Speculation: "Toronto's forward lines look like Swiss cheese" - Jay Rosehill

[OddyOh]

I mean…are any of our forwards even Swiss?

 

[Notsince67]

You cant have Dewar, Janrkok, Kampf, Homlberg taking 4 of your 6 bottom 6 spots

That 4 guys who cant give 2G combined in a series


We are all nobodies posting on here

He played in the NHL and isnt stating anything different from what most of leaf board thinks

Our weakness is our bottom 6 + core 4 going MIA come playoffs


2nd Last in goals per game I believe for the playoffs in R1 serieses

A nobody with a podcast looking for clicks

 

[Community]

We've been spoiled in regards to offensive talent in the Matthews era... From 2006-2016, we never had more than 2x 60pt scorers on the team including multiple years with no players hitting 60pts. To say our forward group this year is poor and "Swiss cheese" is ridiculous.

We have:
- By far the best goalscorer in the league
- Two elite wingers capable of putting up 100+ pts
- A 30-30+ 2nd line C
- Young scoring depth potential (Knies, Robertson, McMann, and potentially Cowan).

Does the forward group look a bit more suspect on paper than previous years? Sure. However, we also have our next wave of youth (Cowan, Robertson, and Minten in particular) trying to push for spots and our defense is better.

It's still top 10 in the league at least and if Cowan/Minten/Robertson don't look good this year then we can easily add a middle 6 forward at the TDL.

 

[RoadWarrior]

We've been spoiled in regards to offensive talent in the Matthews era... From 2006-2016, we never had more than 2x 60pt scorers on the team including multiple years with no players hitting 60pts. To say our forward group this year is poor and "Swiss cheese" is ridiculous.

We have:
- By far the best goalscorer in the league
- Two elite wingers capable of putting up 100+ pts
- A 30-30+ 2nd line C
- Young scoring depth potential (Knies, Robertson, McMann, and potentially Cowan).

Does the forward group look a bit more suspect on paper than previous years? Sure. However, we also have our next wave of youth (Cowan, Robertson, and Minten in particular) trying to push for spots and our defense is better.

It's still top 10 in the league at least and if Cowan/Minten/Robertson don't look good this year then we can easily add a middle 6 forward at the TDL.

The LW spot after Knies is thin but aside from that I don’t think there will be any issues in the regular season. It will only take one young player to emerge to patch the left side.

The D is definitely better and I think you could argue the goaltending is better.

 

[TimeZone]

Come-on, tell the truth.
FACT....you are somewhat invested if you still follow fan forums.

I mean I'll catch some games, but I have less expectations since Matthews rookie year, it isn't even close.

This season is a wash before it even starts.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

I wonder if the holes in the roster have anything to do with the Leafs well thought out cap structure.

A good rule of thumb is to not spend more on the top four wingers than the top four defensemen. The Leafs have $22.5M in two wingers alone. Their entire defense is at $22.9M.

Everyone knows the team is built wrong.

I despair over what could have been. The saddest thing is that everything turned out pretty much how detractors said it would. Aside from the idiot owner letting the idiot POHO hire another idiot GM.

Shanahan should have been fired along with his protege last year.

The four forward experiment has been a massive and costly boondoggle on the world's largest hockey stage. Now this pretender contender is entering it's ninth season. With the exact same holes in the roster that were there all those previous humiliating failures.

Should easily be eight cups in the next four years when the Matthews contract expires.

 

[colchar]

We would do well to listen to someone who was such an elite offensive player during his career.

 

[notbias]

I wonder if the holes in the roster have anything to do with the Leafs well thought out cap structure.

A good rule of thumb is to not spend more on the top four wingers than the top four defensemen. The Leafs have $22.5M in two wingers alone. Their entire defense is at $22.9M.

Everyone knows the team is built wrong.

I despair over what could have been. The saddest thing is that everything turned out pretty much how detractors said it would. Aside from the idiot owner letting the idiot POHO hire another idiot GM.

Shanahan should have been fired along with his protege last year.

The four forward experiment has been a massive and costly boondoggle on the world's largest hockey stage. Now this pretender contender is entering it's ninth season. With the exact same holes in the roster that were there all those previous humiliating failures.

Should easily be eight cups in the next four years when the Matthews contract expires.

So the forward group looks bad because they spent too much on forwards? Makes sense.

The difference is just Bertuzzi no? I don't think Rosehill has a clue honestly.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

So the forward group looks bad because they spent too much on forwards? Makes sense.

The difference is just Bertuzzi no? I don't think Rosehill has a clue honestly.

I am going to look at TOR from a NO GUARANTEE HOCKEY lens.

No guarantee Minton/Cowan make the team.

No guarantee Minton/Cowan play heavy hockey in the playoffs.

No guarantee Robertson will be playing for TOR.

No guarantee Reaves comes to camp in shape. He might stumble like he did at the start of last season.

No guarantee Toronto will have a 3rd line C. Who is it? Domi, Kampf, or Abruzzese?

No guarantee Dewer is going to be more than what he already is.

Will McMann stay healthy? No guarantees.

There are plenty of questions and too many hopeful things.

This is Swiss cheese. If you're a cynical leafs fan you might call it cottage cheese.

 

[notbias]

I am going to look at TOR from a NO GUARANTEE HOCKEY lens.

No guarantee Minton/Cowan make the team.

No guarantee Minton/Cowan play heavy hockey in the playoffs.

No guarantee Robertson will be playing for TOR.

No guarantee Reaves comes to camp in shape. He might stumble like he did at the start of last season.

No guarantee Toronto will have a 3rd line C. Who is it? Domi, Kampf, or Abruzzese?

No guarantee Dewer is going to be more than what he already is.

Will McMann stay healthy? No guarantees.

There are plenty of questions and too many hopeful things.

This is Swiss cheese. If you're a cynical leafs fan you might call it cottage cheese.

All the same questions last year...

Bertuzzi - Matthews - Marner
Domi - Tavares - Nylander
Knies - Minten - Jarnkrok
Gregor - Kampf - Reaves

You can roll out the same lines except replace Bertuzzi with McMann and Gregor with Dewar...

Then you also have Holmberg who is better than Minten, and then a bunch of guys challenging for spots, who I hope push out Reaves and Dewar.

The forwards are essentially the same, they may even end up improving, Bertuzzi is not a big loss.

And yes, you listed a bunch of questions... every team has those and they all existed last year too.

 

[ULF_55]

I'm looking forward to the changes.
I think it is going to be pretty gouda.

Knies-Matthews(54%)-marner
Holmberg-Domi(50%)-Nylander
McMann-Tavares(59%)-Grebyonkin
Dewar-Kampf(51%)-Jarnkrok

On Deck: Robertson, Reaves, Minten


Rielly-Tanev
McCabe-OEL (Note 1)
Benoit-Liljegren
Hakanpaa

Woll
Stolarz

Note
1. Not only did OEL step up in a big way for the Cats, the left-shooting rearguard played on the right side and didn’t skip a beat.

https://thehockeynews.com/nhl/florida-panthers/features/chasing-his-first-stanley-cup-oliver-ekman-larsson-fitting-in-perfectly-with-florida-panthers

OEL was unhealthy while with the Canucks, 2 seasons foot injuries.

 

[notDatsyuk]

I am going to look at TOR from a NO GUARANTEE HOCKEY lens.

No guarantee Minton/Cowan make the team.

No guarantee Minton/Cowan play heavy hockey in the playoffs.

No guarantee Robertson will be playing for TOR.

No guarantee Reaves comes to camp in shape. He might stumble like he did at the start of last season.

No guarantee Toronto will have a 3rd line C. Who is it? Domi, Kampf, or Abruzzese?

No guarantee Dewer is going to be more than what he already is.

Will McMann stay healthy? No guarantees.

There are plenty of questions and too many hopeful things.

This is Swiss cheese. If you're a cynical leafs fan you might call it cottage cheese.

No guarantee Matthews doesn't break his leg on the first day of camp.

No guarantee Tavares doesn't suddenly become an 80 goal scorer.

No guarantees in this life.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Kuznetzov's contract has been terminated, he had a poor year in 2024 but had 55 points in 2023.

Team needs a top 6 winger, U think It's worth a conversation with his agent

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I am going to look at TOR from a NO GUARANTEE HOCKEY lens.

No guarantee Minton/Cowan make the team.

No guarantee Minton/Cowan play heavy hockey in the playoffs.

No guarantee Robertson will be playing for TOR.

No guarantee Reaves comes to camp in shape. He might stumble like he did at the start of last season.

No guarantee Toronto will have a 3rd line C. Who is it? Domi, Kampf, or Abruzzese?

No guarantee Dewer is going to be more than what he already is.

Will McMann stay healthy? No guarantees.

There are plenty of questions and too many hopeful things.

This is Swiss cheese. If you're a cynical leafs fan you might call it cottage cheese.

I guarantee Toronto will have a 3rd line center because they are required too.

 

[Hellcat]

I mean…are any of our forwards even Swiss?

No one? No one is giving this post any love.... y'all suck...

 

[Sypher04]

Kuznetzov's contract has been terminated, he had a poor year in 2024 but had 55 points in 2023.

Team needs a top 6 winger, U think It's worth a conversation with his agent

I was under the impression Carolina agreed to terminate his deal to allow Kuznetsov to return to the KHL. I could see there being some legal fallout if he turns around and signs with another NHL club.

 

[myleafs]

No guarantee Matthews doesn't break his leg on the first day of camp.

No guarantee Tavares doesn't suddenly become an 80 goal scorer.

No guarantees in this life.

I can/will absolutely guarantee he won't

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I was under the impression Carolina agreed to terminate his deal to allow Kuznetsov to return to the KHL. I could see there being some legal fallout if he turns around and signs with another NHL club.

He has no contract, I don't think they can stop him.

Even if they could they just freed up a bunch of cap space

 

[Ianturnedbull]

All the same questions last year...

Bertuzzi - Matthews - Marner
Domi - Tavares - Nylander
Knies - Minten - Jarnkrok
Gregor - Kampf - Reaves

You can roll out the same lines except replace Bertuzzi with McMann and Gregor with Dewar...

Then you also have Holmberg who is better than Minten, and then a bunch of guys challenging for spots, who I hope push out Reaves and Dewar.

The forwards are essentially the same, they may even end up improving, Bertuzzi is not a big loss.

And yes, you listed a bunch of questions... every team has those and they all existed last year too.

Last year's forward depth (especially in the playoffs) was ripe horseshit.

I am not even talking about Bertuzzi, or how Toronto will survive without him.

It's OK though. Treliving has all offseason up to the deadline to find some players who are a lot more proven.

I didn't read Rosehill's "Swiss Cheese" as: not going to make the playoffs this season.

 

[notbias]

Last year's forward depth (especially in the playoffs) was ripe horseshit.

I am not even talking about Bertuzzi, or how Toronto will survive without him.

It's OK though. Treliving has all offseason up to the deadline to find some players who are a lot more proven.

I didn't read Rosehill's "Swiss Cheese" as: not going to make the playoffs this season.

our biggest issue was our D were terrible. I am hoping Treliving sticks to a plan this year and doesn't attempt to crosscheck the puck into the net again.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

No guarantee Matthews doesn't break his leg on the first day of camp.

No guarantee Tavares doesn't suddenly become an 80 goal scorer.

No guarantees in this life.

Mmm...

Matthews, Nylander, and Woll all had head scratching no shows in the first round of the playoffs last year. You're right.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Mmm...

Matthews, Nylander, and Woll all had head scratching no shows in the first round of the playoffs last year. You're right.

Gee - I thought they were the only three who DID show.

I'm always right, thanks for noticing.

 

[trellaine201]

Jay was a great player. It’s too bad he isn’t running our team. He has so many accomplishments. Too many to name.

 

[ULF_55]

I guarantee Toronto will have a 3rd line center because they are required too.

Knies-Matthews-marner
Domi-Tavares-Nylander
McMann-Lindt-Holmberg
Dewar-Kampf-Jarnkrok

On Deck: Robertson, Reaves, Minten


Rielly-Tanev
McCabe-OEL
Benoit-Liljegren
Hakanpaa

Woll
Stolarz

 

[mydnyte]

Goal scoring Expectations for a full season and a regular shift
50+ goal scorers: Matthews
40+ goal scorers: Nylander
30+ goal scorers: Tavares, Marner
20+ goal scorers: Knies, McMann, Robertson
10+ goal scorers: Domi, Jarnkrok, Holmberg

if Knies, McMann, Robertson play 15+ mins a night and the full season, 20+ should be reached.
I'm sorry, but, not many teams can stack up against this, even if you drop all the 20+ players to the 10-20 list.