Black and white, no context, did you win past series or not is a pretty lazy and inaccurate way to evaluate a team's current potential to win, or a GM.
Toronto Maple Leafs: Who Would Replace Kyle Dubas?
- Thread starter Osmows OReilly
- Start date
-
Xenforo Cloud will be upgrading us to version 2.3.5 on March 3rd at 12 AM GMT. This version has increased stability and fixes several bugs. We expect downtime for the duration of the update. The admin team will continue to work on existing issues, templates and upgrade all necessary available addons to minimize impact of this new version. Click Here for Updates
WTFMAN99
Registered User
- Jun 17, 2009
- 34,577
- 12,741
Bulk of the team is made up of players that have historically not been able to win a series.
What you're actually coming back with is lazy. You haven't explained why this group is suddenly capable of winning a playoff series.
Canadian Finn
Oskee Wee Wee
It's obviously not that simplistic, no matter how many different ways you find to say the same thing.
- Dec 12, 2017
- 25,872
- 12,350
Don’t you think they have too many holes to be considered a Cup contender right now?
Im not saying it necessarily should bring them back, itd depend on circumstance for me, but i think a round will be enough for it to happen
WTFMAN99
Registered User
- Jun 17, 2009
- 34,577
- 12,741
You're the one that has been repeating yourself without explaining how team with largely the same roster will suddenly win a series when it has failed to do so.
The same way every other team does. We have plenty of paths to a series win. The roster is not the same, and considering how close we've come through some pretty unfavourable situations, I don't know why you're acting like one different bounce requires a team overhaul.
WTFMAN99
Registered User
- Jun 17, 2009
- 34,577
- 12,741
When you don't get the bounce in as many series as we've been in, it doesn't seem like it's a bounce away anymore.
Anyways, it's been fun watching you spin again.
If thats the case, whats the point of even betting on our core.
The job is to build a team that could win the Cup with a little luck.
Personally, no team is perfect even the Bruins. I will even go on and state that if the Bruins is the Leafs(players and records), we will be going on about Ulmark is not proven in playoffs. The team is led by their aging core that might run out of gas comes April.....But bc they are the Bruins, they seem to be perfect-which they are very close and is the best team in Hockey.
Point I am trying to make is that no team is perfect and no team is a proven winner until they win but at the same time, we need to ask can the players do it collectively?
Maybe our boys just can't do it collectively, or they could this playoffs. Ovie and Backstorm were long time Caps before winning but when they finally won, guys who once thought as their core(Green, Semin and others) were not part of the winning core. That applies to pretty much every team that won the Cup.
Talentwise, our boys are as good as any teams in the league, but mentality wise, I don't think they are there yet. Playoffs is a grind and players just need to keep going at it till they win 4 in 7 and 16 games in total, something they have not done collectively.
The question is not another first round exit but rather can our core(JT, AM, MM, Willie, and Reilly) do it. To me, I still believe they can not bc of their regular season records or advance stats but bc Gio choose to stay with them on a 850K contract. If Gio is chasing the Cup-which he should due to his age, he could have sign that contract with TB, Avs, Bruins.... and all these teams would welcome him with open arms, but he signed with us. Thats the strongest piece of evidence to suggest our boys can do it and we just need to wait a few more months to see if Gio made the right choice.
Need to be more than a round, winning a round is really nothing special. It only seems special bc we have not win a round for the past 6 seasons
Stephen
Moderator
- Feb 28, 2002
- 82,913
- 61,680
If we go with your version of events, do you agree to assign Dubas all the blame for the poor drafts from 2015, 2016 and 2017, aka Rasanen, Gordeev, Korshkov, Middleton? Or was Dubas out taking a walk when all the poor decisions were being made?
Leaf Fans
Registered User
- Sep 29, 2017
- 21,374
- 9,344
Also, for some Dubas haters Dubas not being GM is more important than the team having success.
Stephen
Moderator
- Feb 28, 2002
- 82,913
- 61,680
Here's Hunter making the pick like a proud pappa.
But apparently it was Dubas who rationally convinced Hunter to draft the superstar junior from the junior franchise he himself owned with his brother Dale.
This is where context matters. A killer instinct series vs. tb where we win, take Bos to 7 and lose in OT then they walk over everyone else to a cup looks a lot different than beating up a bad round 1 opponent then losing to a mediocre team even though both would be a rd 1 victory
Who knows what will happen, but thatd give me pause personally on management coming back (the first scenario)
It might make you feel defeated forever, but that doesn't make it true. We very literally have been a bounce away, and literally nothing suggests we need a team overhaul to win.
Maybe one of our fresh new goalies will provide that one extra save. Maybe one of our new depth pieces, or a core member - healthy and in their primes - will provide that one extra goal. Maybe we don't only face one of the best goalies of the playoffs this year. Maybe we get one less critical mistake at a critical time, with more experience. Maybe our opponent doesn't get handed a 5 on 3 and waived off goal against on the brink of elimination this time. Lots of possibilities to flip that miniscule difference in outcome.
The only spinning happening here is from you, pretending that we're far away because you ignore everything outside contextless past series outcomes to determine current potential.
hotpaws
Registered User
- Nov 21, 2009
- 22,088
- 6,661
only Dubies lovers believe that since for some reason they've become extremely emotionally attached to him
- Dec 12, 2017
- 25,872
- 12,350
Do you really think the D, Goaltending, PP, PK can all catch fore and carry this group through four rounds?
Even if they find bodies to plug in, it‘ll take time to gel.
What does 2016 and 2017 have to do anything? Dubas wasn't GM during those years. If you want to attribute 2015 partially to him, go nuts, though I hope you recognize the difference in his influence as co-GM on a 4th overall pick vs. a 2nd to 7th round pick.
Here's GM Dubas standing next to his pick on the draft stage like a proud pappa.
But apparently it was Hunter who fought off everybody else in the organization to pick somebody that everybody else hated and would never have picked despite perfectly matching the exact type of player Dubas would target.
Stephen
Moderator
- Feb 28, 2002
- 82,913
- 61,680
What does 2016 and 2017 have to do anything? Dubas wasn't GM during those years. If you want to attribute 2015 partially to him, go nuts, though I hope you recognize the difference in his influence as co-GM on a 4th overall pick vs. a 2nd to 7th round pick.
Here's GM Dubas standing next to his pick on the draft stage like a proud pappa.
But apparently it was Hunter who fought off everybody else in the organization to pick somebody that everybody else hated and would never have picked despite perfectly matching the exact type of player Dubas would target.
Oh ok, so do we blame Dubas for botching the rest of the 2015 draft, or did he have the day off on the second day of the draft so all the bad stuff happened when he was away and Hunter could play?
PromisedLand
I need more FOOD
It really is a cult sadly.
Who in their right mind would be calling out dubas or have problem with dubas if leafs were making deep playoff runs, or had won the cup. Who?
Its the results; and then the way some people defend these results and this gm that really ticks "Real" Maple Leafs fans off; given the context that leafs had just rebuilt; had plenty of cap space and look at the putrid playoff results.
Racer88
Registered User
- Sep 29, 2020
- 13,046
- 13,169
This is my personal favourite along with the other truism in racing
winners get paid and winners get laid
As I already said, you can attribute 2015 partially to him if you want, since he was co-GM, though at the same time it's pretty disingenuous to pretend that there isn't a massive difference between a franchise-defining 4th overall pick, and 2nd-7th round picks, when discussing the amount of influence Dubas would have.
PromisedLand
I need more FOOD
Is it though? I can't see the Leafs beating Tampa unless Dubas has a monster TDL.
Latest posts
-
-
Martin Erat crashes DUI, sped away from the scene.- Latest: spintheblackcircle
-
