wing position than before.

Owen Beck and Oliver Kapanen both have the potential to one day be at least decent middle-6 center options, but they're still far from proven. Michael Hage's skillset screams "first-line C", but he'll also need a couple of years behind his belt before he's ready for the show.

So yeah, looking at our current needs right now I'd say that #1 would be a true-blue second-line center, someone like Casey Mittelstadt who can both produce, win some faceoffs, and not get caved-in defensively.

Secondly would be established defensemen to help carry the load defensively. Ironic that we traded Kovacevic this Summer but he'd be real useful right about now.

Just, we've got some solutions on the way with Mailloux, Reinbacher, and I feel that Engstrom has played really, really well as an AHL rookie to start the year. Plus Kapanen and Beck for the long-term center spot problem if they develop well.

As such, I think our management would rather be a bit more proactive and try to steer our rebuild towards a speedier conclusion by acquiring young-ish players at positions of need, as rumors have gone around and said, but I also think we're still fine short-term despite the lack of depth and secondary scoring and we should be in no need to expedite things and risk losing-out on trade value by doing so.

The time hasn't come for us to overpay yet.

 

[junyab]

HuGo is looking for a big enforcer type who can play.

Actually, what he said was "they’d like...a forward who can forecheck and play physical."

That's Gourde. But sure, they'd love one that has size and can "enforce" as well, who wouldn't.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

If Rantanen hits UFA we be all for him. But I heard this too many times before to not be skeptic. Rarely do players his caliber sign in Montreal

As I have said before Habs have nor been a contender in a long time. If they progress this year and make the playoffs or come close we will find out if that changes things. If it doesn't or they have to ridiculously overpay to attract an FA then they will have to stick to the draft and trades.

 

[EXPOS123]

As I have said before Habs have nor been a contender in a long time. If they progress this year and make the playoffs or come close we will find out if that changes things. If it doesn't or they have to ridiculously overpay to attract an FA then they will have to stick to the draft and trades.

No elite free agent will sign here as they either resign with the same team or go elsewhere

Trades and drafting are the only way to go - and the trades need to be for permanent pieces, not on bandaid solutions or little gars de chez nous.

 

[sampollock]

Seravelli says Andersson is on the trade block. Why would Calgary trade him unless they know he won't re up with them. Calgary would want far more than the Habs would offer in a trade unless they are going to tank and take mostly draft picks.

MSN

would cost a bunch I bet

and is Gourde the best choice because he is French or the best choice, not being a knob, just asking

 

[LaP]

Crouse'd be good to have, sure, but he'd cost a lot to acquire and I think we'd better hold off on using our assets for another winger.

We have Demidov coming, Roy and Mesar show promise although are far from sure things, and we've already got quite a mix at the NHL level as far as wingers go with Slaf, Caufield, and Laine for this year and next.

Dach as well to me isn't a true center. He can help out there in a pinch, but I just genuinely think he's best used as a right winger. Same is also true for Newhook as a middle-6 wing option.

Then you add-in Emil Heineman as a depth winger, potentially Luke Tuch in a couple of years, Florian Xhekaj too, and we start looking even more loaded at the wing position than before.

Owen Beck and Oliver Kapanen both have the potential to one day be at least decent middle-6 center options, but they're still far from proven. Michael Hage's skillset screams "first-line C", but he'll also need a couple of years behind his belt before he's ready for the show.

So yeah, looking at our current needs right now I'd say that #1 would be a true-blue second-line center, someone like Casey Mittelstadt who can both produce, win some faceoffs, and not get caved-in defensively.

Secondly would be established defensemen to help carry the load defensively. Ironic that we traded Kovacevic this Summer but he'd be real useful right about now.

Just, we've got some solutions on the way with Mailloux, Reinbacher, and I feel that Engstrom has played really, really well as an AHL rookie to start the year. Plus Kapanen and Beck for the long-term center spot problem if they develop well.

As such, I think our management would rather be a bit more proactive and try to steer our rebuild towards a speedier conclusion by acquiring young-ish players at positions of need, as rumors have gone around and said, but I also think we're still fine short-term despite the lack of depth and secondary scoring and we should be in no need to expedite things and risk losing-out on trade value by doing so.

The time hasn't come for us to overpay yet.

Crouse is overrated a lot like Dvorak and Anderson were. He's getting lot of TOI in Utah too much TOI. For the last 3 seasons he has been getting 2nd line TOI (almost 1st line in 22-23) but his production is not the one of a dominant top 6 player. He could work with MacJesus or prime Crosby/Ovy but he's not moving any needle in a normal top 6. If you reduce his TOI then you have to expect a drop in production like Anderson.

Our focus should be getting the top players and then fill the lineup once we know what we need and how much money is left. Crouse is not a top player. For the last 3 seasons Crouse played on average 17:13 (2:04 PK and 1:43 PP). The only players in our team who averaged more TOI for the same years are Suzuki, Caufield, Monahan, Dach and Toffoli. Outside of Dach who is a young player all those guys are 50+ points forward. Crouse is playing too much imo and it skew his results production wise.

 

[junyab]

I can't think of a single reason why Rantanen would choose us over staying with the Av's.

 

[Deebs]

I can't think of a single reason why Rantanen would choose us over staying with the Av's.

He'll be staying with his boys Nate and Cale

 

[Beendair Donedat]

I don’t think including Barron or a prospect of his calibre would be necessary or advisable. Kostin is a bottom of the lineup player being paid 2mil a year. Closer to waivers than being a 1st round talent at this point in his career. Rutta is a guy you trade a late round pick for at the deadline. Slow, bottom pairing defender making 2.75mil. I can appreciate the cost of moving Dvorak and would like to see him elsewhere, but I think we’re too thin at C to not get a C back.

I think Kostin could be an interesting fit, but not with this kind of deal.

Hey that’s fine if you don’t like what I’d give up for the players, that’s just me throwing stuff out there valuation wise.

Including Dvorak is simply off setting some salary and addition by subtraction. It will cost a bit and I don’t consider Barron part of the short or long term plans here.

It’s more about adding the size up front and the steady presence on defense than hammering out the exact evaluation.

 

[Kosseca]

Crouse'd be good to have, sure, but he'd cost a lot to acquire and I think we'd better hold off on using our assets for another winger.

We have Demidov coming, Roy and Mesar show promise although are far from sure things, and we've already got quite a mix at the NHL level as far as wingers go with Slaf, Caufield, and Laine for this year and next.

Dach as well to me isn't a true center. He can help out there in a pinch, but I just genuinely think he's best used as a right winger. Same is also true for Newhook as a middle-6 wing option.

Then you add-in Emil Heineman as a depth winger, potentially Luke Tuch in a couple of years, Florian Xhekaj too, and we start looking even more loaded at the wing position than before.

Owen Beck and Oliver Kapanen both have the potential to one day be at least decent middle-6 center options, but they're still far from proven. Michael Hage's skillset screams "first-line C", but he'll also need a couple of years behind his belt before he's ready for the show.

So yeah, looking at our current needs right now I'd say that #1 would be a true-blue second-line center, someone like Casey Mittelstadt who can both produce, win some faceoffs, and not get caved-in defensively.

Secondly would be established defensemen to help carry the load defensively. Ironic that we traded Kovacevic this Summer but he'd be real useful right about now.

Just, we've got some solutions on the way with Mailloux, Reinbacher, and I feel that Engstrom has played really, really well as an AHL rookie to start the year. Plus Kapanen and Beck for the long-term center spot problem if they develop well.

As such, I think our management would rather be a bit more proactive and try to steer our rebuild towards a speedier conclusion by acquiring young-ish players at positions of need, as rumors have gone around and said, but I also think we're still fine short-term despite the lack of depth and secondary scoring and we should be in no need to expedite things and risk losing-out on trade value by doing so.

The time hasn't come for us to overpay yet.

This is why our injuries have slow down the rebuild, we still have so many questions marks on where will each player fit in the line up long term. Got to say, it does certainly look like Dach isn't a C today, but him playing W on the 1st line may just be a temporary thing. He may regain his form and be able to slide back into that 2C slot in a few week?? That being said, his performance raised a organization weakness, which is offensive C. Yeah, Hage is good, but he's far from the NHL 2C role and... he's alone as an option.

Like you pointed out, we have many option on D. It's more a question of letting them develop and secure their spot at this point. It will take time, but you can't block their path either. So trading for a top 4 D mean, IMO, that Savard is gone by TDL.

Anyway, I think that unless there is a deal that allow us to trade one of Armia/Dvorak for some help (grit fwd/RD), I dont expect a meaningful trade anytime soon.

 

[LaP]

would cost a bunch I bet

and is Gourde the best choice because he is French or the best choice, not being a knob, just asking

2nd option for Gourde. If the conclusion this year is that Dach is not a center then we need a 2nd line center since Hage will surely take a few years and Bech/Kapanen project more as 3rd line centers. Gourde ain't a 2nd line center.

Caufield - Suzuki - Dach
Demidov - ??? - Slaf
Newhook - Kapanen/Bech/Hage - Roy/Mesar/Heineman/Tuch
Anderson - Evans - Gallagher

As for Anderson the question is for how many years can he remain a solid top 4 RHD? Acquiring him would make lot of sense. It would make our defense immediatly much better.

Matheson - Anderson
Hutson - Guhle
Struble/Xhekaj/Engstrom - Mailloux

Anderson is kind of a perfect fit for us. The question is can he be effective for another 5-6 years. Maybe, maybe not. He would be kind of a gamble at his age. Depend on the price i guess?

 

[sampollock]

I can't think of a single reason why Rantanen would choose us over staying with the Av's.

ufa NEVER seem to hit the market

we need a WHAT IF thread for these types of guys

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

I can't think of a single reason why Rantanen would choose us over staying with the Av's.

To win more Cups? Avs have no goaltenders. no depth and no prospects.

ufa NEVER seem to hit the market

we need a WHAT IF thread for these types of guys

Sure they do. Several left Florida this off season.

 

[Habs Halifax]

If Rantanen hits UFA we be all for him. But I heard this too many times before to not be skeptic. Rarely do players his caliber sign in Montreal

Winning changes things. Habs need to continue to show the rest of the league we are on the rise. Laine wanted to play in Montreal and if you have a good young core, players will be more open.

What we have to remember is in the past, our talent was shit. Who wants to come to an island by themselves in a pressure cooker? Much different when that pressure is spread out on several core players IMO.

ufa NEVER seem to hit the market

we need a WHAT IF thread for these types of guys

Yeah, it's rare for the top players to reach UFA. Especially when they are in their late 20's. You see it more often when they are 32+ like Stamkos.

Tavares, Pietrangelo... Who else reached UFA in their late 20's or very early 30's?

 

[Habs Halifax]

Do you think there is any chance that Price's contract is traded? One more year left right? Salary cap will rise even more next year (projected that way anyways)... Cap floor teams might want it.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Not sure what the situation is for the Ducks and Zegras these days but the expected break out does not appear to be in the cards. It's more of the same from last year.

If the Habs ever trade for Zegras, I'd have Newhook in the package. What do we have to add? Not sure... maybe the Flames/Panthers 1st and another piece that is B or B+ level.

My point? We still got too many smaller types and Newhook is one of them. Yeah, he works hard and skates well but gets moved off the puck a lot. If the Ducks are interested in traded Zegras, My offer is Newhook+. Otherwise, go pound sand. No way we should be building our forward group with too many of those skill/soft types. Don't hate Newhook but I don't consider him a core piece

Is this even worth it for the Habs? Just keep Newhook?
Newhook and Flames/Panthers 1st
for
Zegras

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

Not sure what the situation is for the Ducks and Zegras these days but the expected break out does not appear to be in the cards.

If the Habs ever trade for Zegras, I'd have Newhook in the package. What do we have to add? Not sure... maybe the Flames/Panthers 1st and another piece that is B or B+ level.

My point? We still got too many smaller types and Newhook is one of them. Yeah, he works hard and skates well but gets moved off the puck a lot. If the Ducks are interested in traded Zegras, My offer is Newhook+. Otherwise, go pound sand. No way we should be building our forward group with too many of those skill/soft types. Don't hate Newhook but I don't consider him a core piece

Newhook is not a small player. He is 5'11" 200 lb. He may play smaller than his size though. No point making a lateral move like Newhook for Zegras though.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Newhook is not a small player. He is 5'11" 200 lb. He may play smaller than his size though. No point making a lateral move like Newhook for Zegras though.

Newhook doesn't play big. Pay attention when you watch the games. He's has lots of energy and works hard but he's not that effective. Sakic knows what he was doing by letting him go. Tough to be negative but I don't consider Newhook part of this core.

I'm on the fence if it was Newhook and a 2nd for Zegras. Don't think I would do it if it was a 1st instead of the 2nd. Lateral move? Might be

Posted a "Zegras value of" thread on the main boards. Going to see what other fan bases say and you know the Ducks will still pump him up

 

[junyab]

To win more Cups? Avs have no goaltenders. no depth and no prospects.


Sure they do. Several left Florida this off season.

You're saying the Av's would have less of a chance to win the Cup than Montreal in the next 5yrs? You serious right now?

 

[HuGort]

Actually, what he said was "they’d like...a forward who can forecheck and play physical."

That's Gourde. But sure, they'd love one that has size and can "enforce" as well, who wouldn't.

Also looking for top 4 right D without term.

Not sure what the situation is for the Ducks and Zegras these days but the expected break out does not appear to be in the cards. It's more of the same from last year.

If the Habs ever trade for Zegras, I'd have Newhook in the package. What do we have to add? Not sure... maybe the Flames/Panthers 1st and another piece that is B or B+ level.

My point? We still got too many smaller types and Newhook is one of them. Yeah, he works hard and skates well but gets moved off the puck a lot. If the Ducks are interested in traded Zegras, My offer is Newhook+. Otherwise, go pound sand. No way we should be building our forward group with too many of those skill/soft types. Don't hate Newhook but I don't consider him a core piece

Is this even worth it for the Habs? Just keep Newhook?
Newhook and Flames/Panthers 1st
for
Zegras

Habs need top 6 forward with size and snarl. We already too small/soft. You get double value back because he adds 25 goals and toughness. Zegras is opposite of what we need.