Speculation: Trade and Free Agency Talk - 2022-23 Edition - Postseason Success can't be a Myth!

[57special]

I, personally, think that Hunt is ready for 3rd pair duties. Maybe not so in terms of covering up any mistakes made by Addison, but the numbers say that even Brodin wasn’t so great at that either.

O’Rourke is a mystery box to me. He’s growing into a bigger role in Iowa as the year has progressed.

The issue is when you have Middleton/Merrill out there, that’s automatically 1/3 of your defense that is a non factor in the offensive zone. Weak shots and okay passing. I really want that LD spot next to Spurgeon to be upgraded. That’s Lambos’ spot long term. Chychrun would be perfect for the remainder of his contract.

I also think that Middleton and Merrill are very unimaginative on the breakout. It’s a fine line between being creative, and being foolish. Spurgeon, and Especially Brodin, get it just right. Dumba often crosses the line. Addison is ok - his weaknesses are elsewhere. Middleton and Merrill are from the Clayton Stoner school of defense. Bang it up the boards and out. Safe, but gives the puck away in the neutral zone, which starts a cycle of them dumping it back in, which exposes them because they are slow to get back, so all they can do, if they are lucky, is bang it up the boards and out.

Happy to report that Hunt and ROR are better skaters already, and both are good on the breakout, though we aren’t talking Brodin level. It’s a very important, and often overlooked skill for Dmen.

 

[StateofCelly]

I, personally, think that Hunt is ready for 3rd pair duties. Maybe not so in terms of covering up any mistakes made by Addison, but the numbers say that even Brodin wasn’t so great at that either.

O’Rourke is a mystery box to me. He’s growing into a bigger role in Iowa as the year has progressed.

The issue is when you have Middleton/Merrill out there, that’s automatically 1/3 of your defense that is a non factor in the offensive zone. Weak shots and okay passing. I really want that LD spot next to Spurgeon to be upgraded. That’s Lambos’ spot long term. Chychrun would be perfect for the remainder of his contract.

I agree with your assessment here. I do watch a lot of Iowa games and feel that though Wallstedt has been very good as of late, but part of that success you can contribute to some of the growth from both Hunt and O'Rourke. Their play has made up for some of the weaknesses that make the "vets" down there just other guys. O'Rourke definitely lacks in the consistency department, but once he truly figures out what he wants his game to be at this level he will be good. I really think you could substitute Hunt in for Merrill or Goligoski and not really see too much of a difference... growing pains sure, but overall performance not so much.

Hunt turning into a 3rd pair guy that could potentially play 2nd pair in a pinch would be a good deal. I for one thought O'Rourke would be a top 4 guy at some point, now I am more grateful we have Faber and am curious to see what Lambos becomes next year and what his development cycle becomes.

 

[57special]

I agree with your assessment here. I do watch a lot of Iowa games and feel that though Wallstedt has been very good as of late, but part of that success you can contribute to some of the growth from both Hunt and O'Rourke. Their play has made up for some of the weaknesses that make the "vets" down there just other guys. O'Rourke definitely lacks in the consistency department, but once he truly figures out what he wants his game to be at this level he will be good. I really think you could substitute Hunt in for Merrill or Goligoski and not really see too much of a difference... growing pains sure, but overall performance not so much.

Hunt turning into a 3rd pair guy that could potentially play 2nd pair in a pinch would be a good deal. I for one thought O'Rourke would be a top 4 guy at some point, now I am more grateful we have Faber and am curious to see what Lambos becomes next year and what his development cycle becomes.

I think that bringing them up too early, before their body is done maturing, and their mind still processing the AHL game, will stunt their growth. I like Hunt the most of all of them, but can see both players being middle pairing types, as they have the skating, decent size, and no major weaknesses. Right now they are mostly competent in the AHL…that’s not good enough for the NHL, where everything is stronger, faster, more skilled, and smarter. They need to be excelling in the AHL before they are brought up. By next fall they should be stronger- a few months of summer training and simply maturing can make quite a difference at that age, though there are no guarantees- some prospects simply plateau.

 

[StateofCelly]

I think that bringing them up too early, before their body is done maturing, and their mind still processing the AHL game, will stunt their growth. I like Hunt the most of all of them, but can see both players being middle pairing types, as they have the skating, decent size, and no major weaknesses. Right now they are mostly competent in the AHL…that’s not good enough for the NHL, where everything is stronger, faster, more skilled, and smarter. They need to be excelling in the AHL before they are brought up. By next fall they should be stronger- a few months of summer training and simply maturing can make quite a difference at that age, though there are no guarantees- some prospects simply plateau.

Yeah I agree with this.. especially in the case of Lambos and O'Rourke. I think Hunt is a lot closer to what he will always be than the other two, which is why I think his ceiling is that 3rd pairing, or 2nd in a pinch type of guy. He is mature beyond his years, and plays more of a "man's" game vs O'Rourke still finding his. But I think the reason that both you and I like Hunt more is because you can see clearly what his game will be at the next level. Ultimately think O'Rourke still becomes the better prospect, but he needs more time in the oven for sure.

 

[thestonedkoala]

You never know. It’s going into the 25/26 season. Haight/Lorenz will be 21/22 and Bankier will be 22/23. That’s right around the age that a lot of prospects start pushing for NHL spots.

No, but Lorenz isn't really doing much in the NCAA and Haight is playing with a generational talent, so it's hard to gauge. Bankier is also an overager, so he should be dominating. I think all three are similar to Firstov/Beckman

 

[57special]

No, but Lorenz isn't really doing much in the NCAA and Haight is playing with a generational talent, so it's hard to gauge. Bankier is also an overager, so he should be dominating. I think all three are similar to Firstov/Beckman

What’s nice about Bankier is that he is a long framed C, who’s game is on the upswing. I can see his skating and strength improving quite a lot, and he has already shown at the WJC’s that he can switch from being a scorer to a defensively responsible C. No guarantees, of course, but he ticks a lot of boxes.

Yeah I agree with this.. especially in the case of Lambos and O'Rourke. I think Hunt is a lot closer to what he will always be than the other two, which is why I think his ceiling is that 3rd pairing, or 2nd in a pinch type of guy. He is mature beyond his years, and plays more of a "man's" game vs O'Rourke still finding his. But I think the reason that both you and I like Hunt more is because you can see clearly what his game will be at the next level. Ultimately think O'Rourke still becomes the better prospect, but he needs more time in the oven for sure.

The main thing I like about Hunt more than the other two D prospects is how his skating stride and stance seems very solid, and low to the ice. I don’t agree that his game is any more mature, or limited, than ROR’s. SJo, being the older prospect, is the guy who might be plateauing, after a nice start.

Lambos….I dunno. His game seems to be trending the wrong way. I have doubts about his mental game.

 

[StateofCelly]

I don’t agree that his game is any more mature, or limited, than ROR’s.

I'm not talking about demeanor, I am talking from a perspective as ROR is further from what his NHL game will ultimately be, and Hunt is closer to what his will be. You can tell both have worn letters in their careers by how they carry themselves. I just tend to think Hunt has pushed himself into a potential call up position more so than ROR. But with where we are at, I don't think either will be or should be considered. Keep everyone down and let them find some success like they have started to.

Lambos….I dunno. His game seems to be trending the wrong way. I have doubts about his mental game.

Mental game seems to be the key here with how many ups and downs he has had. The kid has skill. I think ever since the injury ended his year early during his draft season, and then following that up by missing the WJC roster really hit him hard.

 

[57special]

I'm not talking about demeanor, I am talking from a perspective as ROR is further from what his NHL game will ultimately be, and Hunt is closer to what his will be. You can tell both have worn letters in their careers by how they carry themselves. I just tend to think Hunt has pushed himself into a potential call up position more so than ROR. But with where we are at, I don't think either will be or should be considered. Keep everyone down and let them find some success like they have started to.

Mental game seems to be the key here with how many ups and downs he has had. The kid has skill. I think ever since the injury ended his year early during his draft season, and then following that up by missing the WJC roster really hit him hard.

I agree. gun to my head, I’d pick Hunt if I had to pick any of the young guys as a call up. Would pick Mermis as the guy who would least likely f*** up, but hopefully that will change in the years to come.

 

[StateofCelly]

I agree. gun to my head, I’d pick Hunt if I had to pick any of the young guys as a call up. Would pick Mermis as the guy who would least likely f*** up, but hopefully that will change in the years to come.

I know they like Sustr because of his size too, but nothing about his game at even the AHL level makes me want to see him come up. SJo i think with the rise of some of the other prospects will probably be due for change of scenery. I do like some of what Mermis does but if we get to a point where you're calling him up its a pack it in moment anyway.

 

[57special]

I know they like Sustr because of his size too, but nothing about his game at even the AHL level makes me want to see him come up. SJo i think with the rise of some of the other prospects will probably be due for change of scenery. I do like some of what Mermis does but if we get to a point where you're calling him up its a pack it in moment anyway.

Forgot about Sustr. He’s big, can play a bit. Slow, and not especially tough…but he’s big

 

[Digitalbooya]

No, but Lorenz isn't really doing much in the NCAA and Haight is playing with a generational talent, so it's hard to gauge. Bankier is also an overager, so he should be dominating. I think all three are similar to Firstov/Beckman

I’m not saying they will be sure fire top 6 players, but I think all three will be pressing for a bottom 6 role.

Beckman is 21 and has already had a cup of coffee in the NHL. He should be pressing for a spot next year.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Dumba - Going to walk at the end of the season. Minnesota is going to see more value out of Dumba than a 2nd or 3rd round pick.

Hartman - Going to chalk it up due to the injuries on why he had such a bad year. With the upcoming cap crunch, Minnesota is going to keep Hartman as they need his low cap and high potential.

Foligno - With Dumba walking, Foligno is going to stay. Foligno is well liked in Minnesota and is someone that both Evason and Guerin really like. Can't see them moving him for anything.

I don't see Minnesota really doing anything but maybe throwing a 2nd or 3rd at Schenn.

 

[Soldier13Fox]

Dumba - Going to walk at the end of the season. Minnesota is going to see more value out of Dumba than a 2nd or 3rd round pick.

Hartman - Going to chalk it up due to the injuries on why he had such a bad year. With the upcoming cap crunch, Minnesota is going to keep Hartman as they need his low cap and high potential.

Foligno - With Dumba walking, Foligno is going to stay. Foligno is well liked in Minnesota and is someone that both Evason and Guerin really like. Can't see them moving him for anything.

I don't see Minnesota really doing anything but maybe throwing a 2nd or 3rd at Schenn.

I'm so torn with Dumba. I love the guy and losing him for a 2nd round pick or b level prospect would suck, and I agree we'd be at negative value if we did trade him at or before the deadline, but if it's clear he's walking (sure feels like it is) I think we rip the band aid off and get that pick or prospect.

 

[MuckOG]

I'm so torn with Dumba. I love the guy and losing him for a 2nd round pick or b level prospect would suck, and I agree we'd be at negative value if we did trade him at or before the deadline, but if it's clear he's walking (sure feels like it is) I think we rip the band aid off and get that pick or prospect.

I think Dumba has more value to the team this season, even if walks away to UFA. Especially more value than some mid round pick or B level prospect

 

[57special]

I think Dumba has more value to the team this season, even if walks away to UFA. Especially more value than some mid round pick or B level prospect

well, for me, I would be fine with us moving Dumba for a 2nd, and missing the playoffs as a result. In a year like this with so much forward talent, AND my feeling that we won't be good enough to go on a Cup run with Dumba, I think the time is right for a "mini tank".

I don't believe that Guerin or Leipold feel the same, though. They will think that it's a good piece of business to keep Dumba for a mid/late second. I can understand their POV. They have to answer to STH, sponsors, and the players, who will get mighty pissed if they think that the team isn't interested in winning. Not good for morale...those guys aren't robots...well, maybe JEE.

 

[Digitalbooya]

This is gonna be the year we go on a run. I can feel it. Because it makes no sense.

 

[MuckOG]

well, for me, I would be fine with us moving Dumba for a 2nd, and missing the playoffs as a result. In a year like this with so much forward talent, AND my feeling that we won't be good enough to go on a Cup run with Dumba, I think the time is right for a "mini tank".

I don't believe that Guerin or Leipold feel the same, though. They will think that it's a good piece of business to keep Dumba for a mid/late second. I can understand their POV. They have to answer to STH, sponsors, and the players, who will get mighty pissed if they think that the team isn't interested in winning. Not good for morale...those guys aren't robots...well, maybe JEE.

For me, the season is a success if we can make it out of the first round. I believe its important for this team's psyche to prove to themselves they can do it and it will benefit them going forward. Anything more than that is icing on the cake.

 

[MNRube]

I understand the interest in Luke Schenn, but why not look at bringing back Seeler? He’s having a great year analytically and that is with historic anchor Ristolainen as his partner. He is only owed like 0.750M this year and next as well

 

[57special]

I understand the interest in Luke Schenn, but why not look at bringing back Seeler? He’s having a great year analytically and that is with historic anchor Ristolainen as his partner. He is only owed like 0.750M this year and next as well

Because he is not an improvement on anything we have, and would be blocking the LD we have in the system who will be starting to cycle in next year?
Seeler is a 6/7 LHD. We have no shortage of them… as a matter of fact, we have two of them(Merrill and Goli), both signed for next year, as well as ROR and Hunt waiting in the wings.

I don’t see how he is a need, at all. We could use a legit top 4 D, but Seeler is hardly that.

 

[AKL]

Because he is not an improvement on anything we have, and would be blocking the LD we have in the system who will be starting to cycle in next year?
Seeler is a 6/7 LHD. We have no shortage of them… as a matter of fact, we have two of them(Merrill and Goli), both signed for next year, as well as ROR and Hunt waiting in the wings.

I don’t see how he is a need, at all. We could use a legit top 4 D, but Seeler is hardly that.

To be fair, Schenn isn't that either. I think that was his point. Instead of overpaying for Schenn, go after a cheaper version of Schenn.

 

[MNRube]

Because he is not an improvement on anything we have, and would be blocking the LD we have in the system who will be starting to cycle in next year?
Seeler is a 6/7 LHD. We have no shortage of them… as a matter of fact, we have two of them(Merrill and Goli), both signed for next year, as well as ROR and Hunt waiting in the wings.

I don’t see how he is a need, at all. We could use a legit top 4 D, but Seeler is hardly that.

im not a huge analytics guy, but it appears his game has improved

 

[TaLoN]

im not a huge analytics guy, but it appears his game has improved

Improved from fringe NHL'er to solid 3rd pair defender?

 

[AKL]

Improved from fringe NHL'er to solid 3rd pair defender?

Yeah but again, that's all Schenn is, so might as well go for the cheaper one

 

[BagHead]

This is gonna be the year we go on a run. I can feel it. Because it makes no sense.

Just ruined it. Expecting it because it makes no sense makes sense, so now it won't happen.

 

[MNRube]

Improved from fringe NHL'er to solid 3rd pair defender?

Dom from Athletic has his market value as 3.8M and the Seeler-Risto pair is 3rd in the league for xGF% on a bad Philly team. Could be statistical anomaly but I like the contract and I bet he still comes cheap.