Rumor: Rumors & Proposals thread: Vatanen gone as well

[North]

So which defenseman are you going to get then? Is it better to give up RNH/Eberle for a marginally better defenseman than Bogo instead of just moving down 4 spots?

I wouldn't give up either of those guys for Bogo so if the target is just marginally better I imagine you don't give up RNH or Eberle.

You seem to have a view of Bogo that is not supported by his play and his significant injury history.

 

[Zaddy]

Chiarelli: "Hey Dean. We need Doughty"

Lombardi: "OK. We need McDavid"

Chiarelli: "Uhhhhhh... Sorry, wrong number..."

(Click)

It's the same logic with Faulk, which was my point. There's no legitimate reason that he would be available.

 

[Paralyzer]

So which defenseman are you going to get then? Is it better to give up RNH/Eberle for a marginally better defenseman than Bogo instead of just moving down 4 spots?

Thankfully, Chiarelli is our GM and he knows who to go for. It won't be for a run-of-the-mill defender. It'll be someone we didn't know was available. Bogosian should be a back up plan if he can't get any defencemen better than him. I just don't value him, and Stauffer backed me up on this.

 

[Zaddy]

I wouldn't give up either of those guys for Bogo so if the target is just marginally better I imagine you don't give up RNH or Eberle.

You seem to have a view of Bogo that is not supported by his play and his significant injury history.

So which defenseman is available that is A LOT better than Bogo?

 

[SDig14]

The only reason Faulk could be available is Carolina cannot score.

The problem is if they trade Faulk for anything short a huge overpayment their team likely gets even worse.

In other words, 99.99% he is going nowhere.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

If Bogo's the only defenceman we can get this offseason... Woof... He's a top 4 at least but he has struggled horribly when asked to play top minutes.

 

[Paralyzer]

So which defenseman is available that is A LOT better than Bogo?

If you want a list:

Faulk
Barrie
Vatanen
Fowler
Lindholm
Hamonic
Demers

to name a few. I know some are 'taken off' but doesn't mean they can't be traded. Last year Colorado did the same thing with Ryan O'Reilly saying they wouldn't trade him, then at the draft, traded him to Buffalo.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

So which defenseman is available that is A LOT better than Bogo?

None technically, the same way Cam Talbot was going to cost a 1st round pick last year.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

The fact is we already have one 2nd pairing defenceman making 5+ million in Sekera. We can't afford to be paying another guy that kind of money who can't handle top comps and top minutes.

 

[Mcnotloilersfan]

It's the same logic with Faulk, which was my point. There's no legitimate reason that he would be available.

Same logic doesn't apply to Faulk. Faulk is nothing compared to Doughty. Also, Carolina has much better D depth coming in to work with than LA and more cap space to take a 6m dollar contract back as part of the deal.

I'm not saying they will trade Faulk, or if they do what that price would be. But the 2, both in skill and circumstance, are nowhere near comparable.

 

[North]

If you want a list:

Faulk
Barrie
Vatanen
Fowler
Lindholm
Hamonic
Demers

to name a few. I know some are 'taken off' but doesn't mean they can't be traded. Last year Colorado did the same thing with Ryan O'Reilly saying they wouldn't trade him, then at the draft, traded him to Buffalo.

Demers is free too.

Just because Bogo is available doesn't mean you trade for him.

Settling for an oft injured poor defensively d man for fear of not finding a better defenseman is folly.

 

[Zaddy]

If you want a list:

Faulk
Barrie
Vatanen
Fowler
Lindholm
Hamonic
Demers

to name a few. I know some are 'taken off' but doesn't mean they can't be traded. Last year Colorado did the same thing with Ryan O'Reilly saying they wouldn't trade him, then at the draft, traded him to Buffalo.

Yeah...not many of those guys are going to get moved. Demers obviously because he is a UFA but there's more teams than Edmonton interested in him. Only one of Lindholm/Vatanen/Fowler will be moved most likely. Faulk is a pipe dream, he is not getting moved unless he is unhappy in Carolina, which there has been exactly zero reports of. Barrie is rumoured not to be available after all. So what does that leave you with? Most likely just Vatanen, and there's rumours out there that Bob Murray doesn't want to trade a defenseman within the division so there's that...

Also, we need 2 defensemen, not just 1. I highly, highly doubt we're getting 2 guys of that list.

The only reason Faulk could be available is Carolina cannot score.

The problem is if they trade Faulk for anything short a huge overpayment their team likely gets even worse.

In other words, 99.99% he is going nowhere.

Exactly, yet HFOil keeps mentioning his name for some reason.

 

[Paralyzer]

Yeah...not many of those guys are going to get moved. Demers obviously because he is a UFA but there's more teams than Edmonton interested in him. Only one of Lindholm/Vatanen/Fowler will be moved most likely. Faulk is a pipe dream, he is not getting moved unless he is unhappy in Carolina, which there has been exactly zero reports of. Barrie is rumoured not to be available after all. So what does that leave you with? Most likely just Vatanen, and there's rumours out there that Bob Murray doesn't want to trade a defenseman within the division so there's that...

Also, we need 2 defensemen, not just 1. I highly, highly doubt we're getting 2 guys of that list.



Exactly, yet HFOil keeps mentioning his name for some reason.

Did you read what I wrote? I'll post it again:

Last year Colorado did the same thing with Ryan O'Reilly saying they wouldn't trade him, then at the draft, traded him to Buffalo.

I don't buy that he's 'Not Available'. There was WAY too much smoke and when Bob Mackenzie says he's most definitely going to be traded, that tells you Sakic is probably just trying to get one team to over-pay. Same can be said of the others I posted. Those guys, even if they 'rescind' their trade request doesn't mean they can't be traded.

 

[McSuper]

If Bogo's the only defenceman we can get this offseason... Woof... He's a top 4 at least but he has struggled horribly when asked to play top minutes.

Bogo and Demers is still a big improvement . But the problem is Bogo is over paid and there is no way we know we are going to land Demers . Look at how many D were on the Market and now look

 

[Zaddy]

Same logic doesn't apply to Faulk. Faulk is nothing compared to Doughty. Also, Carolina has much better D depth coming in to work with than LA and more cap space to take a 6m dollar contract back as part of the deal.

I'm not saying they will trade Faulk, or if they do what that price would be. But the 2, both in skill and circumstance, are nowhere near comparable.

No, Carolina has 3 guys with about 1 year of NHL experience each on their roster. Then they have Michal Jordan (plug), Wisniewski (Injured, 1 year left on deal) and Hainsey (35 years old, 1 year left on deal). They absolutely cannot afford to move Faulk. That would be insane. It's like if Oilers go into next year with Nurse, Reinhart, Davidson as 3 of their top4 d-men. Just because you have some promising players doesn't mean you move your #1D, the rarest commodity in the entire NHL. Why is this so hard to understand?

 

[McWeber]

Thankfully, Chiarelli is our GM and he knows who to go for. It won't be for a run-of-the-mill defender. It'll be someone we didn't know was available. Bogosian should be a back up plan if he can't get any defencemen better than him. I just don't value him, and Stauffer backed me up on this.

I agree with this sentiment. Aside from Talbot and Kassian most of the moves Chia made we really had no clue on. Gryba, Reinhart, Maroon, Korpse, Clendening, Cracknell and Pardy were never really talked about at length before it happened. Im expecting one big predictable trade and one smaller trade that is sneaky good.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Bogo and Demers is still a big improvement . But the problem is Bogo is over paid and there is no way we know we are going to land Demers . Look at how many D were on the Market and now look

Neither one of those guys can play top pairing.

If push comes to shove acquire one of those two and sign Campbell.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Bogo and Demers is still a big improvement . But the problem is Bogo is over paid and there is no way we know we are going to land Demers . Look at how many D were on the Market and now look

It's a big improvement if the core is still here and the Oilers keep #4.

 

[Zaddy]

It's a big improvement if the core is still here and the Oilers keep #4.

So how do you get Barrie or whoever to upgrade the D?

 

[Mcnotloilersfan]

No, Carolina has 3 guys with about 1 year of NHL experience each on their roster. Then they have Michal Jordan (plug), Wisniewski (Injured, 1 year left on deal) and Hainsey (35 years old, 1 year left on deal). They absolutely cannot afford to move Faulk. That would be insane. It's like if Oilers go into next year with Nurse, Reinhart, Davidson as 3 of their top4 d-men. Just because you have some promising players doesn't mean you move your #1D, the rarest commodity in the entire NHL. Why is this so hard to understand?

Yeah only it isn't quite the same though. Hanifin is surefire top pairing guy and likely a future #1. We couldn't trade Nurse, Reinhart AND Davidson for him.

 

[Zaddy]

Yeah only it isn't quite the same though. Hanifin is surefire top pairing guy and likely a future #1. We couldn't trade Nurse, Reinhart AND Davidson for him.

There's no such thing as "surefire top pairing guy". And a good way to make sure your talented d prospect gets overwhelmed and stalls his development is trading the guy you're sheltering him with.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

So how do you get Barrie or whoever to upgrade the D?

??? You move those pieces, that wasn't my point.

My point was for Bogo and Demers to be the only adds to the blue and that to be a big improvement, the core should still be here and the Oilers should have picked at #4.

 

[Zaddy]

??? You move those pieces, that wasn't my point.

My point was for Bogo and Demers to be the only adds to the blue and that to be a big improvement, the core should still be here and the Oilers should have picked at #4.

Ok, misinterpreted that.

 

[Jejune]

Getting Bogosian is similar to the trade for Reinhart, except in this case you're getting somebody for their play 8 years earlier rather than 2. Nothing he's done lately suggests he's worth giving up significant assets for (and yes, I consider trading down from 4 to 8 a significant asset)

 

[Macblender]

With Chiarelli's willingness to threaten boston about a Dougie Hamilton offer sheet supposedly and this summers new deferral of compensation in the case of an offer sheet by the NHLPA I think we could see one.

The D market is potentially drying up I still believe Barrie is somewhat available for the right offer.

These are the RFA RH D who can be offer sheeted:

Barrie
Ristolainen
Trouba
Jones
Vatanen

Stone

Heavy lean towards the first 5 as options.

For LH D who would greatly improve us there is just Lindholm