Robert
Foligno family
Not me.... I simply think Erixon is better based on what I've seen in regular season play, I know I'm not a coach or hockey professional but I can still question why he's in the minors... this is what fans do DSL..
The defenseman of the Blue Jackets -Part Deux
- Thread starter EspenK
- Start date
Not me.... I simply think Erixon is better based on what I've seen in regular season play, I know I'm not a coach or hockey professional but I can still question why he's in the minors... this is what fans do DSL..
Shift in defensive TOI spread
One thing I've noticed this year is how much more I see the 3rd pairing on the ice compared to years past.
Last season our top 2 dmen averaged 50:03 combined ice time per game, almost 50% more toi than the bottom 2 at 34:12.
This season the ice time is more evenly distributed. Top 2 at 44:40, bottom 2 at 39:43.
That's a significant shift.
FWIW, defensive TOI:
2013/14
Jack Johnson 23:28
Fedor Tyutin 21:12
James Wisniewski 20:53
Nikita Nikitin 19:53
Dalton Prout 19:50
David Savard 17:32
Ryan Murray 16:17
2012/13
Jack Johnson 25:58
Fedor Tyutin 24:05
James Wisniewski 22:49
Nikita Nikitin 21:11
Dalton Prout 18:31
Adrian Aucoin 16:20
Tim Erixon 15:41
Cody Goloubef 14:48
John Moore 14:30
David Savard 13:12
Nick Holden 8:34
One thing I've noticed this year is how much more I see the 3rd pairing on the ice compared to years past.
Last season our top 2 dmen averaged 50:03 combined ice time per game, almost 50% more toi than the bottom 2 at 34:12.
This season the ice time is more evenly distributed. Top 2 at 44:40, bottom 2 at 39:43.
That's a significant shift.
FWIW, defensive TOI:
2013/14
Jack Johnson 23:28
Fedor Tyutin 21:12
James Wisniewski 20:53
Nikita Nikitin 19:53
Dalton Prout 19:50
David Savard 17:32
Ryan Murray 16:17
2012/13
Jack Johnson 25:58
Fedor Tyutin 24:05
James Wisniewski 22:49
Nikita Nikitin 21:11
Dalton Prout 18:31
Adrian Aucoin 16:20
Tim Erixon 15:41
Cody Goloubef 14:48
John Moore 14:30
David Savard 13:12
Nick Holden 8:34
Crede777
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Could be the split of our "top-4" defensemen. We have Johnson with Prout at even strength, Tyutin with Savard, Wisniewski with Murray, and then Nikitin is a nomad depending on who is scratched.
If we instead ran:
Johnson - Wisniewski
Tyutin - Nikitin
Murray - Savard
Prout
Then I think we would see TOI much more concentrated in our top-4. Instead, I think Richards wants to more evenly distribute ice time amongst the pairings, bring an offensive and a defensive game to all 3 pairings (not have one pairing be all offense and one be all defense), and chaperone the younger guys (despite them obviously having much of Richards' trust and being a year older).
One more thing is injuries. As guys, particularly young ones, get more NHL game experience their TOI should go up gradually provided Richards likes them. Last year, with a lot of injuries, we saw many more defensemen at the NHL level. That means a lot more "1st, 2nd, 3rd NHL game of the season, haven't seen NHL action ever or since last year" scenarios where Richards has to ease them in and rely on the available veterans more. If you have a bunch of injuries, you are constantly seeing new faces and shuffling pairings which makes most coaches more conservative with ice time and they look to lean on a constant (that being the veterans who are healthy).
If we instead ran:
Johnson - Wisniewski
Tyutin - Nikitin
Murray - Savard
Prout
Then I think we would see TOI much more concentrated in our top-4. Instead, I think Richards wants to more evenly distribute ice time amongst the pairings, bring an offensive and a defensive game to all 3 pairings (not have one pairing be all offense and one be all defense), and chaperone the younger guys (despite them obviously having much of Richards' trust and being a year older).
One more thing is injuries. As guys, particularly young ones, get more NHL game experience their TOI should go up gradually provided Richards likes them. Last year, with a lot of injuries, we saw many more defensemen at the NHL level. That means a lot more "1st, 2nd, 3rd NHL game of the season, haven't seen NHL action ever or since last year" scenarios where Richards has to ease them in and rely on the available veterans more. If you have a bunch of injuries, you are constantly seeing new faces and shuffling pairings which makes most coaches more conservative with ice time and they look to lean on a constant (that being the veterans who are healthy).
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Matthew
OK Boomer
Vagrant
The Czech Condor
I see that David Savard has 3A and leads the team with a +4 rating. Has he finally caught on to being an NHL caliber defender or do you guys expect him to be pressboxed at the first opportunity for Erixon who is lighting the AHL ablaze?
I know he's waiver eligible. Do you think the Jackets are exploring trade avenues?
I know he's waiver eligible. Do you think the Jackets are exploring trade avenues?
The thing that confounds this explanation is that our kids haven't been noticeably less reliable than our vets. If anything, the coach is keeping Murray with Wiz in order to bail out Wiz.
He won't be scratched much at his age and as he's growing as a player. There's no official indication from the team or the reporters following the team of a trade in the works. But my guess is that Jarmo's paying close attention to trade opportunities, not necessarily involving Savard but our defencemen in general.
EspenK
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I hope this is true. Not complaining about our D but rather we could use an upgrade on offense. Look at last night- Dubi's goal was a "garbage goal", Wiz' was a miracle, only CAM's was the result of a strong offensive move. I'd love to see us add another true offensive threat a la CAM & Gabby.
fox2usp
Inbred Cat
EspenK
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Horton will help but I'm not so sure he is a CAM & Gabby type of scorer. I think we need another guy who can create.
Horton as an alternative to "garbage goals"?? That'll be his bread and butter, and there's nothing wrong or random with garbage goals.
Robert
Foligno family
I still say the Jackets are insane not using Erixon... perhaps Savard should stay and trade Nikitin???
The CBJ have sent their asst. GM to watch Erixon, I think he's coming back... we need his puck skill....
The CBJ have sent their asst. GM to watch Erixon, I think he's coming back... we need his puck skill....
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Why is there a clamor to trade a defenseman? We have some depth. We will eventually need that depth. What if the injuries to Tyutin and Prout were longer, much like Calvert & Horton? Both Nikitin and Erixon would be in the lineup. Let's just be glad they are there and quit trying to send them away. Eight NHL level d-men is NOT too many. Someone has to be in SPR, coaches/FO say right now it's Erixon, live with it.
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I would be agreeing with you if I thought it was 8. I count 9, with Goloubef as a capable NHL 6/7.
Crede777
Deputized
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I see what you're saying, but think that doesn't confound what I said, it supports. If the young defensemen weren't so steady then the veterans would be getting a much bigger part of the TOI pie. Steadiness comes from playing games as well as ability. If we had injuries to the young players, they wouldn't be able to prove themselves to Richards as well and so Richards wouldn't trust them.
Because guys like Murray and Savard are steady (by being good in addition to healthy), TOI is being evenly distributed.
EspenK
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I wouldn't call it a clamor-its just that with 9 nhl level guys and a weak offense if the right deal comes along i'd do it everytime.
There's hardly ever a trade you don't like.
There is a lot of depth on the offense, just not a lot of top end talent. And I don't think trading some of the depth defense is going to net top shelf offense. And if you trade the top end D, you're creating a hole to plug a hole.
I count 8, Goloubef is marginal at this point. An emergency, if necessary call up but still a year away from really ready, if he continues his development.
EspenK
Registered User
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There's hardly ever a trade you don't like.
There is a lot of depth on the offense, just not a lot of top end talent. And I don't think trading some of the depth defense is going to net top shelf offense. And if you trade the top end D, you're creating a hole to plug a hole.
I count 8, Goloubef is marginal at this point. An emergency, if necessary call up but still a year away from really ready, if he continues his development.
I don't think I liked the Chimera for Jurcina-Clarke deal
Double-Shift Lasse
Just post better
Missed this earlier but it deserves a rebuttal.
I'm not questioning "what fans do". I'm questioning the way some fans do what they do. There seems to be a mentality that "my way is the only way things could possibly be perceived, so if something happens that doesn't fit my perception, there must be something afoot."
No, the answer is that other people can see things differently. I never said it makes one person right or another person right, I just said that you have to allow that sometimes, things just are what they seem.
Here's the dirty little secret in this particular discussion - I, too, prefer Erixon to Savard. But I'm not on here suggesting that the organization MUST agree with me, so therefore the promotion of Savard/demotion of Erixon has some ulterior motive. Nope, I'm allowing that the organization disagrees with me as to which deserves to be with the big club at this point in time.
It's really not complicated.
People are still comparing Erixon to Savard despite the fact the play different positions?
David Savard has played 142:40 ES minutes this season.
How many goals the Jackets gave up during that period of time? The answer is zero.
How many penalty minutes David Savard got? The answer is zero.
How many players on the team have a better plus/minus than Savard? The answer is the same.
You don't have to be a coach or hockey professional to realize that the guy is doing something right this year and the complains about his spot on the roster look just irrational.
David Savard has played 142:40 ES minutes this season.
How many goals the Jackets gave up during that period of time? The answer is zero.
How many penalty minutes David Savard got? The answer is zero.
How many players on the team have a better plus/minus than Savard? The answer is the same.
You don't have to be a coach or hockey professional to realize that the guy is doing something right this year and the complains about his spot on the roster look just irrational.
I agree with this. I'll also agree with the poster who said erixon got "beat " in camp as well. Young players often lose spots in campaign based on their own play and of those around him. Murray took one spot and Savard the other. TOI is also a huge part of it. If a fire had been lit under savards ass why put it out by rotating him out. And why waste Erixons time in the press box. Erixon us going to gain valuable experience as a #1dman in the ahl, continuing to grow as a player. If he shows he's consistent in the AHL for an extended period of time he's going to get his chance.
And I'm in the no trading any dmen camp. We are perfectly stocked right now. If we have another dman take a huge step this season we can get rid of one in the off season or deadline. All its gonna take is Wiz to block a shot and someone to get sick or fall funny and all of a sudden erixon and golobouf are all in the lineup. Not to say they aren't good players, I just would not feel the same about our defense at that point. It puts even more pressure on Bob and our offense. And if we trade one of our NHL Dmen and we have 2 or 3 defensive injuries you can kiss the playoffs goodbye.
So up to this point would everyone agree that Tyutin and Murray have been our best dmen? Murray seemed to take over that top pairing last night. I definitely can't wait to see him and Erixon get some time together.
Could you imagine if we did finish bottom 5 last year and got Jones or Barkov last season right about now :O
Could you imagine if we did finish bottom 5 last year and got Jones or Barkov last season right about now :O
I didn't see our game last night, so my report doesn't include that, but yes Murray and Tyutin have been our best. I'm baffled that Wiz and JJ get more ice time.
From all that I saw he was paired with JJ and Tyutin with Wiz? But it just seemed like Murray was out there almost every chance. Also noticed Johansen taking almost all the important draws.
