Confirmed with Link: Torey Krug (7 years @ $6.5m)

[Itsnotatrap]

After sleeping on it i hate hate hate the signing. I can't believe some of the fanbase are literally creaming their pants fawning over the new guy.

I’m 99% sure this is an improper use of the word literally. I sure hope so, at least.

 

[TruBlu]

The closest thing to the truth I've seen. Two sides to the story.

 

[Vladys Gumption]

Here’s where I’m at right now. Under different circumstances I would actually be pretty happy with snagging Krug. The guy is absolutely an offensive weapon, even if his numbers are inflated by the Boston PP.

I’ll go so far as to say if not for Faulk then I would still like this deal because we’d have room to go sign a defensive defenseman. We’d be in decent shape if that were the case.

But as things are, I just cannot do anything but feel that Doug Armstrong completely and totally bungled the last year. How you turn Alex Pietrangelo into the albatross that is Justin Faulk plus a Torey Krug is nearly beyond belief. This team simply is not a true Cup contender as currently constructed.

 

[Novacain]

I'm not seeing any debating. I see one side basically saying hand AP what we wants regardless of the consequences for the team without knowing anything about what was offered and another side saying they aren't comfortable doing that if it means other issues can't be addressed. I've also not seen one single person say they'd rather have Krug over AP. If AP comes out tomorrow and says he's been eyeing vegas for a while and he wasn't staying in st. Louis without overpayment then every single person on here who has been calling for DA's head is going to look really silly. The fact that he actually went to ufa to see what was being offered is proof enough he wasn't sold on staying here. This isn't all on either side, but we won't be able to make an educated decision until the dust settles and both sides stories come out.

By the way, still waiting for a response to my question in the Pietrangelo thread about how this team as currently constructed, can win the cup. I gave you my answer, still waiting for yours.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

Of course I'm venting. We just let an elite defenseman walk so we could overpay another Vince Dunn. Then we have fans lapping it up like it's a great move. Hell there was one guy who legit said thank you DA for not letting us be the next Chicago as if Chicago didn't get 3 cups in 6 years precisely because they ponied up for their stars.

Lord I wish we could be Chicago. Would gladly trade take the couple of down years they've had in return for multiple Cups and Pietrangelo and maybe a couple other numbers hanging in the rafters.

Krug is another Dunn in same way that a Ferrari is another Fiat. There is superficial truth in that they are both cars, but 1 is nothing like the other. Krug and Dunn are both smallish defensemen with offensive bent, but 1 of them is far superior than the other at basically all facets of the game.

 

[TruBlu]

By the way, still waiting for a response to my question in the Pietrangelo thread about how this team as currently constructed, can win the cup. I gave you my answer, still waiting for yours.

I can't give you any. We don't have a set roster yet and we don't know how some of the question marks will turn out (tank/benny). We also don't know what AP was asking for to see what we have left in cap to work with to address those issues. We don't know if he was even going to stay. You've set up a scenario in your head where you wanted Petro kept at all costs and then go from there, regardless of how other things played out. Based on that I can see why you're upset, but real life doesn't work that way. I'll respond when I have all of the info to do so.

 

[BlueMed]

Those saying we aren't a contender with Krug, let me ask you this: was Boston a contender with Krug? Was Boston's defense in 2019 not good enough?

Chara McAvoy
Krug Carlo
Moore Clifton

Obviously we aren't as good as we were last year, but this team will still be good.

 

[Novacain]

Those saying we aren't a contender with Krug, let me ask you this: was Boston a contender with Krug? Was Boston's defense in 2019 not good enough?

Chara McAvoy
Krug Carlo
Moore Clifton

Counter Point: How much better is Pararnak/Bergeron/Marchand as a line to anything we can put now, especially with Tarasenko's injuries? There defense would be at a similar level to ours, but they had significantly more forward talent then we do now.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Too good not to post.

 

[Em etah Eh]

Those were two different signings made under two different circumstances. If AP wasn't going to sign here anyway then everything you just wrote is moot. This could be a situation like we had with Shatty. We heard over and over about how he wanted to stay here and the first chance he got he took off for NY. I think the circumstances are a little different this time as AP seems to be chasing money and nmc assurances. Either way, until we know what transpired, in the order that it did, we have speculation going on and not debate on articulable facts

Nothing with the Petro situation leads me to believe he wanted out from the get go. Half his family is from here. If this was a Shatty situation he would have signed right away in Toronto. If he signs in Vegas, we’re saying that he had his sights on leaving for the desert all along? Or that, he just “wanted out”? Not buying that at all.

 

[TruBlu]

Counter Point: How much better is Pararnak/Bergeron/Marchand as a line to anything we can put now, especially with Tarasenko's injuries? There defense would be at a similar level to ours, but they had significantly more forward talent then we do now.

Yet you'd give AP anything he asked for even if it kept us from addressing the very concern you just brought up. Things don't work in a vacuum.

 

[BlueMed]

Counter Point: How much better is Pararnak/Bergeron/Marchand as a line to anything we can put now, especially with Tarasenko's injuries? There defense would be at a similar level to ours, but they had significantly more forward talent then we do now.

Counter point: Didn't putting all of those players on the same line hurt their depth? If you compare rosters, rather than sheer point totals, the talent is very very comparable to Boston's upfront.

ROR=Bergeron
Tarasenko=Pasta
Schwartz<Marchand
Schenn>Krecji
Perron>MoJo
Thomas>Debrusk

Let's not act like Boston has better talent upfront than we do. We are mirror images of each other.

 

[Novacain]

Yet you'd give AP anything he asked for even if it kept us from addressing the very concern you just brought up. Things don't work in a vacuum.

.... We signed Krug, a worse version of Pietrangelo, and didn't sign any forwards worth a crap. And if we sign Petro, hey, what do you know, we have a significantly better defense then the Bruins had! Like we did in the Cup, which we won because we had due in large part to us having an elite defense! Go figure.

 

[Falco Lombardi]

Krug is another Dunn in same way that a Ferrari is another Fiat. There is superficial truth in that they are both cars, but 1 is nothing like the other. Krug and Dunn are both smallish defensemen with offensive bent, but 1 of them is far superior than the other at basically all facets of the game.

If I can’t trust him in final minute of a game up a goal, then he is of zero interest to me on a team already employing Justin Faulk and Vince Dunn in its top 4.

 

[BlueMed]

.... We signed Krug, a worse version of Pietrangelo, and didn't sign any forwards worth a crap. And if we sign Petro, hey, what do you know, we have a significantly better defense then the Bruins had! Like we did in the Cup, which we won because we had due in large part to us having an elite defense! Go figure.

You are acting like Army didn't want to sign Petro. You keep assuming that Army didn't know that Petro was the better defensemen. There are TWO sides to every negotiation. Clearly what Army was offering to Petro was not enough for him. Even look at Toronto yesterday. They spoke to Petro and gave up signing Brodie a few hours later.

 

[TruBlu]

Nothing with the Petro situation leads me to believe he wanted out from the get go. Half his family is from here. If this was a Shatty situation he would have signed right away in Toronto. If he signs in Vegas, we’re saying that he had his sights on leaving for the desert all along? Or that, he just “wanted out”? Not buying that at all.

Just because you don't buy it doesn't mean it's not the truth. It doesn't necessarily mean he was after the weather. He's 30 living in st. Louis. It could very well be he wants to go somewhere like vegas where there's a lot to do for a young couple. There's direct flights back where his wife could come home and see family on road trips. The reason really doesn't matter. It's the fact that we just don't know.

 

[Novacain]

You are acting like Army didn't want to sign Petro. You keep assuming that Army didn't know that Petro was the better defensemen. There are TWO sides to every negotiation.

Yes. And if Army wasn't willing to go full No Movement or much past 8 million which is what things seem to be pointing at, Army set a hardline stance that was lower then what he could and should have offered.

 

[The Note]

Counter point: Didn't putting all of those players on the same line hurt their depth? If you compare rosters, rather than sheer point totals, the talent is very very comparable to Boston's upfront.

ROR=Bergeron
Tarasenko=Pasta
Schwartz<Marchand
Schenn>Krecji
Perron>MoJo
Thomas>Debrusk

Let's not act like Boston has better talent upfront than we do. We are mirror images of each other.

Pastrnak is far, far better than Tarasenko at this point. And Marchand is far, far better than Schwartz. Those gulfs in talent do matter.

 

[BlueMed]

Yes. And if Army wasn't willing to go full No Movement or much past 8 million which is what things seem to be pointing at, Army set a hardline stance that was lower then what he could and should have offered.

You seem to act like you are so familiar with the Blues' finances. In reality, none of us fans truly know what it's like to be a GM. We don't know what it's really like to work with the ownership group when it comes to paying up. Obviously Army didn't want his captain to walk away. You guys seem to keep acting like that.

 

[Majorityof1]

I am going to try to clarify my stance so people maybe stop the strawman-ing. Let's break things down into 3 distinct parts.

1) Blues trade for and sign Faulk as a pre-emptive move
2) Blues Sign Krug
3) Blues lose Pietrangelo.

Any 2 of those does not sink us. Sure people might be upset at any of them, but not this upset. It's the combination of all 3 that sink us. Without Pietrangelo, we don't have the horses to cover those 2 guys. We cannot have them both on our team. The contract lengths and amount make it difficult for us to go out in the future and somehow get a better Pietrangelo replacement. The two sheltered big name D leave little room for us to groom our younger players who are similar (Dunn and Perunovich).

If we signed Faulk and lost Pie, we could wait and try to find a better fit with the money we offered Pietrangelo. Maybe make a run at Hamilton next year if he pops free or trade for someone.
If we signed Krug and lost Pie with not Faulk, same thing.
If we had all 3, I'm not sure how cap works but at least we have the horses to cover those guys. We move Dunn. Have Parayko-Scandella be the shut down pair, with Pietrangelo helping cover Krug and Faulk sheltered on the 3rd line.

As we are, we have no viable pairings that doesn't leave a sub-standard defensive player exposed against good competition regularly. This will not change for 7 years.

 

[TruBlu]

.... We signed Krug, a worse version of Pietrangelo, and didn't sign any forwards worth a crap. And if we sign Petro, hey, what do you know, we have a significantly better defense then the Bruins had! Like we did in the Cup, which we won because we had due in large part to us having an elite defense! Go figure.

Haven't signed anyone yet you mean. The irony is we'll have more cash to make moves by not throwing the bank at one guy.

 

[BlueMed]

Pastrnak is far, far better than Tarasenko at this point. And Marchand is far, far better than Schwartz. Those gulfs in talent do matter.

Pasta is far better than Tarasenko at this point? Did you watch the SCF? Tarasenko was the much more impactful player in that series. Pasta like his other linemates that series were invisible.

 

[The Note]

Haven't signed anyone yet you mean. The irony is we'll have more cash to make moves by not throwing the bank at one guy.

They’ve thrown the bank at two lesser guys. I’m going to just keep posting it because it needs repeating. They have $13 million tied up in Faulk and Krug. Until well into their 30’s.

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

Those saying we aren't a contender with Krug, let me ask you this: was Boston a contender with Krug? Was Boston's defense in 2019 not good enough?

Chara McAvoy
Krug Carlo
Moore Clifton

Obviously we aren't as good as we were last year, but this team will still be good.

We are seeing teams being gutted around the league. Many worthwhile RFAs were not qualified out of fear of arbitration deals that would break their Cap. Tyler Johnson was placed on waivers, flat out. Fleury is being shopped with compensation and still no takers.

A lot of teams are going to look different. The depth isn’t going to be there for some of them, needing to rely on ELC players. There will also be some UFA guys who sign for less than they expected. The Blues still look pretty competitive to me, and if Steen is out then I expect another move is still in store.

 

[Novacain]

Counter point: Didn't putting all of those players on the same line hurt their depth? If you compare rosters, rather than sheer point totals, the talent is very very comparable to Boston's upfront.

ROR=Bergeron
Tarasenko=Pasta
Schwartz<Marchand
Schenn>Krecji
Perron>MoJo
Thomas>Debrusk

Let's not act like Boston has better talent upfront than we do. We are mirror images of each other.

For one thing, Tarasenko does not = Pasta. Pasta is superior player. He's put up 80 points 3 straight years in a row and put up 90 last year. Tarasenko never topped out at 75.

Oh, and also if we are arguing for right now, Tarasenko is on his 3rd shoulder surgery, and he's a guy whose defining skill is his wrist shot. So remove Tarasenko from the equation completely, and bump Perron to that spot as a comparable to Pasta. In which case it's a wider gap on the side for Pasta. And high end talent absolutely does matter in the playoffs, and we are short on it.