HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #87: 2024 Season Finale

[Milhouse40]

last time with Newhook , wasnt really impressed , hope its someone who has top 6 skills

It goes with what's available but I think people are hugely underestimating Newhook

Newhook ended up the season at 0,61pts per game (50pts season and on pace for 22 goals)
Playing from wing to center and spending a giant chunk of ice-time with Armia and Anderson.

Necas is at 0.69pts per game this season and some are ready to give a 60+pts D on a sweet deal for him to be a top 6 guy.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

It goes with what's available but I think people are hugely underestimating Newhook

Newhook ended up the season at 0,61pts per game (50pts season and on pace for 22 goals)
Playing from wing to center and spending a giant chunk of ice-time with Armia and Anderson.

Necas is at 0.69pts per game this season and some are ready to give a 60+pts D on a sweet deal for him to be a top 6 guy.

It's 1 season where he had alot of icetime . Pace stats are just projecting. I still don't see Newhook as a second liner if we want to go further. I think he can plays there for a couple of games if needed but not much more.

You can't base a season of a career , like Matheson is a great example. He won't repeat that if we want to go further since he's not in the big plan. I think we if we trade for those kind of players should be the '' time to win and compete'' .

Reclamation projects are cool but i wouldn't build a team on that.
NewHook still incertain , Dach is still a question mark to this day , whos also made of glass. What if it's not working in long term with Dach or Newhook? Team goes back to Suzuki does it all.

Id rather get a 23-24 year olds player with already good success but want more money or a change so we can build around him.
I don't think building a reclamation project is a good vision.

We'll see , I don't think we are gonna draft twice in the first round anyways

 

[themilosh]

yup
shows that hacks on the on the internet

I often think, most of these media talking heads get all their info from here, twitter and other fans just spouting anything.. there's a small eco system in each market, maybe the stick tape guy heard something, passes that on to Marinaro, tony goes on podcast and voila ... big news. Rinse repeat

 

[Miller Time]

I think Laine won't fetch much. Probably a change of scenery swap like the PLD for Kuemper

Laine for Anderson (or Gallagher)... We could only be so lucky.

But, with the power donkey profile or Gally's karactere appealing to certain old school GMs, who knows. Maybe KH could pull something off.

Laine & Texier for Anderson, Strubble, WPG 1st

 

[Kimota]

With the Canucks signing Hroneck, I figure they are out of Zadorov. OK insane out of nowhere deal(that I don't even think I would do. lol...): We trade both Guhle and Matheson separately for top forwards and we sign Zadorov. We don't have much money allocated on defense anyway. So the left side would be Zadorov, Hutson, Xhekaj.

 

[Paddy17]

How shall I put this clearly....
Don't want Zegras.
Don't want Necas.
Don't want Laine.

Draft Demidov, Lindstrom, Sennecke or Iginla.
Wait for better opportunities for trades.

 

[Miller Time]

With the Canucks signing Hroneck, I figure they are out of Zadorov. OK insane out of nowhere deal(that I don't even think I would do. lol...): We trade both Guhle and Matheson separately for top forwards and we sign Zadorov. We don't have much money allocated on defense anyway. So the left side would be Zadorov, Hutson, Xhekaj.

Zadorov buyer is very likely to have buyer's remorse before his UFA payday contract expires.

He's been heavily overrated the last few months. Basically a healthier Edmundson. 6M even in a rising cap environment is no bueno

 

[General Fanager]

It's not about what the player or his agent want, it's about what the reporter can find out and report. Their interests are meant to be at odds.

In some sports the reporters take pride in their work as third-parties. Engels is the Habs *beat* reporter and he cannot produce or reveal a single bit of news.

I guess it is too much to ask for.

Players who don't want to move somewhere have no shame or fear in revealing through the media a certain franchise's name on their NTC list. They do it with Eliot Friedman all the time.

Engels could ask and be told "no, I won't tell you" but I don't think he even thought to ask. It's beyond him. That's the rub.

its a fool's errand for a reporter to chase this info. it doesn't make him incompetent. LeBrun, Dregger, Bobby Mac wouldn't even have this info....

 

[ReHabs]

And who is that? Because no one should reasonably expect Necas, Zegras, Laine, etc. to hit 65 points a season. Based on your previous characterizations, Laine is "made of glass" and is "a reclamation project". Zegras benefited from serious offensive usage that Montreal (and Anahiem) can't give him now and is also "made of glass". Newhook had a better D+5 season than Necas, who has eclipsed 55 points (not even 65) once. If you want the production your looking for, then look at Marner or maybe Ehlers.

I think it's perfectly reasonable to expect Zegras, Necas, and Laine to hit 65pts next season but yet to say they're comparable acquisitions with that of Dach and Newhook is just... not worth pursuing the discussion.

Zegras, Necas, and Laine each have a career high that's about double that of Dach at the time of trade.

But maybe its hard to understand your expectations, because you seem to higher on Montreal's potential growth, but low on the players that would see the growth. Which is a strange inconsistency.

Not sure what you're trying to say -- I'm consistent: I want a better team and I don't think "waiting" is a strategy that gets us there.

its a fool's errand for a reporter to chase this info. it doesn't make him incompetent. LeBrun, Dregger, Bobby Mac wouldn't even have this info....

There are plenty of things that make Engels incompetent and one of them is having zero contacts among the club and no access to its players.

 

[ReHabs]

Why not just trade the pick for a forward, instead of further increasing the age gap between our forwards and defensemen? How does trading Guhle speed things up if you're creating a hole on defense that's only going to be filled in 3-5 years? (hopefully).

Now, is Necas or Zegras worth the 5OA pick? In my opinion they likely aren't. You get a handful of those high picks during a rebuild, so you should aim at franchise-altering talent.

It's a good argument you propose but my agrument's underlying assumption is as follows:

If Demidov is off the board, and maybe even Lindstrom too, then at 5OA the 2024 NHL draft will have a d-man whose ceiling is higher than Guhle's. Levshunov, Silayev, Dickinson, Buium, Parekh. You pick one of them and then deal with the excess of LDs.

Guhle himself is not worth the 5OA pick. Swapping someone like Guhle (or Matheson) out for a forward will have us ahead within a year with a net gain in team talent.

Of course it goes without saying that the 5OA pick has to hit, and he has to become better than Guhle, but every move has uncertainty and risks. Guhle is injury prone himself. Keeping him has risks too. (and it goes without saying, I would prefer to sell-high and trade Matheson over Guhle because I don't think Matheson will be on our team when the results matter.)

Hughes has brought in a young forward every offseason so far, so there's really not much reason to criticize him on that front. But it also doesn't mean that a similar opportunity in terms of price and reward will present itself again this offseason.

For what it's worth, I would love them to take a shot at Laine.

I don't think Monahan, Newhook, and Dach are in the same tier of acquisition of Laine, Necas, Zegras. It's not a criticism to say that the rebuilding Habs didn't acquire serious assets to improve the team yet.

I think if Laine is available the Habs absolutely have to take a run at him. We have cap space and if he's cheap to acquire it's pretty much the definition of a low-risk high-reward move. Even the conservatives here (90% of the Habs fanbase it feels) would agree.

 

[smirob]

What do you think the highest pick we can get with 26th + Harris?

 

[Vachon23]

What do you think the highest pick we can get with 26th + Harris?

higher then 20

 

[Milhouse40]

It's 1 season where he had alot of icetime . Pace stats are just projecting. I still don't see Newhook as a second liner if we want to go further. I think he can plays there for a couple of games if needed but not much more.

You can't base a season of a career , like Matheson is a great example. He won't repeat that if we want to go further since he's not in the big plan. I think we if we trade for those kind of players should be the '' time to win and compete'' .

Reclamation projects are cool but i wouldn't build a team on that.
NewHook still incertain , Dach is still a question mark to this day , whos also made of glass. What if it's not working in long term with Dach or Newhook? Team goes back to Suzuki does it all.

Id rather get a 23-24 year olds player with already good success but want more money or a change so we can build around him.
I don't think building a reclamation project is a good vision.

We'll see , I don't think we are gonna draft twice in the first round anyways

16:55 per game is not what I called getting a lot of ice-time. He got average and he played most of it with bottom 6 player and yet produce as a 2nd liner.

We need to stop dreaming thinking we can get top liners for a low pick and Struble.....you want an established top liners, you'll give up a top d or a top forward unless you do what the Habs are doing, getting players before they come into their own.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

16:55 per game is not what I called getting a lot of ice-time. He got average and he played most of it with bottom 6 player and yet produce as a 2nd liner.

We need to stop dreaming thinking we can get top liners for a low pick and Struble.....you want an established top liners, you'll give up a top d or a top forward unless you do what the Habs are doing, getting players before they come into their own.

17min of icetime is not bad. We know the first line and the rest of the lineup makes no difference, which is why we suck.

I also don't like the " trade our B prospect" for another miss and swing. Id rather overpay for a need or use picks and couple of prospects to get rid of salary from vets

 

[MarkovsKnee]

What do you think the highest pick we can get with 26th + Harris?

Islanders might bite at that at #20. Maybe Washington at #17. I don't see any other teams in top 20 being interested.

 

[Jaynki]

He's old? Thought he was 28-29? For a Dman that's not old.
He just had a career year, at 62 pts..............he is no Shea Weber in his own end, but the guy just had a great year, and has a ton of value, and his contract, oh yea it's under 5M........................

Call me crazy but Matheson has given us better hockey than Weber has ever given us. Except the final cup run, there we had monstruous Weber but other than that, he was slow, mistake prone and disinterested.

 

[Vachon23]

Call me crazy but Matheson has given us better hockey than Weber has ever given us. Except the final cup run, there we had monstruous Weber but other than that, he was slow, mistake prone and disinterested.

I’m taking 2016-17 Weber before Matheson anyday. He was a rock when he arrived before the injuries

 

[habsterr]

What do you think the highest pick we can get with 26th + Harris?

Harris is worth roughly a late 2nd or a 3rd rounder. 26+65 for 17-22 range.

 

[Jaynki]

I’m taking 2016-17 Weber before Matheson anyday. He was a rock when he arrived before the injuries

Prime Weber no doubt.

But the souvenir i have from him in MTL is so different than what he was in Nashville.

Disappointment on many level.

 

[Vachon23]

Prime Weber no doubt.

But the souvenir i have from him in MTL is so different than what he was in Nashville.

Disappointment on many level.

He finish 6th in the Norris in his first year here in 2016-17 but he was always paired with guys that had nothing to do in a top pair (Emelin/Mete)

 

[Adam Michaels]

I really thought Devils would trade their 10th OA pick for a #1 goalie (Markstrom). But as we know, they traded a 2025 1st instead. Then I saw online that they're looking for an LD for their 10th pick. Curious if Matheson is someone they might be interested in and if Habs would be willing to swing such a deal.

Or if MTL prefers leveraging Matheson for more immediate help like a pick and a prospect/young NHL'er who fits the team's age core.

 

[417]

I really thought Devils would trade their 10th OA pick for a #1 goalie (Markstrom). But as we know, they traded a 2025 1st instead. Then I saw online that they're looking for an LD for their 10th pick. Curious if Matheson is someone they might be interested in and if Habs would be willing to swing such a deal.

Or if MTL prefers leveraging Matheson for more immediate help like a pick and a prospect/young NHL'er who fits the team's age core.

I'm positive the Habs aren't going to make their current lineup worse, by trading Matheson for a draft pick that *might* help them in 2 years time if all goes well.

They're not at that stage of their "rebuild".

At least IMO.

 

[Jaynki]

I'm positive the Habs aren't going to make their current lineup worse, by trading Matheson for a draft pick that *might* help them in 2 years time if all goes well.

They're not at that stage of their "rebuild".

At least IMO.

100% agree.

Matheson is a keeper.

Suzuki and Caufield contract are running and Matheson will give quality hockey for the duration of their contract.

He is a top 15D in the league right now.

He is a building block. Not a piece to trade.

 

[417]

100% agree.

Matheson is a keeper.

Suzuki and Caufield contract are running and Matheson will give quality hockey for the duration of their contract.

He is a top 15D in the league right now.

He is a building block. Not a piece to trade.

Well i'm not sure he's a "keeper" necessarily, as long as he continues to play the role he's been playing in Montreal, he's going to price himself out of a contract the Habs are going to want to pay in 2 years (presumably to be fair).

So I wouldn't be surprised if he's moved at some point in the next 12-18 months...but it's not going to be for a "futures" type of deal. He's a proven commodity and I think they're going to want to get a tangible asset back at the very least if they move him.

His contract/production make him extremely valuable IMO,

The key will be if Guhle/Hutson/Xhekaj/Harris/Struble/Engstrom, continue to develop and show that they're going to reach their potential, it makes the likelihood of moving Matheson all that more logical.

 

[sampollock]

any chance we can keep the draft talk in the draft thread. thanks