OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: 2022 Handball season has arrived!

[OnMyOwn]

The point I'm making is that this team isn't a tire fire, that's all. I'm not arguing they've been amazingly successful, I'm saying they're not a dumpster fire.

I understand what you’re saying. It’s something like 19 seasons straight without a losing season. Close to a record.

I also understand wanting to see more than just regular season success, especially with the players we’ve had on this team over the last 10 years.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I understand what you’re saying. It’s something like 19 seasons straight without a losing season. Close to a record.

I also understand wanting to see more than just regular season success, especially with the players we’ve had on this team over the last 10 years.

Yeah this is totally spot on, this is what I was getting at. This team hasn't had success in the playoffs recently, but if you think this team is a "tire fire", you really need to go look at the last decade for 25 other NFL teams.

Nah man.

I think there was improvement. I think some of the expectations have been out of whack for a rebuilding offence that decided to install a different QB before heading to Pickett, right or wrong.

I think a lot of the things being laid at Canada's door need to be shunted one door along. To steal from a Kaboly article:

Asked Tuesday if the team was conservative by design, Tomlin replied, “Succinctly, yes.”

I think this direction from the top has a huge amount to do with the offence's struggles, both in terms of playcalling and mentality. Tomlin talks about preferring to say "woah" than "sic 'em", but the direction to the offence has been the opposite.

But to deserve a chance, to say he's earned it, I think he has to have actually done it, not be maybe on track. He hasn't done it. There's been, what, three-five good halves and some great do or die drives. That's not enough for nine games.

I'm mentally prepping myself to deal with him being back. Maybe it won't be a disaster. But I don't think he's earned it at all.

I think this is all completely valid as well. I think the offense ultimately lives and dies based on the run game, which seems to be more driven by the OL and Harris/Warren. There are obvious flaws with the offense, namely a failure of converting long drives into TDs and scheming routes more effectively to better utilize the passing game. I think those fall on Canada more than anyone else.

I guess the other argument you can make is that Canada wasn't really responsible for the run game working, so he shouldn't deserve credit for the offensive progression from the end of the year. He calls the plays of course, but it's mostly up to the OL making holes for the RB and the RB hitting those holes for the running game to work.

 

[JTG]

Count me in as a guy who's intrigued as to what Calvin Austin could offer. Gets hard for him to carve anything out if we draft a WR high to go with Pickens and Johnson. Not a reason to not do it, but a little wrinkle to add.

Austin was lighting camp up. This draft class was full of contributors. Pickett, Pickens, Leal, Heyward, Robinson, with Warren as a UDFA. Those are 6 guys excluding Austin that look to be starters to me. I don't remember a more successful rookie class, which we desperately needed after the absolute dud of 2021.

Green is a backup caliber player and Moore should be moved to G. If we go into next season with him at LT something has gone drastically wrong.

If I were the front office I'd immediately sign Edmunds and lure his brother away from Buffalo. That way our MLB is squared away. All we would need on D is a starting NT and CB.

Thinking about things since April until now…

I was terrified Tomlin was going to be stupid and take Willis over KP.

It’s the first time I had any emotion on draft night since Roth was taken. I was actually pacing the floor during the commercial before Harris came out.

I thought for sure I was going to have to suffer watching Willis pretend to be a QB when the guy I wanted was right there.

Then Harris announced KP and it was the first time I truly felt hope for this team in years.

It was nice to finally feel that emotional investment once again in my favorite sports team.

Tomlin then made the rough call to play KP, and stuck with him during his struggles because he recognized his growth was the future of this team.

So while I have severe doubts about Tomlin going fwd, I just wanted to give him props for the KP pick and showing his belief in him all season.

This was the first season in years I didn’t think “glad that shits finally over” at the end.

The thing with Willis is EVERYONE knew he needed 3 years to sit. Letting that guy on the field is disingenuous to him. He needed to go to a franchise where there is a QB in place and they can roll with that guy for a while. Drafting him to have him as an option to play is a fools game.

Steelers fans are so out of touch if they think "not winning a playoff game for 6 years" is even remotely on par with the dumpster fires that most NFL organizations deal with. Spoiled fanbase.

Have the Steelers not won anything in the last decade? Yeah sure. They've also made the playoffs in 6 of 10 years and have an average record of 10-6 over that decade. The only teams who have clearly had more success than the Steelers in the last decade are the Patriots, Seahawks, Rams and Chiefs.

So this is something that a lot of people have said, and though it is true, I always come back to my place of employment. Where I work, we have standards for our performance and come hell or high water, we would lose money to hit those standards because we have an obligation. It operated that way for the first decade of my career.

We had new leadership and the new CEO relaxed out standards. It was no longer life or death. No one really cared if the standards were hit, even if they were still technically where the bar was. My opinion on being a fan in Pittsburgh is that though it does look on the surface to be "spoiled" or "out of touch," that standard the fans have for their teams playing in tax-payer stadiums is what makes this city great. The Pirates are great example. In the 90's they packed 3 Rivers. As the ownership started to relax the standards, people still came. They have no milked the tit dry and what once was is impossible to get back to.

I'd rather the town go crazy than to sit by idly watching it all crumble and being OK with below the bar performance. The issue Pittsburgh has is none of the media types have a backbone to make it tough - like a NY or Boston.

 

[PensPlz]

Steelers fans are so out of touch if they think "not winning a playoff game for 6 years" is even remotely on par with the dumpster fires that most NFL organizations deal with. Spoiled fanbase.

Have the Steelers not won anything in the last decade? Yeah sure. They've also made the playoffs in 6 of 10 years and have an average record of 10-6 over that decade. The only teams who have clearly had more success than the Steelers in the last decade are the Patriots, Seahawks, Rams and Chiefs.

I didn't say anything in comparison to OTHER teams.

I said in comparison of the last 50 years of THIS team.

And if being at the lowest point in the last 50 years of THIS team means no drastic changes then you have to accept that the bar has officially be lowered.

I mean, this is classic coping mechanisms. You start looking outward and judging yourself based on where other people are at, instead of looking inward.... which is funny because you're doing it on behalf of a sports team. But not funny ha-ha...

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

So this is something that a lot of people have said, and though it is true, I always come back to my place of employment. Where I work, we have standards for our performance and come hell or high water, we would lose money to hit those standards because we have an obligation. It operated that way for the first decade of my career.

We had new leadership and the new CEO relaxed out standards. It was no longer life or death. No one really cared if the standards were hit, even if they were still technically where the bar was. My opinion on being a fan in Pittsburgh is that though it does look on the surface to be "spoiled" or "out of touch," that standard the fans have for their teams playing in tax-payer stadiums is what makes this city great. The Pirates are great example. In the 90's they packed 3 Rivers. As the ownership started to relax the standards, people still came. They have no milked the tit dry and what once was is impossible to get back to.

I'd rather the town go crazy than to sit by idly watching it all crumble and being OK with below the bar performance. The issue Pittsburgh has is none of the media types have a backbone to make it tough - like a NY or Boston.

Well said. If this were a business, Tomlin/Art the Dunce would've been ousted by the Board of Directors about 5 years ago.

So much talent over the past 10+ years absolutely flushed down the drain. The ROI (strictly talking about draft/player capital measured over playoff success) would be a net negative. Yes they barely make a profit and the business stays afloat, but there had been so much potential there and it's lost.

I am not talking about this season. We all knew it'd be a rebuilding time.
But that's the funny thing: whether Tomlin has all-stars or mediocre players, he gets you to .500

So spin it however you like: he gets the most out of bad players or he sub-optimizes great players

 

[Goalie_Bob]

But that's the funny thing: whether Tomlin has all-stars or mediocre players, he gets you to .500

I kinda hate sticking up for Tomlin but when he has had a true super bowl contending team he has been well above .500. The issue has been that they have not gone far enough in the playoffs and have lost some real stinkers to mediocre at best QBs.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Austin was lighting camp up. This draft class was full of contributors. Pickett, Pickens, Leal, Heyward, Robinson, with Warren as a UDFA. Those are 6 guys excluding Austin that look to be starters to me. I don't remember a more successful rookie class, which we desperately needed after the absolute dud of 2021.

Green is a backup caliber player and Moore should be moved to G. If we go into next season with him at LT something has gone drastically wrong.

If I were the front office I'd immediately sign Edmunds and lure his brother away from Buffalo. That way our MLB is squared away. All we would need on D is a starting NT and CB.



The thing with Willis is EVERYONE knew he needed 3 years to sit. Letting that guy on the field is disingenuous to him. He needed to go to a franchise where there is a QB in place and they can roll with that guy for a while. Drafting him to have him as an option to play is a fools game.



So this is something that a lot of people have said, and though it is true, I always come back to my place of employment. Where I work, we have standards for our performance and come hell or high water, we would lose money to hit those standards because we have an obligation. It operated that way for the first decade of my career.

We had new leadership and the new CEO relaxed out standards. It was no longer life or death. No one really cared if the standards were hit, even if they were still technically where the bar was. My opinion on being a fan in Pittsburgh is that though it does look on the surface to be "spoiled" or "out of touch," that standard the fans have for their teams playing in tax-payer stadiums is what makes this city great. The Pirates are great example. In the 90's they packed 3 Rivers. As the ownership started to relax the standards, people still came. They have no milked the tit dry and what once was is impossible to get back to.

I'd rather the town go crazy than to sit by idly watching it all crumble and being OK with below the bar performance. The issue Pittsburgh has is none of the media types have a backbone to make it tough - like a NY or Boston.

Willis may surprise me, but his tape is scary and not in a good way. I wanted no part of the “elite athlete hope he can learn to throw and read defenses” prayer I’ve seen fail over and over.

Everything that drew me to KP translated from college, including the moxie.

He has to get better in the pocket, but I have little doubt that will come.

Roth was extremely raw in the pocket as well until his 3rd or 4th year.

While everyone is fond of saying KP isn’t Roth, he does have one huge advantage over him: work ethic.

KP is a huge student of the game and a tape junkie. Roth was notorious for slacking on bettering himself like a Brady/Manning.

That was always annoying to read/hear/catch whispers about.

So while KP likely never accomplishes what Roth did, his will to be the best will give him a punchers chance to be a hell of a QB.

 

[xlm34]

Big deal for Smith from the Ravens. It could drive up the price for some of the top linebackers in free agency so it could have some impact on the Steelers.

It’s gonna be interesting to see what the Ravens do with Jackson this season. I don’t blame them for not wanting to give him a big deal but they kind of suck without him. And I can’t see him playing on the franchise tag.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

I kinda hate sticking up for Tomlin but when he has had a true super bowl contending team he has been well above .500. The issue has been that they have not gone far enough in the playoffs and have lost some real stinkers to mediocre at best QBs.

Gone far enough? Hell, I'd like to see at least a competitive playoff game. The last time that happened was probably 2017. That's eons when you consider the NFL and the turnover/churn of players and coaches.

If you like respectable regular seasons, Mediocre Mike is your guy. He's Jeff Fisher and Barry Switzer's love child

 

[Goalie_Bob]

Big deal for Smith from the Ravens. It could drive up the price for some of the top linebackers in free agency so it could have some impact on the Steelers.

It’s gonna be interesting to see what the Ravens do with Jackson this season. I don’t blame them for not wanting to give him a big deal but they kind of suck without him. And I can’t see him playing on the franchise tag.

I think they trade him for a big haul and sign one of the veteran free agent QBs, like Geno Smith. Or maybe they take the pick haul and trade up for a QB.

I could see Atlanta or Carolina being interested in Jackson. Or even Houston or Indy. Even New Orleans. My guess is that they would rather he go to a NFC team.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Willis may surprise me, but his tape is scary and not in a good way. I wanted no part of the “elite athlete hope he can learn to throw and read defenses” prayer I’ve seen fail over and over.

Everything that drew me to KP translated from college, including the moxie.

He has to get better in the pocket, but I have little doubt that will come.

Roth was extremely raw in the pocket as well until his 3rd or 4th year.

While everyone is fond of saying KP isn’t Roth, he does have one huge advantage over him: work ethic.

KP is a huge student of the game and a tape junkie. Roth was notorious for slacking on bettering himself like a Brady/Manning.

That was always annoying to read/hear/catch whispers about.

So while KP likely never accomplishes what Roth did, his will to be the best will give him a punchers chance to be a hell of a QB.

I'm not a college/draft guy by any stretch. I have no idea what players can or cannot translate to the pros. But once I see players against NFL competition, I feel like I have a good concept of their success.

I wasn't anti-KP. I was anti-draft a QB so early. Just like I was anti-drafting a RB early (Harris).

KP, Watt, Cam, Levi Wallace, Highsmith, and a few others are the least of my worries about this team. KP will be fine in this league provided we get him some Olinemen. People are pointing to Purdy but he's with a stacked 49ers team and he may eventually get figured out. Tons of QB's come in and get success early, but they fade quickly.

I don't understand what else people want KP to do or expect. He missed throws and missed reads just like any other rookie. He's also been saddled with a conservative offensive mindset. As Aaron Rodgers says: RELAX

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

In terms of reinforcing the defence, I might put CB ahead of LB and DL. Particularly if they lose Sutton. I think Leal taking on a more prominent role will be like an add for the DL and it'll be a good one. ILB is a need but it feels like a position where you can get help fairly cheap and where if the rest of the team is strong, you can mask liabilities.

It's pretty difficult to mask CB and I think our CBs showed that while they can play this season, there's no one there who can really take the lead against elite WRs. There's no internal player coming up to feel optimistic about like there is with Leal or even Robinson.

I agree with putting an emphasis on helping Pickett. But part of me really hopes they target a CB first. Feels like a good draft for doing so too, which isn't so true about getting Pickett offensive help.

I think you can put the emphasis on Pickett w/o using the 1st (or even 2nd pick) on that offensive side of the ball. Can be accomplished via FA and coaching decisions.

Def want competent bodies or better for OL comp, and a new coordinator. I think another pass catcher in addition to Austin would be wise.

Just saying all things equal, helping Pickett develop and grow should be the priority.

 

[ZorkEnchanter]

But but but other teams have it worse so that must mean we're the most spoiled fan base.

Also set a little known record agt Jax by becoming the first home team to score 40+ and still lose.

All in all, they have let up 40+ in their last three playoff losses and 35 agt NE.

Tomlin isn’t just having mediocre seasons and bad luck in the playoffs, he’s setting all time records for getting an ass whipping.

Many Tomlin supporters gloss all over the entirety of what’s been going on under Tomlin Purgatory and point to the 9 win seasons as proof he’s a great coach.

We had someone put on their clown shoes and beat their chest about it on Sunday.

That’s where we are as fans under Tomlin - it’s kind of sad.

Yup. But we went 7-2 vs mostly < 7 win teams.

It's crazy how the 49ers rebuild in 3 years. Plug in a f***ing Mr. Irrelevant at QB and ppl somehow think we've got GREAT coaching. We have average coaching across the board.

When we plugged in a new QB, it was like, we are done. Other teams try... this team... nope. All good. If Tomlin were in San Fran, they would be a mess now with Brock Purdy.

Win or lose, I just want to see some consistency and progress and there hasn't been. We beat the Raiders 13-10 and look a Raiders OFF and DEF stats. I bet money we keep the same staff.

 

[Flying Dego]

Roth was extremely raw in the pocket as well until his 3rd or 4th year.

This also got him into a lot of trouble off the field early in his career.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

Yup. But we went 7-2 vs mostly < 7 win teams.

It's crazy how the 49ers rebuild in 3 years. Plug in a f***ing Mr. Irrelevant at QB and ppl somehow think we've got GREAT coaching. We have average coaching across the board.

When we plugged in a new QB, it was like, we are done. Other teams try... this team... nope. All good. If Tomlin were in San Fran, they would be a mess now with Brock Purdy.

Win or lose, I just want to see some consistency and progress and there hasn't been. We beat the Raiders 13-10 and look a Raiders OFF and DEF stats. I bet money we keep the same staff.

The 49ers didn’t rebuild they were in the super bowl 3 years ago in 2019
That same Vegas team lost in Ot 37/34 to the 49ers
Coming into this season the shanahan had 9 wins with Qbs not named Jimmy g Tomlin got 8 from duck and mason in one year

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I'm not a college/draft guy by any stretch. I have no idea what players can or cannot translate to the pros. But once I see players against NFL competition, I feel like I have a good concept of their success.

I wasn't anti-KP. I was anti-draft a QB so early. Just like I was anti-drafting a RB early (Harris).

KP, Watt, Cam, Levi Wallace, Highsmith, and a few others are the least of my worries about this team. KP will be fine in this league provided we get him some Olinemen. People are pointing to Purdy but he's with a stacked 49ers team and he may eventually get figured out. Tons of QB's come in and get success early, but they fade quickly.

I don't understand what else people want KP to do or expect. He missed throws and missed reads just like any other rookie. He's also been saddled with a conservative offensive mindset. As Aaron Rodgers says: RELAX

No idea what ppl want from him.

He’s not Mahomes or Allen!

Ok, who is?

He without a doubt showed he can run around like them and make great plays.

Showed he can be clutch and make all the NFL throws.

Showed us he can learn from his mistakes (one pick his last 8 games).

It’s a world of fantasy geeks that just look at numbers and not what actually happened over the course of the season.

I expect him to be much better after an off season of training/studying and working with his guys.

Maybe Purdy becomes a Brady redux, but that won’t change how KP’s story goes.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Doubt the Steelers have the cap space to be able to afford both him and DJ, but that's the kind of weapon that would give Pickett toys to play with.

 

[ZorkEnchanter]

The 49ers didn’t rebuild they were in the super bowl 3 years ago in 2019
That same Vegas team lost in Ot 37/34 to the 49ers
Coming into this season the shanahan had 9 wins with Qbs not named Jimmy g Tomlin got 8 from duck and mason in one year

Uh... they have had multiple QB's and in 2020 they were 6 - 10. In 2018 they were 4 - 12.

Sure dude, they were having problems for the past 2 years because they were rebuilding or are we rebuilding? And changing the argument is not what I asked... How come they get 1000% more mileage from Mr. Irrelevent... when we lose a QB it's over.

 

[Peat]

I think this is all completely valid as well. I think the offense ultimately lives and dies based on the run game, which seems to be more driven by the OL and Harris/Warren. There are obvious flaws with the offense, namely a failure of converting long drives into TDs and scheming routes more effectively to better utilize the passing game. I think those fall on Canada more than anyone else.

I guess the other argument you can make is that Canada wasn't really responsible for the run game working, so he shouldn't deserve credit for the offensive progression from the end of the year. He calls the plays of course, but it's mostly up to the OL making holes for the RB and the RB hitting those holes for the running game to work.

The chat after the Baltimore game, arguably the most impressive run game of the season, from both players and people looking at what they did, was that they weren't calling any clever plays or mixing it up or anything. They ran a play, found Baltimore couldn't handle it, and ran it again until Baltimore looked like they'd handled it - which they never did.

And yeah, good play calling to hammer home an advantage, but it's not a case that Canada is the guy who's going to unlock the next level in this offence.

So this is something that a lot of people have said, and though it is true, I always come back to my place of employment. Where I work, we have standards for our performance and come hell or high water, we would lose money to hit those standards because we have an obligation. It operated that way for the first decade of my career.

We had new leadership and the new CEO relaxed out standards. It was no longer life or death. No one really cared if the standards were hit, even if they were still technically where the bar was. My opinion on being a fan in Pittsburgh is that though it does look on the surface to be "spoiled" or "out of touch," that standard the fans have for their teams playing in tax-payer stadiums is what makes this city great. The Pirates are great example. In the 90's they packed 3 Rivers. As the ownership started to relax the standards, people still came. They have no milked the tit dry and what once was is impossible to get back to.

I'd rather the town go crazy than to sit by idly watching it all crumble and being OK with below the bar performance. The issue Pittsburgh has is none of the media types have a backbone to make it tough - like a NY or Boston.

I can immediately think of a few places where people and the media goes crazy when there isn't success because of the heritage... and that going crazy is now part of why there isn't success. I think arguably you can see a little of that with the Steelers with their whole "we're always trying to win" thing even when they clearly needed to rebuild.

I just want this team to live in reality. No need for extreme thinking. Just be honest about what they've got and what they've done - which for pretty much the entirety of the team's structure bar Tomlin is not much either way. New GM and AGM, new QB, not like the co-ordinators have been around for a long time. People calling for them to clear house should either be specific they mean Tomlin or are too late.

And while I'm not convinced by Tomlin long term, I think he's doing a decent job in the rebuild. The stats of how he does with the rebuild matter a hell of a lot more to the next bowl than comparisons with the last 50 years.

I think you can put the emphasis on Pickett w/o using the 1st (or even 2nd pick) on that offensive side of the ball. Can be accomplished via FA and coaching decisions.

Def want competent bodies or better for OL comp, and a new coordinator. I think another pass catcher in addition to Austin would be wise.

Just saying all things equal, helping Pickett develop and grow should be the priority.

Agreed, but to state the obvious, using them there would sure help.

And one hundred per cent agreed with the last line.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

Uh... they have had multiple QB's and in 2020 they were 6 - 10. In 2018 they were 4 - 12.
View attachment 633220

Sure dude, they were having problems for the past 2 years because they were rebuilding or are we rebuilding? And changing the argument is not what I asked... How come they get 1000% more mileage from Mr. Irrelevent... when we lose a QB it's over.

They were losing because Jimmy G was hurt. They had a record of 7-26 from 2017 to 2020 without Jimmy G. When Jimmy G was healthy they were 22 and 9 over those same years.
Since 2018 the Steelers have won 8 games and 9 games in seasons ben didn’t play or finish the season. They also won 9 games with Ben only one year did they get to 12 wins so its not over if they don’t have Ben

 

[Peat]

Doubt the Steelers have the cap space to be able to afford both him and DJ, but that's the kind of weapon that would give Pickett toys to play with.

You get Hopkins, that's the scenario in which Johnson gets traded imo, although I've no idea how the cap goes with that.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

You get Hopkins, that's the scenario in which Johnson gets traded imo, although I've no idea how the cap goes with that.

DHop has a no trade clause and 56 million over the next 2 years against the cap. Plus the PED suspension not worth it

 

[DanielPlainview]

Cards will probably have to eat a year of that deal to make a trade

 

[JTG]

Willis may surprise me, but his tape is scary and not in a good way. I wanted no part of the “elite athlete hope he can learn to throw and read defenses” prayer I’ve seen fail over and over.

Everything that drew me to KP translated from college, including the moxie.

He has to get better in the pocket, but I have little doubt that will come.

Roth was extremely raw in the pocket as well until his 3rd or 4th year.

While everyone is fond of saying KP isn’t Roth, he does have one huge advantage over him: work ethic.

KP is a huge student of the game and a tape junkie. Roth was notorious for slacking on bettering himself like a Brady/Manning.

That was always annoying to read/hear/catch whispers about.

So while KP likely never accomplishes what Roth did, his will to be the best will give him a punchers chance to be a hell of a QB.

I think Willis has arm talent. I think the work he needs to do is in the film room and learning how to harness his cowboy style like Mahomes can. Running ability can save a mediocre QB and I wouldn't be shocked to see Willis have some sort of success. Where things go bad for a guy like Willis is when he is rushed to play and he's in survival mode. May as well cut him and move on at that point because the odds of him ever realizing his potential are very slim.

I don't remember Ben being raw in the pocket, but that was eons ago and I can't remember what I ate for lunch. Two things helped Ben - he had a bomb of an arm, he's 6'5, and he was impossible to tackle. Kenny has none of those things going for him. The thing with Kenny is that he's not a super talented QB. You can see it even when Mitch comes in - Mitch is a way more physically gifted player. Kenny just has grapefruits. He has...it. He's a guy I really wouldn't bet against, and I think any sort of shortcomings he has, he'll be able to get around them. He kind of reminds me of Tony Romo a bit. Romo had a better arm, but there's a lot of similarities I see between them.

The problems I see with Kenny should be rectified with time and experience. He has his happy feet from Pitt back and that's because he was shellshocked at Pitt his first 3 years and he was getting killed here early in the season. He has to fix that. He also has to adjust his eyes when he rolls out. He has missed GLORIOUS opportunities on post routes up the middle because he targets all the routes running towards the sidelines. Again...I think that comes with experience. I'd love to see Kyle Shanahan or Kliff Kingsbury with Pickett. I think he fits that style really well. Kingsbury rumored to the Pats as OC, BTW.

The dude played 3rd string snaps in camp. The handicap he was playing with it is a true marvel he was able to rattle off the wins he did.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I think Willis has arm talent. I think the work he needs to do is in the film room and learning how to harness his cowboy style like Mahomes can. Running ability can save a mediocre QB and I wouldn't be shocked to see Willis have some sort of success. Where things go bad for a guy like Willis is when he is rushed to play and he's in survival mode. May as well cut him and move on at that point because the odds of him ever realizing his potential are very slim.

I don't remember Ben being raw in the pocket, but that was eons ago and I can't remember what I ate for lunch. Two things helped Ben - he had a bomb of an arm, he's 6'5, and he was impossible to tackle. Kenny has none of those things going for him. The thing with Kenny is that he's not a super talented QB. You can see it even when Mitch comes in - Mitch is a way more physically gifted player. Kenny just has grapefruits. He has...it. He's a guy I really wouldn't bet against, and I think any sort of shortcomings he has, he'll be able to get around them. He kind of reminds me of Tony Romo a bit. Romo had a better arm, but there's a lot of similarities I see between them.

The problems I see with Kenny should be rectified with time and experience. He has his happy feet from Pitt back and that's because he was shellshocked at Pitt his first 3 years and he was getting killed here early in the season. He has to fix that. He also has to adjust his eyes when he rolls out. He has missed GLORIOUS opportunities on post routes up the middle because he targets all the routes running towards the sidelines. Again...I think that comes with experience. I'd love to see Kyle Shanahan or Kliff Kingsbury with Pickett. I think he fits that style really well. Kingsbury rumored to the Pats as OC, BTW.

The dude played 3rd string snaps in camp. The handicap he was playing with it is a true marvel he was able to rattle off the wins he did.

Roth was a playground QB early in his career, but it worked for him because as you said, he was a big mutant with a rocket arm.

Roth was always this big lumbering guy, even as a rookie. He reminded me of Shrek running with the rock and just throwing people off him.

KP is just a more nimble and agile athlete than Roth was IMHO. As the NFL found out, he can kill teams when he’s on the move with both his arm and legs.

I found it really odd he never got enough credit for that ability from the scouts.

I wrote about it last spring over and over, and he showed us he can make special plays on the move in the NFL.

KP can really move though and while maybe he can’t fall down and throw it 50 yards under his legs while standing on his head like Mahomes, it’s a huge weapon in his arsenal.

That’s one of the talents he had that really made me want the Steelers to draft him.

I think the difference was Roth gave no f***s when he was on the run in his youth and would chuck the ball deep and do risky shit that probably gave Cowher more greys on his pubes.

You can’t argue with the results because he won a SB by year two doing his thing.

He just was like Lemieux in a sense where he relied on his natural gifts and got a reputation for not working as hard as he should have at his craft.

The best QBs I ever saw beat teams with their superior intelligence and hard work, not their great physical gifts… Montana, Brady and Manning.

Brady and Montana were wispy guys with avg arms and Manning was a big guy, but he ran with two left feet and couldn’t throw off tacklers like Roth.

That’s why I’m always wary about the freak athlete that can’t actually throw accurately and don’t know how to read a D, go through progressions, etc.

I think KP has a lot more natural gifts than he gets credit for, and when you combine that with his work ethic, he should be a lot of fun to watch over the next x amount of years.