Rumor: Rumors & Proposals Thread | The Road to the Draft June 28th and 29th

[Bryanbryoil]

Has Schwartz been fired?

Apparently not and if the rumors are to be believed we are trying to land one of his understudies in Carter Hart. AKA doubling down on Dustin instead of canning him.

 

[ThreeOfAPerfectPair]

Frank still believes the cap is going up ~$3M, Bettman's announcement was a negotiating tactic.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Frank still believes the cap is going up ~$3M, Bettman's announcement was a negotiating tactic.

Let's hope so and let's hope that if it is that Holland makes the most of it.

 

[Vagabond]

Yamamoto has to go the other way too.

Not necessarily. They can dump yamo in his hometown Seattle for a 3rd or 4th or wherever later on. Maybe they will take him but I doubt it.

Dump Ceci for a similar return we get from Yamo.

There's a few ways to make things work.

 

[nafrelio]

Lol you'd rather keep Campbell for another 4 years for 5 million man? No Thanks

You're assuming they want Campbell. That's a risk to take Hart, but of course we'd take a swap, Why would Philly though? They haven't found a goalie in forever. Don't think 4 years of Campbell is their answer.

 

[Spawn]

Apparently not and if the rumors are to be believed we are trying to land one of his understudies in Carter Hart. AKA doubling down on Dustin instead of canning him.

There is something hilarious about this. Schwartz has somehow survived 4 different head coaches and like 6 goalies crash and burn under his tutelage.

Fire him? Nah, let’s go out and get his “protege” a guy who hasn’t actually been any good since his rookie season lol.

 

[McTonyBrar]

Imagine if we moved Nurse to Philly just so that every game they could say that he's Donovan McNabb's nephew!

And replace his minutes, PK work and transition game along with leadership with who? Friggin Desharnais lol?

 

[Bryanbryoil]

And replace his minutes, PK work and transition game along with leadership with who? Friggin Desharnais lol?

$9.25 million could get us 2 pretty good defensemen.

 

[oobga]

Apparently not and if the rumors are to be believed we are trying to land one of his understudies in Carter Hart. AKA doubling down on Dustin instead of canning him.

Always gotta be a bizzare storyline around this team. This goalie coach surviving 4 GM's and 6 coaches while seeing almost every goalie under him regress on the NHL club, and then going after his star pupil who has struggled mightily for years now ... insanity. Hope there isn't much truth to it. We suffered enough this year with Campbell. This org needs to figure out goaltending in a hurry.

 

[NotASheep]

Always gotta be a bizzare storyline around this team. This goalie coach surviving 4 GM's and 6 coaches while seeing almost every goalie under him regress on the NHL club, and then going after his star pupil who has struggled mightily for years now ... insanity. Hope there isn't much truth to it. We suffered enough this year with Campbell. This org needs to figure out goaltending in a hurry.

that has to be a record

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

Always gotta be a bizzare storyline around this team. This goalie coach surviving 4 GM's and 6 coaches while seeing almost every goalie under him regress on the NHL club, and then going after his star pupil who has struggled mightily for years now ... insanity. Hope there isn't much truth to it. We suffered enough this year with Campbell. This org needs to figure out goaltending in a hurry.

Why we haven't atleast added Dusty Imoo to the staff is beyond me



If LA somehow gets Saros its game over...

 

[Hemsky4pm2]

The Oilers should be in on Hart - but it would really need to make sense on multiple levels. To be clear, I wouldn't make the below trade, judt trying to think about what it would take to get Hart while moving out Campbell. I think it would be wiser to just stick with Campbell and hope for a bounce back.

Campbell would need to be heading the other way - this raises the price for the Oilers. The Oilers could retain on Campbell to the tune of 20% of his cap hit, 1M/year - this would result in their goaltending cap-hit with Hart this coming season being effectively the same as it would be with Campbell. The Flyers would be saddled with Petersen and Campbell as their goaltending tandem for two years, with Campbell on the books a further 2 seasons.

I could see the Flyers being interested in:

TIER ONE
Holloway
Broberg
Bourgault

TIER TWO
Lavoie
Savoie
Petrov
Tullio
Niemelainen

So, let's make a deal based on the Oilers getting Hart and Cap space and the Flyers getting what they need (top prospects) PLUS the Oilers sweetening the pot to move Campbell out.

To Edmonton:
Carter Hart - 3.979M AAV, RFA with arb rights in 2024
Scott Laughton - 3.0M AAV, 3 years left

To Philly:
Kailer Yamamoto 3.1M AAV, RFA in 2024 (cap dump, Flyers buy him out)
Ryan McLeod, RFA with arb rights (estimated cap hit 2M)
Philip Broberg (former 1st round pick D with high potential)
Jack Campbell (at 3.8M AAV, Oilers retain 20% - 1M/year)
EDM 1st Round pick in 2024 or 2025
EDM 4th Round pick in 2025

Flyers get 3 solid, young building blocks (Broberg, McLeod and a 1st) for Hart + Laughton, plus an extra pick effectively to taking on Yamamoto and buying him out (4th in 2025). Oilers get a no.1 goalie and 3rd line C/W under contract.

The Oilers could then move out Warren Foegele for a draft pick to free up more cap space and replace him with a UFA winger / cheaper option. This could be Bjugstad on RW at 1.75M. Third line next season could potentially be Holloway - Laughton - Bjugstad.

The biggest issue here is that their are much cleaner deals for the Flyers if they move Hart.

Winnipeg, Toronto, Ottawa, L.A., San Jose, Carolina, NJD and Montreal (just off the top) could probably all make a deal that doesn't require the Flyers to take on any baggage.

 

[Fourier]

Sure, the expansion rules helped but you still need pro scouts with the ability to identify guys like Marchessault, Smith, Theodore and Tuch and be able to execute those trades. They fed off of errors by those management teams (Anaheim, Florida, Minny) but they took advantage. They always seem to find players that overachieve like the previous ones mentioned, very Tampa-like in that respect.

You also have to look at the circumstances of why those specific players were involved in these deals. In a number of cases it would have been the other team initiating the deal. Look at the Florida and Anaheim deals for example. My guess is that any pro scout would have been able to say yes to these deals as the players involved were obvious targets. The Anaheim deal for example would have been like the Oilers contacting Seattle and saying we don't want you to pick Larsson so we will give you Bouchard. For the Florida example, the offer would have been Nuge and say Yamamoto. I could have told Seattle that these were good deals. Marchasault was coming off a 30 goal 51 point season and Smith had already had two 20 goal 50+ point seasons. So it's not like the pro scouts had to dig deep to find out who these guys were. Tuch was a blue chip prospect.

I still say that since the expansion pretty much all of their big moves that have succeeded have come form big name players who wanted to go to Vegas. The only real find was Stephenson who they got for a 5th from Washington.

 

[Fourier]

I mean Byfield is a no.2 overall pick ... looks like no chance Hellebuyck wants to stay in Winnipeg and his contract is expiring ... they'd be dumb not to take that and run, although sure LA could throw a pick in on top of that.

And Jesse Puljujarvi was #4. In his 20 year old season he had 12 gals and 20 points. Byfield just had 3 goals and 22 points playing mostly on the wing with Kempe and Kopitar. Do you think 20 year old JP would have been the prize that would have gotten you Hellebuyck? Right now Byfield is looking a lot more like a Kotkaniemi level player than a stud. He might find his game but if you are Winnipeg you don't want to start a rebuild with that level player being your go to guy.

If that is what Winnipeg would take, I'd easily give them Broberg and Yamamoto for Hellebuyck 30% retained.

 

[duul]

Why we haven't atleast added Dusty Imoo to the staff is beyond me



If LA somehow gets Saros its game over...

I believe Imoo got let go by Toronto for some tweets or something. I completely disagree with somoene being fired for expressing their opinions no matter what they are, as long as they are competent in their job and do not disrupt the workplace.

..but the optics probably have something to do with it unfortunately.

 

[Fourier]

$9.25 million could get us 2 pretty good defensemen.

Actually it wouldn't. Mikey Anderson just signed for over $4M. It would get you two #4's most likely. That would be a big step back. Codi Ceci is at $3.25M and if you were to assess his play he'd probably be underpaid. So what you are doing is basically trading in Nurse for two more Codi Ceci's.

Nurse is frustrating because of the mistakes he makes. But the reality is that over the course of a season there is far more good in his game than bad. What we don't know is how much of this comes from trying to do too much without the support of a proper partner. In the playoffs away from Ceci for example the team did very well with Nurse on the ice. But he has only had guys who were #4's or worse to play with over the last 3 plus years.

 

[Broberg Speed]

And Jesse Puljujarvi was #4. In his 20 year old season he had 12 gals and 20 points. Byfield just had 3 goals and 22 points playing mostly on the wing with Kempe and Kopitar. Do you think 20 year old JP would have been the prize that would have gotten you Hellebuyck? Right now Byfield is looking a lot more like a Kotkaniemi level player than a stud. He might find his game but if you are Winnipeg you don't want to start a rebuild with that level player being your go to guy.

If that is what Winnipeg would take, I'd easily give them Broberg and Yamamoto for Hellebuyck 30% retained.

I don't understand the fascination with Byfield other than his draft pedigree and size. His value isn't more than a late 2nd rounder and I don't think many teams would offer even that.

 

[CookiesAndMilk]

Dustin Schwartz works with Carter Hart in the summers so it would be comical to me if we traded for Hart since he’s just another one of Schwartz’s victims. I guess on the positive side he’s already been ruined but I wouldn’t put it past Schwartz to ruin him some more

You can always oversalt a soup or a stew (no pun intended).

 

[Tarus]

And Jesse Puljujarvi was #4. In his 20 year old season he had 12 gals and 20 points. Byfield just had 3 goals and 22 points playing mostly on the wing with Kempe and Kopitar. Do you think 20 year old JP would have been the prize that would have gotten you Hellebuyck? Right now Byfield is looking a lot more like a Kotkaniemi level player than a stud. He might find his game but if you are Winnipeg you don't want to start a rebuild with that level player being your go to guy.

If that is what Winnipeg would take, I'd easily give them Broberg and Yamamoto for Hellebuyck 30% retained.

Dach was coming off a career high 9 goals, 26 points(22, 10, 26 points over 3 years) , was up and down the lineup, had a serious injury the year before, and lots of teams were still eager to get him. He ended up pulling an upper-mid first round draft pick, and Montreal was only too happy to fork over a 3.4 mill a year contract after getting him.

Put a 6'4 beside the word "center" on a player's bio, and GMs tend to go a bit goofy. Puljujarvi is a bit of a bad example though, as he likely tanked his rep around the league by the end of his ELC contract driving both Mclellan and Hitchcock up the wall.

 

[Zerotonine]

There is something hilarious about this. Schwartz has somehow survived 4 different head coaches and like 6 goalies crash and burn under his tutelage.

Fire him? Nah, let’s go out and get his “protege” a guy who hasn’t actually been any good since his rookie season lol.

Besides Kevin Lowe I think Schwartz has the most seniority now hahaha lol that's embarrassing esp when you combine that with goaltending being are weakest position for the last 15 years or soo

 

[ManofSteel55]

$9.25 million could get us 2 pretty good defensemen.

Two #4's. Great.

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

The Oilers should be in on Hart - but it would really need to make sense on multiple levels. To be clear, I wouldn't make the below trade, judt trying to think about what it would take to get Hart while moving out Campbell. I think it would be wiser to just stick with Campbell and hope for a bounce back.

Campbell would need to be heading the other way - this raises the price for the Oilers. The Oilers could retain on Campbell to the tune of 20% of his cap hit, 1M/year - this would result in their goaltending cap-hit with Hart this coming season being effectively the same as it would be with Campbell. The Flyers would be saddled with Petersen and Campbell as their goaltending tandem for two years, with Campbell on the books a further 2 seasons.

I could see the Flyers being interested in:

TIER ONE
Holloway
Broberg
Bourgault

TIER TWO
Lavoie
Savoie
Petrov
Tullio
Niemelainen

So, let's make a deal based on the Oilers getting Hart and Cap space and the Flyers getting what they need (top prospects) PLUS the Oilers sweetening the pot to move Campbell out.

To Edmonton:
Carter Hart - 3.979M AAV, RFA with arb rights in 2024
Scott Laughton - 3.0M AAV, 3 years left

To Philly:
Kailer Yamamoto 3.1M AAV, RFA in 2024 (cap dump, Flyers buy him out)
Ryan McLeod, RFA with arb rights (estimated cap hit 2M)
Philip Broberg (former 1st round pick D with high potential)
Jack Campbell (at 3.8M AAV, Oilers retain 20% - 1M/year)
EDM 1st Round pick in 2024 or 2025
EDM 4th Round pick in 2025

Flyers get 3 solid, young building blocks (Broberg, McLeod and a 1st) for Hart + Laughton, plus an extra pick effectively to taking on Yamamoto and buying him out (4th in 2025). Oilers get a no.1 goalie and 3rd line C/W under contract.

The Oilers could then move out Warren Foegele for a draft pick to free up more cap space and replace him with a UFA winger / cheaper option. This could be Bjugstad on RW at 1.75M. Third line next season could potentially be Holloway - Laughton - Bjugstad.

The biggest issue here is that their are much cleaner deals for the Flyers if they move Hart.

Winnipeg, Toronto, Ottawa, L.A., San Jose, Carolina, NJD and Montreal (just off the top) could probably all make a deal that doesn't require the Flyers to take on any baggage.

I'm not a fan of the trade, but irrespective of that this feels like a very un-Holland like deal, we've already got a young promising goalie of the same age, if he decides to move on from Campbell it'd likely be for a experienced goalie.

 

[Broberg Speed]

Dach was coming off a career high 9 goals, 26 points(22, 10, 26 points over 3 years) , was up and down the lineup, had a serious injury the year before, and lots of teams were still eager to get him. He ended up pulling an upper-mid first round draft pick, and Montreal was only too happy to fork over a 3.4 mill a year contract after getting him.

Put a 6'4 beside the word "center" on a player's bio, and GMs tend to go a bit goofy. Puljujarvi is a bit of a bad example though, as he likely tanked his rep around the league by the end of his ELC contract driving both Mclellan and Hitchcock up the wall.

Dach helped crush the Oilers in the playoffs. He was a monster in that series.

Byfield isn't better than Puljujarvi. Some fool team might take Byfield because he is a center.

 

[Senor Catface]

There is something hilarious about this. Schwartz has somehow survived 4 different head coaches and like 6 goalies crash and burn under his tutelage.

Fire him? Nah, let’s go out and get his “protege” a guy who hasn’t actually been any good since his rookie season lol.

I would say two good seasons, one bad one, then two seasons playing for one of the worst teams in the league.

 

[Tarus]

Dach helped crush the Oilers in the playoffs. He was a monster in that series.

Byfield isn't better than Puljujarvi. Some fool team might take Byfield because he is a center.

Did you even read my post? I address your points in the 2nd half -

"Put a 6'4 beside the word "center" on a player's bio, and GMs tend to go a bit goofy."

"Puljujarvi is a bit of a bad example <insert reasons>"