Post-Game Talk: Sens 1 and 2

[SoupGuru]

This sums up how I felt everytime I saw Brady's stupid face...


Im still trying to figure out what the f Sunny is supposed to provide? A big body 4th liner who's too slow to do any big body 4th line things. I dont understand how we have an entire team of players who are unable to take and give a hit. Every big check our guys tried to throw ended up with them bouncing off and falling down awkwardly, meanwhile they were getting pasted left and right, seemly completely unable to defend themselves. Embarrising all around.

I'd rather have Erne in for games like this last one. He doesn't pass up opportunities to finish a check too often.

 

[TCNorthstars]

Rasmussen is a legit player and we’re in trouble without him.

What are things I didn't think I'd read on the Wings HF board? Thank you, I'll take Strange Wings for $1000,Mayim!

 

[Mister Ed]

Gauthier and Joseph were charging players each and every chance they had. The refs somehow closed their eyes on that and called every single thing Detroit did. Hopefuly the game isn't decided by the refs tonight.

 

[sepster]

Build a team that can be the bully rather than get bullied and all of this handwringing over the officiating goes away.

 

[norrisnick]

Build a team that can be the bully rather than get bullied and all of this handwringing over the officiating goes away.

Not in the least. Doesn't matter how your team is constructed if the standards for what is and isn't a penalty is constantly changing from shift to shift and team to team.

This team has been hit before in games like this and been fine. I'm not at all concerned about how they handle physicality. Just let them play the game as is intended.

 

[sepster]

You keep saying the NHL just needs to be consistent with its officiating as if it has ever demonstrated the ability to do so.... ever.

EDIT: And also, no, there have been very few teams to go at the Wings as physically as Ottawa did last night any time recently. Mostly, because the Wings have been so bad in recent years opposing teams haven't had to bother with it. Now that the Wings are starting to resemble something close to an actual challenge be prepared for more teams to take them seriously and try to put them into their place.

 

[Holden Caufield]

Honestly this game was a stinker, a clanker, and an absolute mess.

But it was our first big let down game in a long time!
Even in the Tampa loss, they played very well..

Begrudgingly, I’m willing to give them a pass here and see if they can bounce back tonight.
But I’m expecting a much more inspired effort.

 

[TheOtherOne]

Build a team that can be the bully rather than get bullied and all of this handwringing over the officiating goes away.

We went up 2-1 and would have sustained that in an even game with decent goaltending. It wasn't the "bullying" that affected the score sheet. It was the 12 minutes down a man. You can't get a rhythm like that.

... and the goaltending

 

[Air Budd Dwyer]

The overreactions are mostly hilarious but I'm not a fan of calling the team gutless because of one loss when they've clearly been playing their hearts out lately.

It wasn’t just last night, this team is soft. I’m not suggesting Yzerman goes out and signs a bunch of cavemen on skates. But it would be nice to have a at least one line of players who can play against the other team’s top 6 and wear them down physically and contribute ~10 goals per player over a season. Instead we have a bottom 6 of players who score about 10 goals a season and don’t make the opposition pay for anything. It’s a bland brand of hockey.

 

[raymond23]

Don't agree at all. We're doing just fine, and chasing after physicality because we got outplayed in a game is a big time losing mentality.

Buffalo and NJ are #31 and #32 in hits. Colorado's #27. Toronto #23.
Yeah, Ottawa's the 2nd most physical team in the league, but is that what we want to chase?


Our bottom 6 has been one of the best in the league for a month or two. Finally we have scoring depth and the ability to win because of depth.
But.. we need to ruin that because we want more low-skill goons?

Couldn't have said it better myself

Our physicality and bottom six have never been a problem until one stinker game - now everyone is clamoring for a roster overhaul

 

[jaster]

We disagree all the time now. Lol.
Anyhow, I have watched only period 1 and there are 4 questionable calls all went against us.
Call on Larkin is fine. It was roughing or interference.
But no call on Seider, roughing is a very obvious call.
No call on Lindstrom and the call on Berggren are strange.

The officiating was horrible last night, some of the worst I've seen in a while. What do we disagree on?

 

[cvaicunas]

Obviously roster construction will change for all teams moving into the future, but I do find it troublesome that we currently seem to struggle in games against the Devils, Sabres, Senators.... Teams who's competitive windows will theoretically be open at the same time as ours. Obviously the Devil's are currently ahead in that regard, but still.

 

[Snuggs]

Couldn't have said it better myself

Our physicality and bottom six have never been a problem until one stinker game - now everyone is clamoring for a roster overhaul

I disagree. Minnesota Wild, Arizona Coyotes, Florida Panthers have all used the same playbook. Ottawa just took it to another level. Likely cause it's a double header and they need these wins against us. Idk which poster said it, but maybe the playbook is out, and should probably expect this style against us now through the stretch now that teams actually see Red Wings as a threat.

I really hope they respond well tonight.

 

[norrisnick]

I disagree. Minnesota Wild, Arizona Coyotes, Florida Panthers have all used the same playbook. Ottawa just took it to another level. Likely cause it's a double header and they need these wins against us. Idk which poster said it, but maybe the playbook is out, and should probably expect this style against us now through the stretch now that teams actually see Red Wings as a threat.

I really hope they respond well tonight.

Those games all tickled something in my brain so I checked. Last night. The Wild game, the Arizona game, and the Panther game all featured the Wings' backup in net. Might there be some forechecker communication/puck management from Husso we're missing back there?

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Couldn't have said it better myself

Our physicality and bottom six have never been a problem until one stinker game - now everyone is clamoring for a roster overhaul

I don't know that people are clamoring for a roster overhaul. I do think the team could use a bit more toughness and grit. Especially if they lose Bertuzzi.

I'm not super worried about it though because I think as a GM Yzerman also values players with those attributes and wants this team to be tough to play against.

 

[jaster]

I don't know that people are clamoring for a roster overhaul. I do think the team could use a bit more toughness and grit. Especially if they lose Bertuzzi.

I'm not super worried about it though because I think as a GM Yzerman also values players with those attributes and wants this team to be tough to play against.

Yeah I trust Yzerman to address these things in the long-term. I'm personally not calling for anything close to an overhaul. I'd like the current team to not do things like last night; to be tougher and not mope. I'm sure Yzerman hated seeing that too. Hence why I'm confident he'll address those things moving forward.

 

[SoupGuru]

Yeah, I don't know if we need to change the roster much. We just need to be comfortable when teams come at us like that. Be resilient. Exploit it. Don't let it get to you. I'm sure that will come with experience but a lot of your response requires quicker decision making, which might be a bigger issue than physically in general with this roster.

 

[jfrank21]

I disagree. Minnesota Wild, Arizona Coyotes, Florida Panthers have all used the same playbook. Ottawa just took it to another level. Likely cause it's a double header and they need these wins against us. Idk which poster said it, but maybe the playbook is out, and should probably expect this style against us now through the stretch now that teams actually see Red Wings as a threat.

I really hope they respond well tonight.

There was an Edmonton game a few weeks ago where we were dummied as well. That's what last night reminded me of. Someone else touched on it and I agree, the Wings of the past few seasons have been getting the "oh, its just the Wings" treatment from most teams, now we're starting to see how things look when other teams actually try to play with purpose.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

I'd rather have Erne in for games like this last one. He doesn't pass up opportunities to finish a check too often.

Yeah, but his hits are weaksauce. I'd still rather have him in than Zadina though.

 

[jfrank21]

Yeah, but his hits are weaksauce. I'd still rather have him in than Zadina though.

Not sure if you watched last night, but Zadina was one of the few guys battling through the physicality and still making plays....

 

[sepster]

Yeah, but his hits are weaksauce. I'd still rather have him in than Zadina though.

Mickey talked about "hits vs quality hits" several times last night.

Hit = bump into a player after the puck is gone but don't prevent the player from immediately rejoining the play.

Quality hit = separate the player from the puck and take them out of the play.

The Wings throw hits but very few quality hits.

 

[RedWingzz]

Sunny out, Vrana in for tomorrow.

Great, so we're dressing an even softer lineup. Yzerman needs to address this ASAP. The Sens completely bullied the Wings yesterday, and there was zero response. Tkachuk chirping the entire bench, and they all just sat there hunched over with their heads up their ***.

We have way too many soft and small forwards to compete in these high intensity, high importance games. The Sens wanted it more, (and sure the reffing was garbage), but they beat us up physically and on the scoresheet.

The response is to dress Vrana for one of our only forwards with size?...This should go well lol

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Not sure if you watched last night, but Zadina was one of the few guys battling through the physicality and still making plays....

Oh I watched. He wasn't terrible but wasn't great either.

It felt like most of the team gave up midway through the 2nd after that bullshit penalty against Perron where he was sent to the box for breathing on Chabot. Reffing definitely took the fight out of the team, probably even moreso than the Sens hitting did.

Mickey talked about "hits vs quality hits" several times last night.

Hit = bump into a player after the puck is gone but don't prevent the player from immediately rejoining the play.

Quality hit = separate the player from the puck and take them out of the play.

The Wings throw hits but very few quality hits.

I know. That's been one of my gripes the last 2 seasons. They need to identify some of these guys as trade targets.

 

[jfrank21]

Great, so we're dressing an even softer lineup. Yzerman needs to address this ASAP. The Sens completely bullied the Wings yesterday, and there was zero response. Tkachuk chirping the entire bench, and they all just sat there hunched over with their heads up their ***.

We have way too many soft and small forwards to compete in these high intensity, high importance games. The Sens wanted it more, (and sure the reffing was garbage), but they beat us up physically and on the scoresheet.

The response is to dress Vrana for one of our only forwards with size?...This should go well lol

What good is his size if he's too slow to use it in any meaningful fashion. Every check he had last night was after the guy got rid of the puck, because Sunny couldnt catch him while he actually had the puck. And then to top it off, Sunny would usually be the guy falling down after finishing his check.

 

[RedWingzz]

What good is his size if he's too slow to use it in any meaningful fashion. Every check he had last night was after the guy got rid of the puck, because Sunny couldnt catch him while he actually had the puck. And then to top it off, Sunny would usually be the guy falling down after finishing his check.

Yeah, I agree with you, I don't like Sundqvist and don't want him on the roster either. He is way too slow for the NHL. I just don't know if it's the right move for today. I'd leave Sunny in, and then put Vrana in for another soft/small forward.

It's rather evident what the Sens game plan was, and I can guarantee you they are licking their chops at the opportunity to dummy us again. I'm not sure we have a physical response. Having Ras out hurts the team for sure. Tonight will be a huge test for the Wings, and I honestly don't think they have it in them to compete with Ottawa physically.

Now, it would be nice to get 5 Powerplays in the first period, and to try to beat them on the scoreboard.