Roster thread: Get To Work (2022-2023 Season)

[BuffaloSabresSword]

Buffalo Will miss the playoffs next season we must make it. What do we need to do in the offseason to make it happen ? Building a new 4 th line instead of Okposo ? Upgrade depth on d and forwards?

 

[Bendium]

Mitts and VO have that annoying habit of being invisible for a stretch and when you think that they might finally move on from them, they a hot streak and you realize that those hot streaks will keep them around.

It's kind of like how one good frame gets you to go bowling again or that one nice shot gets you to go golfing again. Those small moments of bliss wash out the longer stretches of pain.




Ban team trips to the Caribbean.

The scoring streakiness is a common among middle six wingers, and I could live with. BUT......the part where they fail, is that when good middle six wingers are not scoring..... they are keeping the puck out of their own net! Niether Mitts or Oloffson have really done that in thier careers. That makes them poor middle six wingers, which is why I have wanted to trade them for some time now.

 

[Jim Bob]

The scoring streakiness is a common among middle six wingers, and I could live with. BUT......the part where they fail, is that when good middle six wingers are not scoring..... they are keeping the puck out of their own net! Niether Mitts or Oloffson have really done that in thier careers. That makes them poor middle six wingers, which is why I have wanted to trade them for some time now.

You are preaching to the choir.

So much so that most of the offseason I was getting torched any time I brought up the idea of trading Mitts or VO and so I just started keeping those thoughts to myself.

 

[My Cozen Dylan]

You are preaching to the choir.

So much so that most of the offseason I was getting torched any time I brought up the idea of trading Mitts or VO and so I just started keeping those thoughts to myself.

I’ve been on board with moving both for some time. Neither is a fit on a Sabres playoff team.

 

[BuffaloGooner]

This is more of a summer discussion and I’ll say that I don’t want to go full Murray, but what this season taught me even if they miss the playoffs is that the base of the team is there. There are legitimate stars on this team. We have to surround them with different archetypes.

I’m open to the idea of overhauling the entire bottom 6 forward group. Okposo is done IMO, Girgensons may walk. Besides Krebs/Jost they need to find something different. In an ideal world Adams gets guys that can slot with Cozens and knocks both Quinn/Peterka down.

We have capital, we have a million picks again. Use them. It’s time to start insulating the core.

 

[Bendium]

I’ve been on board with moving both for some time. Neither is a fit on a Sabres playoff team.

This is the real measuring stick. Just because a player is a nice guy, or friends with other players, or wants to be here, or serviceable as an NHL player........ does NOT mean they belong on a playoff team!

This is the standard I keep asking myself in every player thread. If the answer is NO I do not see a spot for them on my playoff team, then I am immediately looking to improve on that player. So if I have to trade that player PLUS something, to turn that roster spot into a player that does fill a need on my playoff team, then I am pulling the trigger over and over again.

 

[TehDoak]

This is more of a summer discussion and I’ll say that I don’t want to go full Murray, but what this season taught me even if they miss the playoffs is that the base of the team is there. There are legitimate stars on this team. We have to surround them with different archetypes.

I’m open to the idea of overhauling the entire bottom 6 forward group. Okposo is done IMO, Girgensons may walk. Besides Krebs/Jost they need to find something different. In an ideal world Adams gets guys that can slot with Cozens and knocks both Quinn/Peterka down.

We have capital, we have a million picks again. Use them. It’s time to start insulating the core.

I have zero issues walking from Jost. I like a lot about Jost, but the fact that he's one of the worst faceoff guys in the NHL really weakens his value, especially on this team. If we had a vet on the wing who could help with faceoffs or we simply were better on a whole as a team on faceoffs, then maybe we could make him work. But as the roster stands, we need to find a better fit

 

[tsujimoto74]

The scoring streakiness is a common among middle six wingers, and I could live with. BUT......the part where they fail, is that when good middle six wingers are not scoring..... they are keeping the puck out of their own net! Niether Mitts or Oloffson have really done that in thier careers. That makes them poor middle six wingers, which is why I have wanted to trade them for some time now.

I don’t know whether the fancy/micro stats bear this out, but just on eye test, I feel like we’ve seen some solid defensive growth from Mitts this season. It’s not perfect 100% of the time, but I think he’s still got more room to grow.

 

[Beerz]

I have zero issues walking from Jost. I like a lot about Jost, but the fact that he's one of the worst faceoff guys in the NHL really weakens his value, especially on this team. If we had a vet on the wing who could help with faceoffs or we simply were better on a whole as a team on faceoffs, then maybe we could make him work. But as the roster stands, we need to find a better fit

He is fine for getting him for free and helping push Hino and Asplund out of line up... but he definitely needs to be upgraded on.

 

[Bendium]

I don’t know whether the fancy/micro stats bear this out, but just on eye test, I feel like we’ve seen some solid defensive growth from Mitts this season. It’s not perfect 100% of the time, but I think he’s still got more room to grow.

If you are a playoff team that just lost a middle six winger for the year to injury....are you trading with the Sabres to bring Mitts in for your playoff run?

 

[Chainshot]

This is more of a summer discussion and I’ll say that I don’t want to go full Murray, but what this season taught me even if they miss the playoffs is that the base of the team is there. There are legitimate stars on this team. We have to surround them with different archetypes.

I’m open to the idea of overhauling the entire bottom 6 forward group. Okposo is done IMO, Girgensons may walk. Besides Krebs/Jost they need to find something different. In an ideal world Adams gets guys that can slot with Cozens and knocks both Quinn/Peterka down.

We have capital, we have a million picks again. Use them. It’s time to start insulating the core.

They need maturation out of Peterka and Quinn into more consistent contributors and that likely is just a matter of time. But while that accrues, there is what to do at the bottom of the lineup. Krebs has shown some ability to be an energetic cycle player and there isn't really an issue with a guy who plays that role and is basically even at 5-on-5 play.

Jost... seems the waiver energy has worn off and that happens. It was fun that he could plug into a line and it would start working. But that is also always on the fringe of replaceability.

Mittelstadt has had an uneven year. He has games where he's excellent along the wall and in traffic. And there are games where he's turning the puck, maddeningly.

Vic has a skill they don't have much of in his ability to wire pucks from mid-range. It's the consistency of it and the other aspects of the game. If he isn't scoring goals, is he doing something to help his line win their matchup 5-on-5? If not, he's a problem. If so, he's a benefit. To what degree can his inconsistency there be accepted with regards to what he does offer.

Gus has those shot suppression qualities. And a bit of knock around as well as being a dedicated cycle player that has value to this team as much as anyone else in that sort of role.

Okposo seems like he's drawing to the end.

 

[old kummelweck]

If you are a playoff team that just lost a middle six winger for the year to injury....are you trading with the Sabres to bring Mitts in for your playoff run?

He wouldn't be your first choice and given his contract, it would be a tricky deal.

 

[TehDoak]

I still think something around Mittelstadt and Greenway could be beneficial from both teams. Buffalo gets physicality that is sorely missed, MN gets a local guy who could take the next step in a different system. If it doesn't work for MN, the buyout on Mittelstadt is an under 26 buyout still, so it potentially gives the cap flexibility next year as well.

If Dumba's price is low enough, I'm keen to do a 'try before you buy' rental there as well. See if he meshes well with Power and in our system. If not, there's no commitment beyond this year. He does, we have the long term space to make something work.

 

[Bendium]

They need maturation out of Peterka and Quinn into more consistent contributors and that likely is just a matter of time. But while that accrues, there is what to do at the bottom of the lineup. Krebs has shown some ability to be an energetic cycle player and there isn't really an issue with a guy who plays that role and is basically even at 5-on-5 play.

Jost... seems the waiver energy has worn off and that happens. It was fun that he could plug into a line and it would start working. But that is also always on the fringe of replaceability.

Mittelstadt has had an uneven year. He has games where he's excellent along the wall and in traffic. And there are games where he's turning the puck, maddeningly.

Vic has a skill they don't have much of in his ability to wire pucks from mid-range. It's the consistency of it and the other aspects of the game. If he isn't scoring goals, is he doing something to help his line win their matchup 5-on-5? If not, he's a problem. If so, he's a benefit. To what degree can his inconsistency there be accepted with regards to what he does offer.

Gus has those shot suppression qualities. And a bit of knock around as well as being a dedicated cycle player that has value to this team as much as anyone else in that sort of role.

Okposo seems like he's drawing to the end.

Excellent post.

I really think they did more harm than good bringing Quinn and Peterka up this year. I look at them right now and do not really see any improvement in their game. They have both lost their confidence from getting overwelmed by mature NHL players.

They should have been left in the AHL one more year playing on the top line in all situation. The AHL gives more practice time and developmental work without as much pressure. It is also a bigger deal than people realize to let a player dominate for awhile at a level, to build real confidence.

I looked back to the 2006-2007 season when Pominville, Roy, Gaustad, and Vanek all moved up from a Calder Cup run to the Sabres and were successful and had impact.

Pomminville 22 years
Roy 22 years
Gaustad 23 years
Vanek 21 years.

They were all developed for 3-5 years and given time to dominate and become physically ready to make the jump. Vanek was the youngest, but had 2 years in the NCAA and one in the AHL. He was also supremely talented and importantly, already 6 foot 200 lbs. He had the size to do it.

Quinn and Peterka got fast tracked, and in my opinion would have benefited more from another year in the AHL than playing in the NHL. They were not ready.

There are currently no prospects from our last 2 draftys that we should be looking at to take NHL roster spots next year. none.

 

[TehDoak]

Excellent post.

I really think they did more harm than good bringing Quinn and Peterka up this year. I look at them right now and do not really see any improvement in their game. They have both lost their confidence from getting overwelmed by mature NHL players.

They should have been left in the AHL one more year playing on the top line in all situation. The AHL gives more practice time and developmental work without as much pressure. It is also a bigger deal than people realize to let a player dominate for awhile at a level, to build real confidence.

I looked back to the 2006-2007 season when Pominville, Roy, Gaustad, and Vanek all moved up from a Calder Cup run to the Sabres and were successful and had impact.

Pomminville 22 years
Roy 22 years
Gaustad 23 years
Vanek 21 years.

They were all developed for 3-5 years and given time to dominate and become physically ready to make the jump. Vanek was the youngest, but had 2 years in the NCAA and one in the AHL. He was also supremely talented and importantly, already 6 foot 200 lbs. He had the size to do it.

Quinn and Peterka got fast tracked, and in my opinion would have benefited more from another year in the AHL than playing in the NHL. They were not ready.

There are currently no prospects from our last 2 draftys that we should be looking at to take NHL roster spots next year. none.

I don't disagree with you on the main point. I felt Quinn/Peterka/Krebs were gifted a NHL spot and didn't have any real competition for the roster. However, your point about Roy/Pominiville/Vanek...the only reason they didn't make their (especially Vanek) debut earlier was the NHL in the 2004-05 season was locked out.

The inaction from last summer seems to be taking a toll as the season wears on. While it's obviously not over yet, to waste a norris caliber season from Dahlin is something that might weigh on him as we talk long term extension this summer.

 

[Beerz]

I still think something around Mittelstadt and Greenway could be beneficial from both teams. Buffalo gets physicality that is sorely missed, MN gets a local guy who could take the next step in a different system. If it doesn't work for MN, the buyout on Mittelstadt is an under 26 buyout still, so it potentially gives the cap flexibility next year as well.

If Dumba's price is low enough, I'm keen to do a 'try before you buy' rental there as well. See if he meshes well with Power and in our system. If not, there's no commitment beyond this year. He does, we have the long term space to make something work.

I'm not even sure Greenway offers any physicality anymore.. it seems to have disappeared from his game.

 

[Chainshot]

Excellent post.

I really think they did more harm than good bringing Quinn and Peterka up this year. I look at them right now and do not really see any improvement in their game. They have both lost their confidence from getting overwelmed by mature NHL players.

They should have been left in the AHL one more year playing on the top line in all situation. The AHL gives more practice time and developmental work without as much pressure. It is also a bigger deal than people realize to let a player dominate for awhile at a level, to build real confidence.

I looked back to the 2006-2007 season when Pominville, Roy, Gaustad, and Vanek all moved up from a Calder Cup run to the Sabres and were successful and had impact.

Pomminville 22 years
Roy 22 years
Gaustad 23 years
Vanek 21 years.

They were all developed for 3-5 years and given time to dominate and become physically ready to make the jump. Vanek was the youngest, but had 2 years in the NCAA and one in the AHL. He was also supremely talented and importantly, already 6 foot 200 lbs. He had the size to do it.

Quinn and Peterka got fast tracked, and in my opinion would have benefited more from another year in the AHL than playing in the NHL. They were not ready.

There are currently no prospects from our last 2 draftys that we should be looking at to take NHL roster spots next year. none.

As Doak pointed out, they also had the circumstance of the lockout that kept them all in the AHL for another year.

When the focus of the year went from being development as the message from Adams and Granato to winning and development from Adams and Granato, is there any improvement out of the Quinn and Peterka duo? I would say no. It's been in fits and spurts and my thought of sending Quinn back is more as a way to get him playing more minutes in important situations to get his confidence back and decision making back to what we have seen it can be. They are trying to have their cake and eat it too IMO.

 

[Bendium]

As Doak pointed out, they also had the circumstance of the lockout that kept them all in the AHL for another year.

When the focus of the year went from being development as the message from Adams and Granato to winning and development from Adams and Granato, is there any improvement out of the Quinn and Peterka duo? I would say no. It's been in fits and spurts and my thought of sending Quinn back is more as a way to get him playing more minutes in important situations to get his confidence back and decision making back to what we have seen it can be. They are trying to have their cake and eat it too IMO.

No way to know if the 06-07 group would have been brought up earlier without the lockout, but I think the point still stands that because they were older and more physically mature, they had an easier, more impactful transition to the NHL.

I just think Quinn and Peterka were brought up a year to early and would have been better developed in the AHL this year playing heavy minutes and building skills, confidence, and strength for next year. I think playing in the NHL before they were really ready has done more harm than help. Just my opinion.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

Does anyone know why Girg's ice time is down so dramatically from last year? Almost 2:15 minutes per game less.

For a team with atrocious defense it's curious he isn't deployed more. Not trying to read too many tea leaves, but that makes me think they're going to move on from him if possible.

 

[Jim Bob]

No way to know if the 06-07 group would have been brought up earlier without the lockout, but I think the point still stands that because they were older and more physically mature, they had an easier, more impactful transition to the NHL.

I just think Quinn and Peterka were brought up a year to early and would have been better developed in the AHL this year playing heavy minutes and building skills, confidence, and strength for next year. I think playing in the NHL before they were really ready has done more harm than help. Just my opinion.

The vast majority of people were ready to riot if Quinn and Peterka did not start the season in Buffalo.

And it is way too soon to tell if the full year in Buffalo impacted their development negatively. Given all the ice time they have been given and the environment the coaches have built, I think they have had a great development year this year and that dominating the AHL this season wouldn't have taught them as much as they have learned in the NHL.

 

[TehDoak]

No way to know if the 06-07 group would have been brought up earlier without the lockout, but I think the point still stands that because they were older and more physically mature, they had an easier, more impactful transition to the NHL.

I just think Quinn and Peterka were brought up a year to early and would have been better developed in the AHL this year playing heavy minutes and building skills, confidence, and strength for next year. I think playing in the NHL before they were really ready has done more harm than help. Just my opinion.

Vanek 100% would have been on the 04-05 team, even to his detriment. He was Buffalo's first high draft pick in the post Hasek era and the hype around him was high, especially after his D+1 year in MN.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Does anyone know why Girg's ice time is down so dramatically from last year? Almost 2:15 minutes per game less.

For a team with atrocious defense it's curious he isn't deployed more. Not trying to read too many tea leaves, but that makes me think they're going to move on from him if possible.

The vast majority of people were ready to riot if Quinn and Peterka did not start the season in Buffalo.

And it is way too soon to tell if the full year in Buffalo impacted their development negatively. Given all the ice time they have been given and the environment the coaches have built, I think they have had a great development year this year and that dominating the AHL this season wouldn't have taught them as much as they have learned in the NHL.

Girgensons TOI is down because KA/DG believed young players like Quinn and Peterka could still develop under Granato in the NHL (same thing for Okposo). They've been given ice time and some level of support and confidence that most other teams and HCs would not provide. I think the "winning is a priority" comments that started in Dec/Jan are more lip-service than anything. The top priority has been developing young players. They might be right...idk.

 

[tsujimoto74]

As Doak pointed out, they also had the circumstance of the lockout that kept them all in the AHL for another year.

When the focus of the year went from being development as the message from Adams and Granato to winning and development from Adams and Granato, is there any improvement out of the Quinn and Peterka duo? I would say no. It's been in fits and spurts and my thought of sending Quinn back is more as a way to get him playing more minutes in important situations to get his confidence back and decision making back to what we have seen it can be. They are trying to have their cake and eat it too IMO.

There was a string of games this season where it looked like the lightbulb was going on for Quinn. The decisions were good, the confidence was rising, the points were coming. And then it just flickered back off? A bit disappointing, but I’m sure he’ll get there eventually.

 

[Chainshot]

Does anyone know why Girg's ice time is down so dramatically from last year? Almost 2:15 minutes per game less.

For a team with atrocious defense it's curious he isn't deployed more. Not trying to read too many tea leaves, but that makes me think they're going to move on from him if possible.

One quick thing - last year was a bit more TOI than he's normally getting over the previous few seasons and one thing that sticks out between last year and this is PP time. Gus was bumper on PP2 for a lot of last year with a minute of PP time per game. He has almost no PP time this season, 58 seconds per game less. And that's probably a good thing.

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

This is more of a summer discussion and I’ll say that I don’t want to go full Murray, but what this season taught me even if they miss the playoffs is that the base of the team is there. There are legitimate stars on this team. We have to surround them with different archetypes.

I’m open to the idea of overhauling the entire bottom 6 forward group. Okposo is done IMO, Girgensons may walk. Besides Krebs/Jost they need to find something different. In an ideal world Adams gets guys that can slot with Cozens and knocks both Quinn/Peterka down.

We have capital, we have a million picks again. Use them. It’s time to start insulating the core.

Agreed.

They need to upgrade at least two or three of these players in order to be noticeably better next season: Okposo, Girgs, Jost, Mitts, VO, Bryson.