OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: Super Bowl 50

[hb13xchamps]

They did the same thing with Brady. Only they lucked out with a 6th rnd pick instead of a 1st rnd. THAT is more the exception to the rule than how GB got Rodgers who went 24# overall.

QB's in this league need time to groom and learn. You start looking for that heir apparent around 3-4 yrs out from the time your franchise QB is about done. Ben has shown to be more injury prone this year. That doesn't improve with age. If not this draft then 2017 is the time to seriously start looking for his replacement. For those of us that remember and remember well the post TB era, trust me when I say you do not want to go through that.

I don't get why people are saying this? Be gets a nasty knee injury and comes back this year and has torn ligaments in his throwing shoulder and plays the next game. Both were the outcomes of two hard hits that would end the seasons of a lot of players how does that make him "injury prone"

 

[OnMyOwn]

People have no clue what injury prone means...it does not mean freak injuries that others inflict on you. It's more along the line of hamstring, groin, hernia, etc. injuries your body is at fault for.

 

[Cherpak]

I don't get why people are saying this? Be gets a nasty knee injury and comes back this year and has torn ligaments in his throwing shoulder and plays the next game. Both were the outcomes of two hard hits that would end the seasons of a lot of players how does that make him "injury prone"

He was injured 4 different times this yr. Thats the most he has been injured in one season in his career.



No one here is advocating replacing Ben now. We are just saying that the team needs to start looking.


As the saying goes, "people don't plan to fail, they fail to plan".

 

[hb13xchamps]

What was Ben supposed to do differently yesterday? He threw for over 300 yards, he made good reads and didn't turn the ball over. It was not Ben who decided to call nothing but screens and runs up the middle for 2 quarters of the game in the name of holding on to a 4 point lead.

He's the only QB to throw for 300 yards against the Broncos this season and he did it twice, second time without AB and a bad shoulder. Ben didn't lose that game.

 

[Cherpak]

People have no clue what injury prone means...it does not mean freak injuries that others inflict on you. It's more along the line of hamstring, groin, hernia, etc. injuries your body is at fault for.

Fair enough.. He gets injured A LOT. Thats not going to change the older he gets. And his body will start to become more injury PRONE as he ages. Thats just a fact of life.

 

[hb13xchamps]

Hopefully Pittsburgh uses their first rounder on the secondary or help on the DL (Tuitt and Cam played a ton this year and need some help). The secondary is obviously the biggest need with William Gay, Will Allen, Antwon Blake, Robert Golden and Brandon Boykin all hitting free agency. I wouldn't mind bringing Boykin back for the right deal. He played well when he actually got in the game

 

[bambamcam4ever]

Matt Cassell is average to below average. The Patriots didn't even make the playoffs that season. He actually played better two years later (I think my memory is bad now ha) for the Chiefs.

He certainly should have been in the NFL. He did adequate on decidedly average Chiefs teams

And if the system is better on QB's, so what? Isn't that smart for New England to play to their strengths?

Leinart was chosen over Cassel at USC despite being a junior while Cassel was a senior. Matt Leinart now is an analyst for football games.

When Cassel was with the Vikings a few years ago, it was his 5th or 6th start and a stat popped up saying Cassel had not completed a pass over 10 yards past the LOS. That is inexcusable for an "NFL quarterback." I can complete 6 or 7 yard passes underneath the defense, it's not hard, and they could pay me much less than the $60 million contract that Cassel received.

Cassel is awful, and it is a testament to how incompetent a large number of NFL GMs are that he is still employed. He hasn't even been able to complete 60% of his passes since he left NE despite throwing dink and dunk passes every play.

 

[Cherpak]

Hopefully Pittsburgh uses their first rounder on the secondary or help on the DL (Tuitt and Cam played a ton this year and need some help). The secondary is obviously the biggest need with William Gay, Will Allen, Antwon Blake, Robert Golden and Brandon Boykin all hitting free agency. I wouldn't mind bringing Boykin back for the right deal. He played well when he actually got in the game

I fully expect them to take either a safety or LB/DE.

I'm not sure whats available in this draft but if they continue with a 3-4 then they need to start looking for a true NT. Thats what makes the 3-4 go. Since Hampton retired the LBs just haven't been as effective.

 

[DanielPlainview]

They'll try to bring Gay back, for sure.

I'm hoping they let Blake walk, but Tomlin seems to want to father his children.

I don't see the Steelers and Boykin working things out.

That gives them a CB unit of:
Allen
Blake
Cockrell
Gay
Golson
Grant

The draft will tell us how they feel about Golson and Grant.

Will Allen will be 34. I could see him getting a one year deal.

Golden is a special teamer. If they don't see a future for him beyond that, unless Allen retires or isn't re-signed, I can't see them bringing him back.

 

[ColePens]

Last little bit for this thread to be stickied. Just a reminder - you can find the thread by searching for it The Jolly Roger (thread) will be raised (stickied) soon.

 

[td_ice]

Last little bit for this thread to be stickied. Just a reminder - you can find the thread by searching for it The Jolly Roger (thread) will be raised (stickied) soon.

great usage there........haha

 

[Big McLargehuge]

I agree. James surprised me this year with how well he did. I did not expect it.

I didn't expect him to survive the first cut, to be honest...I thought nothing of James at Penn State. He showed he can be a pass catcher in this league...probably not a #1 TE, but he should make for a nice #2 and that helps ease the transition away from Miller.


That said, I do want a TE drafted earlier in one of the next two drafts. Miller's hands aren't as sure as they used to be and his body is breaking down.

Last little bit for this thread to be stickied. Just a reminder - you can find the thread by searching for it The Jolly Roger (thread) will be raised (stickied) soon.

Normally I'd make the argument that this should stay as a general purpose non-hockey sports thread...but until March there's really nothing to talk about anyway aside from the Super Bowl.

Where else will people go for their off-season MLS rumors?




On that note, the LA Galaxy look close to signing a Belgian guy named Jelle François Maria Van Damme, so...**** yeah.

 

[JTG]

I'd personally like to see the Steelers go the FA route if there is a really great young corner to be had. Give him the money, give him the term. It's a hole that we really cannot wait any longer on.

I'd rather use the draft to supplement what we have. I think finding an Eifert type TE would help us tremendously. Jesse James is good, but probably a 2nd stringer, and Heath is getting long in the tooth. Bring in that stud TE that creates matchup nightmares. I'd also like to see us use a 1st rounder on a safety. Keep Mike Mitchell, and put a young guy opposite him that can really play center field.

I'm also to see what happens with Villanueva and Wallace. I think both proven to be serviceable starters.

 

[Mordax]

I agree. James surprised me this year with how well he did. I did not expect it.

I laughed when he came in the game yesterday, picked up a completion for 22 yards, and then was promptly benched for the rest of the game.

 

[JTG]

He definitely didn't get utilized enough, especially when he was proving he could play some ball. If we can get a TE to stretch seams down the field, James is a perfect complement to a 2 TE set where he works intermediate routes in the middle of the field and just gashes teams.

I think our front 7 is pretty well solidified. I hope McCullers can come in and really make a splash in training camp next season. That'd give us one of the youngest, strongest, and athletic 3-4 defensive lines in the league, and potentially one of the most athletic ones the league has ever seen.

Jones has proven to me he's at least a serviceable starter this season. I expect Dupree to take a step next season under his belt. Really the big question mark is Shazier and his health. When he's on the field, we're so good.

A lockdown corner would make that front 7 even more dangerous than it already is. Here's the free agent list...

osh Norman
Janoris Jenkins
Prince Amukamara
Casey Hayward
Sean Smith
Pacman Jones
Trumaine Johnson
Patrick Robinson
Brandon Boykin
Leon Hall
Jerraud Powers
Tracy Porter
Terence Newman
Greg Toler
Jeremy Lane
Will Blackmon
Coty Sensabaugh
Charles Tillman
William Gay
Tarell Brown
Trumaine McBride
Josh Robinson
Morris Claiborne
Shareece Wright
Ron Brooks
Nolan Carroll
Antwon Blake
Sterling Moore
E.J. Biggers
Marcus Sherels
Darrin Walls
Cary Williams
Kyle Wilson
Cortland Finnegan
Johnson Bademosi
Jamell Fleming
Corey White
Alan Ball
Josh Wilson
Jayron Hosley
Mike Jenkins
Cassius Vaughn
Sherrick McManis
Brandon Harris

 

[Big McLargehuge]

Trumaine Johnson, please

 

[KIRK]

Trumaine Johnson, please

That-- and frankly going after any impact corner or even a legit starting corner-- in free agency would be a 180 on how the team operates.

But, they really need to do it, because an impact corner would change everything defensively for this team.

 

[Coastal Kev]

Sign Pacman, welcome with open arms, then have James Harrison Debo him during training camp, then cut. EPIC offseason

 

[KIRK]

Sign Pacman, welcome with open arms, then have James Harrison Debo him during training camp, then cut. EPIC offseason

That's more likely than them opening the vault for Johnson.

 

[sf expat71]

Wow, there are two guys named Trumaine on that list! What are the chances?

 

[Captain Hook]

The Steelers are likely to do what they usually do and that's keep their own (re-sign Gay), get Golson healthy and draft another CB fairly high in the draft. I do agree that it would be nice to see the Steelers cut bait with Cortez Allen, Brandon Boykin and possibly William Gay (if he wants too much money) and sign a legit starting CB or two in UFA. This team is close and they need to make a strong push to win one more Super Bowl in the final few years of Big Ben's prime. They are a team that needs to be all in for the next few years.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

Nope. But most people can't look deeper than Patriots have a good passing offense/ Patriots win a lot of games = must mean Brady is the reason for their success.

How was Matt Cassell, a QB who shouldn't actually be in the NFL, able to win 11 games with the Patriots in 2008? (Which was actually more than they won the following year with Brady)

The Cassell argument is as stupid as it is overused.

Cassell in 2008 had pretty much the exact same team Brady had in 2007 and an easier schedule (much easier as the Pats played a strong NFC East and a strong AFC North in 2007 - including Pittsburgh and Baltimore on the road). He won 5 LESS games than Brady did in 2007, who went 16 and 0 and broke pretty much every single season record there was. So, yeah, the drop off was pretty astronomical. Having watching every single game in 2008, I can tell you that Cassell was a game manager and that's it. He couldn't throw a deep ball to save his life... and we had Randy freaking Moss.

TB did benefit A LOT from Belichick and wouldn't have developed the way he did without him. However, saying that 2010-2015 Brady was anything but SUPER ELITE is just wrong.

 

[Big McLargehuge]

He's still a tool.

 

[Goalie_Bob]

The Steelers are likely to do what they usually do and that's keep their own (re-sign Gay), get Golson healthy and draft another CB fairly high in the draft. I do agree that it would be nice to see the Steelers cut bait with Cortez Allen, Brandon Boykin and possibly William Gay (if he wants too much money) and sign a legit starting CB or two in UFA. This team is close and they need to make a strong push to win one more Super Bowl in the final few years of Big Ben's prime. They are a team that needs to be all in for the next few years.

Totally agree. They need to go all in and if they are in cap hell a few years from now then so be it.

There is no doubt that Allen is gone. They cut bait with Woodley and will do the same with Allen. And they will be free of Woodley's and Polamalu's contract. So they will free up a bunch of money. This past season they had 19.5 mil in dead cap. For 2016 season, so far, they have 765k. They will have the room to cut Allen and Suisham.

I think they will resign Gay if he is willing to sign a reasonable contract. Like the same as what he makes now, which is 1.5mil. Maybe 2 years, 1.5mil each. He is 31 and only a serviceable nickel or backup. He isn't gonna get many offers.

Boykin will be gone because of the way he was handled by the Steelers. He won't want to stick around.

I think the Steelers are certainly primed to go out and make a splash in Free Agency for a capable CB. Just like they did with Farrior and Hartings back in the day. They won't go crazy but there are certainly plenty of capable corners available. And one of them will jump at the chance to join a team that is so close to a championship.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

The Cassell argument is as stupid as it is overused.

Cassell in 2008 had pretty much the exact same team Brady had in 2007 and an easier schedule (much easier as the Pats played a strong NFC East and a strong AFC North in 2007 - including Pittsburgh and Baltimore on the road). He won 5 LESS games than Brady did in 2007, who went 16 and 0 and broke pretty much every single season record there was. So, yeah, the drop off was pretty astronomical. Having watching every single game in 2008, I can tell you that Cassell was a game manager and that's it. He couldn't throw a deep ball to save his life... and we had Randy freaking Moss.

TB did benefit A LOT from Belichick and wouldn't have developed the way he did without him. However, saying that 2010-2015 Brady was anything but SUPER ELITE is just wrong.

And won one more game than Brady did the following year, and the Pats were 2nd in the AFC in points scored with Cassel as QB. To emphasize, the Patriots were one of the highest scoring teams in the conference with a QB who shouldn't be in the NFL. I'm sure most people thought NE would struggle in 08 after the GOAT QB was injured in their first game, and my immediate reaction was the same.... for about 2 seconds until I came to my senses and remembered that Belichick's system was the reason for their offensive success. History shows us who was right, and every game Cassel plays further cements what I saw from the Patriots in 2001 (although Brady has improved to a slightly above average QB, from the 2nd/3rd stringer he was when they won their first SB).

And Baltimore was strong in 07... oh god. Their QB's claim to fame was that he could throw the ball from midfield through the uprights from his knees.