GDT: Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2021/22 PART VI

[keonsbitterness]

Food for thought on the "we for sure need to add a D" front, Timothy Liljegren, a d-man know for his tepid starts and explosive development curves while acclimating to new leagues/roles, could quite literally double his NHL experience between now and our first playoff game.

And half of that gets us to the trade deadline. Plenty of time for development or lack thereof, and evaluation.

 

[Menzinger]

Who does Crouse take out the top 9?

 

[The Podium]

Who does Crouse take out the top 9?

Probably replaces Simmonds on the 4th line, but ya not a huge difference.

I think people don’t recognize that it’s actually hard to replace a player in our top 9.

 

[DraftSchmaft]

Probably replaces Simmonds on the 4th line, but ya not a huge difference.

I think people don’t recognize that it’s actually hard to replace a player in our top 9.

Whatttttt. Arizona's untouchable player is a 4th liner here / or not a huge difference depending on what you meant there.

Crouse is 200+ hits 200 shots 20 goals on our first line and you want to bury that potential? Get serious man. We would obviously have a stacked 4th line of mik-spezza-engvall if we traded for Crouse. Which would then end Miks time here because it will piss him off, but it will be worth it because if that's our 4th line, our forward group is stacked.


I think people don't recognize Crouse is a 20/20 player on Arizona. On Arizona. He is guaranteed a top 6 role here and they will happily demote someone in the top 9 to add him. Crouse and Bunting as our top 6 LWs is drool worthy.

**20/20 pace

 

[The Podium]

Whatttttt. Arizona's untouchable player is a 4th liner here / or not a huge difference depending on what you meant there.

Crouse is 200+ hits 200 shots 20 goals on our first line and you want to bury that potential? Get serious man. We would obviously have a stacked 4th line of mik-spezza-engvall if we traded for Crouse. Which would then end Miks time here because it will piss him off, but it will be worth it because if that's our 4th line, our forward group is stacked.


I think people don't recognize Crouse is a 20/20 player on Arizona. On Arizona. He is guaranteed a top 6 role here and they will happily demote someone in the top 9 to add him. Crouse and Bunting as our top 6 LWs is drool worthy.

Great, Crouse can hit…

I don’t think you realize that a lot of these offensive leaders on bad teams tend to have their numbers drop when they move to better offensive teams.

Also Crouse has a career high of 25 points, never has sniffed 20 goals yet he’s a 20-20-40 guy in Arizona?

Just to put into perspective, Bunting had the same amount of points as Crouse in 30 fewer games last season, both on the same Coyotes team.

 

[Menzinger]

Whatttttt. Arizona's untouchable player is a 4th liner here / or not a huge difference depending on what you meant there.

Crouse is 200+ hits 200 shots 20 goals on our first line and you want to bury that potential? Get serious man. We would obviously have a stacked 4th line of mik-spezza-engvall if we traded for Crouse. Which would then end Miks time here because it will piss him off, but it will be worth it because if that's our 4th line, our forward group is stacked.


I think people don't recognize Crouse is a 20/20 player on Arizona. On Arizona. He is guaranteed a top 6 role here and they will happily demote someone in the top 9 to add him. Crouse and Bunting as our top 6 LWs is drool worthy.

**20/20 pace

Not sure I'd agree with that. He's not bumping Kerfoot, and Bunting at this point has clear chemistry with Matthews.

He'd maybe be able to swap in for Soup. But I'm not all that inclined to pay premium assets for that to happen.

 

[Menzinger]

Great, Crouse can hit…

I don’t think you realize that a lot of these offensive leaders on bad teams tend to have their numbers drop when they move to better offensive teams.

Also Crouse has a career high of 25 points, never has sniffed 20 goals yet he’s a 20-20-40 guy in Arizona?

Just to put into perspective, Bunting had the same amount of points as Crouse in 30 fewer games last season, both on the same Coyotes team.

A good point. Playing on a bad team means more opportunities/icetime.

 

[The Podium]

A good point. Playing on a bad team means more opportunities/icetime.

I like to call it the “Matt Stajan Effect”

 

[stickty111]

Great, Crouse can hit…

I don’t think you realize that a lot of these offensive leaders on bad teams tend to have their numbers drop when they move to better offensive teams.

Also Crouse has a career high of 25 points, never has sniffed 20 goals yet he’s a 20-20-40 guy in Arizona?

Just to put into perspective, Bunting had the same amount of points as Crouse in 30 fewer games last season, both on the same Coyotes team.

These arguments in support of Crouse were what we heard for Foligno, and we all know how that worked out. They were the same for Ritchie too.
How about we get a good player this time, and not someone who is considered good because big guy hits people?

 

[SprDaVE]

I wonder if the Leafs could peddle Ritchie with a 3rd round pick in 2023 to the Coyotes for Dzingel. I feel like this is pretty fair...

Cuts cap space, gain a useful depth player. Coyotes get a pick to horde and a player to flip eventually and help to reach the cap floor.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Yeah I saw people mentioning Ho Sang so used his name first. It doesn't have to be him. Placeholder name. Would be cooler if the person came internally rather than trade. Nice win for the GM.

The general point is take advantage of the core 4 carrying offence. There's lots of options out there cheaper than the big names going around that can pace 20 goals beside matthews and marner or JT and Nylander. The list is even bigger for M/M because you also get to take advantage of their defensive impact.

I fully agree, but why not just continue using Kerfoot? Why does it need to be a guy who puts up goals, especially if that takes away from two other great goal scorers in Tavares and Nylander? Kerfoot's goal totals and shooting percentage are not amazing, but he also takes half the number of shots and does a lot to set up Nylander and Tavares. If he shot as often as Nylander and Tavares did at ES, he would actually be fairly close to their 11 ES goals. However, it also likely means a pair of 17 goal scorers have fewer goals than they currently do right now.

Kerfoot-Tavares-Nylander is not as good as Bunting-Matthews-Marner, but they are still a high end 2nd line that could easily be a 1st line on a bunch of teams, and I doubt you find anyone internally who does better than Kerfoot in that spot.

 

[BertCorbeau]

I wonder if the Leafs could peddle Ritchie with a 3rd round pick in 2023 to the Coyotes for Dzingel. I feel like this is pretty fair...

Cuts cap space, gain a useful depth player. Coyotes get a pick to horde and a player to flip eventually and help to reach the cap floor.

Sign me up .. Dzingel hasn't been good since leaving Ottawa, but he brings some nice grit and peskiness to the bottom end of the roster, and can play both wings.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Sign me up .. Dzingel hasn't been good since leaving Ottawa, but he brings some nice grit and peskiness to the bottom end of the roster, and can play both wings.

The problem with Dzingel is he is worse than everything we currently have, including Ritchie, and is practically worthless. I bet you could convince Arizona to give him up for a nothing prospect or a 7th rounder.

Dumping Ritchie, especially right now, is not worth a 3rd round pick.

 

[BertCorbeau]

The problem with Dzingel is he is worse than everything we currently have, including Ritchie, and is practically worthless. I bet you could convince Arizona to give him up for a nothing prospect or a 7th rounder.

Dumping Ritchie, especially right now, is not worth a 3rd round pick.

Well I wouldn't count on Dzingel for much more than what Ritchie brought but if it can get the Leafs out of Ritchie contract for the next two years, and net a 3rd round pick? That's a nice deal.

 

[Nylander88]

Kerfoot has been great for us, but I think if you can move him for a cap savings, and a guy who plays a heavier game...you do it. They've looked decent in the regular season, but Kerfoot-Tavares-Nylander is going to struggle when playoffs kick in imo. Bunting will help bring intensity to the Matthews-Marner duo. You want people who will drag you into the battle. Kerfoot and Dermott in an overpay for Crouse. Maybe get them to throw in a 3rd or 4th round pick if possible. In turn for them taking the bigger contract in Kerfoot, we give them some much needed help at D, and a guy who is cost controlled for an extra year.
Bunting-Matthews-Marner
Crouse-Tavares-Nylander
Mikheyev-Kampf-Kase
Engvall-Spezza-Simmonds

Make a cheap side deal with Vancouver to get Luke Schenn. Send em a B level prospect and a mid-round pick.
Crouse & Schenn suddenly change your team big time when things get chippy

 

[BertCorbeau]

Kerfoot has been great for us, but I think if you can move him for a cap savings, and a guy who plays a heavier game...you do it. They've looked decent in the regular season, but Kerfoot-Tavares-Nylander is going to struggle when playoffs kick in imo. Bunting will help bring intensity to the Matthews-Marner duo. You want people who will drag you into the battle. Kerfoot and Dermott in an overpay for Crouse. Maybe get them to throw in a 3rd or 4th round pick if possible. In turn for them taking the bigger contract in Kerfoot, we give them some much needed help at D, and a guy who is cost controlled for an extra year.
Bunting-Matthews-Marner
Crouse-Tavares-Nylander
Mikheyev-Kampf-Kase
Engvall-Spezza-Simmonds

Make a cheap side deal with Vancouver to get Luke Schenn. Send em a B level prospect and a mid-round pick.
Crouse & Schenn suddenly change your team big time when things get chippy

Kerfoot's actually been one of the best playoff performers on the team since he joined, don't let his size fool you.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Well I wouldn't count on Dzingel for much more than what Ritchie brought but if it can get the Leafs out of Ritchie contract for the next two years, and net a 3rd round pick? That's a nice deal.

Are we not giving up the 3rd round pick in this scenario?

If we get the 3rd round pick, then definitely I would do it even if Dzingel is a downgrade on Ritchie.

 

[BertCorbeau]

Are we not giving up the 3rd round pick in this scenario?

If we get the 3rd round pick, then definitely I would do it even if Dzingel is a downgrade on Ritchie.

Ohh I totally misread his post.

Yeah that is a bad deal

 

[Nylander88]

Kerfoot's actually been one of the best playoff performers on the team since he joined, don't let his size fool you.

Totally agree man. It's nothing against his playoff performances at all. If Cap wasn't a thing I'd way rather move a guy like Mikheyev who is hot right now. I just think Kerfoot-Tavares-Nylander will struggle as a unit in a rough series

 

[TML1967]

Looks like the KHL is going to skip the rest of their regular season and go straight to playoffs. I wonder what that means for someone like Amirov. I wonder if we see him in NA sooner because of that.

I also wonder what that means for someone like Kuzmenko. Would he be able to sign with a team and play NHL playoffs this year?

I think getting Amirov in wont be hard, but if Kuzmenko doesnt have a team affiliation does he need to go through waivers? Or is that only if its after the TDL?

 

[TML1967]

I can see it for next season. Spezza really evolved his role and his game. I think Subban could as well. It doesn't have to be about the PP or even about being great defensively. I think Subban is still efficient, he's just nowhere near a 9M defenseman. He's only going to be 33 years old and probably has plenty in the tank. He can be very dynamic, physical and intense. He loves the media spotlight and I think playing for his hometown will rejuvenate him.

It's the kind of low risk medium reward that could really help us gain a valuable player and veteran. If it doesn't work out, it doesn't work out.

If PK is willing to play third pair minutes, id be interested.
It would mean you have Brodie, Holl, Liljgren and anyone we are adding all as right side guys. I guess it would be nice not rush Niemela right into the NHL.
Reilly, Muzzin, Sandin and Dermott on the left side.

In a scenario like this, you need to find a way to move Dermott, Holl and either be ok with Liljgren in the top 4 OR be ok with bringing someone in and sitting Subban or Liljgren.

 

[TML1967]

I think you have to consider just about everything is on the table in this scenario. I wouldn't touch Matthews (obviously), Nylander (too good of a contract), or Rielly .. but I would probably look to move Tavares before Marner because Marner is much younger.

Leaves a heck of a hole down the middle though.

I guess you could pursue Hertl or Trochek in free agency .. but there would definitely be some contract coming back in a JT trade and if they want to get value out of a JT trade, it may not be a great player.

Not that it will ever happen, but if you can move Tavares for positive value (and assuming you arent getting a C back in return)
Free agents Malkin, Giroux, Bergeron, Kotkaniemi (if not qualified), Hertl, Kadri (lol) can all play 2nd line minutes and be effective. I doubt Malkin or Bergeron go anywhere new. Kadri if he keeps this pace up will cost as much as Tavares.
Giroux, Hertl are both really good players who will cost less.

 

[dubplatepressure]

A good point. Playing on a bad team means more opportunities/icetime.

Many people said the same thing about Sam Bennett. I think it goes both ways.

 

[Menzinger]

Many people said the same thing about Sam Bennett. I think it goes both ways.

That's definitely true.

Id just be wary of any assumption that a player moving to a good team is guaranteed to increase production. That's all.

 

[TML1967]

Who does Crouse take out the top 9?

Crouse - Tavares - Nylander
Bunting - Matthews - Marner
Mikheyev - New 3C - Kase
Engval - Kampf - Spezza/Simmonds

Id try and move Kerfoot while his value is high for a more well rounded 3C who costs less against the cap.
Try crouse with Tavares and Nylander or on the third line with the new 3C and Kase.

I dont think people have seen enough of Crouse's game on this thread. He isnt just a dumb player throwing hits and doing nothing else. He thinks the game decently enough, uses his size and strength to drive the net and set up shop there. Giving him some linemates who can gain access to the O zone and find him near the net would make him a real threat.