Roster thread: Get To Work (2022-2023 Season)

[Bendium]

If we wait till the deadline to get this team some help, it will be too late. Make those trades now, and making the playoffs has a much better chance.

 

[Dirty Dog]

I prefer still getting a middle pair Dman and fielding.

Samuelsson - Dahlin
Power - NewGuy
Johnson - Joker
Boosh

Bryson and or Clague swapped in trade for NewGuy

I don’t necessarily disagree. But I just don’t see them moving on from Boosh this year or next. I think you can pencil him in

 

[Ace]

He just might be confident (and in communication with Johnson’s camp) that he will be signing in a few months. If that’s the case, I’m okay with not making moves. Johnson-Boosh is an interesting pairing.

And this is more than fine for the time being as players grow:

Samuelsson - Dahlin
Power - Joker
Johnson - Boosh

At that point, we have our six defensemen. And the only way we are adding a starter is if someone is going out. So in KA’s mind, we may already have our 6. Despite what we all may think, the team is not ready to move on from Joker or Boosh so we only have one opening. And that might already be filled by Ryan Johnson.

Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t get better depth. But Bryson seems like a pretty good number 7

So many problems here.

If we pretend Johnson is signing…a difficult thing to do with a straight face…

you have a flat out bad #6 labeled as a good #7. That’s hilatious.

Lyubushkin the walking penalty machine and destroyer of offense thankfully only has one year left. So you’re banking on a rookie Johnson‘s first season and Lyubushkin’s last as answers for how long? Doesn’t really add up that a player with no pro experience is an answer in year one…which is the only length of time his partner in this scenario will be here.

and then there’s Joker. Just. No.

Even in your wildest wide eyed optimistic take…what do they do the year after? They have nothing coming. And still have a giant hole in the top 4.

 

[old kummelweck]

Is Quinn a paper transaction, or are they sending him down?

 

[Zman5778]

We were all well aware before Power even signed his pro contract that they needed to address another top 4 D.

That is an absolutely incorrect statement. MANY of us thought we had our top 4 once Power signed his pro contract.

And even through your protestations -- Joker has not proven that he's not a top 4 Dman yet. Not by a long shot.

 

[Dirty Dog]

So many problems here.

If we pretend Johnson is signing…a difficult thing to do with a straight face…

you have a flat out bad #6 labeled as a good #7. That’s hilatious.

Lyubushkin the walking penalty machine and destroyer of offense thankfully only has one year left. So you’re banking on a rookie Johnson‘s first season and Lyubushkin’s last as answers for how long? Doesn’t really add up that a player with no pro experience is an answer in year one…which is the only length of time his partner in this scenario will be here.

and then there’s Joker. Just. No.

Even in your wildest wide eyed optimistic take…what do they do the year after? They have nothing coming. And still have a giant hole in the top 4.

you misunderstand my post, which isn’t surprising. You can complain all you want about Joker, and you might be right…but the team clearly values him in a top 4 role right now and he isn’t being upgraded. Disagree all you want, but that’s pretty obvious.

And my post is IF Adams knows Johnson is saying (which he might), then I understand not wanting to add a player to block him. There is no pretending, optimism, or predictions in my post. I’m saying IF Adams knows, then I see what he may be doing.

Next time, please read my post better before you post one of your typically snarky, internet-y comments. I’d love for you to try and have a conversation without calling people’s posts hilarious, wide-eyed, and wild. Especially when it’s you that misread it

———

Anyways. I think people also forget that not only is Ryan Johnson a very good prospect, but he has been slow-cooked for awhile now. If he wants to sign, he is someone you make sure you have room for.

 

[PatLaFontaineASMR]

Is Quinn a paper transaction, or are they sending him down?

Paper transaction. Don said he'll play on Saturday.

 

[TehDoak]

I wonder what the cost of Dvorak + Savard from Montreal would be?

 

[MarkusKetterer]

So many problems here.

If we pretend Johnson is signing…a difficult thing to do with a straight face…

you have a flat out bad #6 labeled as a good #7. That’s hilatious.

Lyubushkin the walking penalty machine and destroyer of offense thankfully only has one year left. So you’re banking on a rookie Johnson‘s first season and Lyubushkin’s last as answers for how long? Doesn’t really add up that a player with no pro experience is an answer in year one…which is the only length of time his partner in this scenario will be here.

and then there’s Joker. Just. No.

Even in your wildest wide eyed optimistic take…what do they do the year after? They have nothing coming. And still have a giant hole in the top 4.

Anybody that thought Ilya was brought in to provide offense doesn’t really pay attention to other teams.

 

[Gras]

you are also excluding those who played at 32 who aren’t in the league anymore…..this is called sampling bias

i think he does sign in buffalo. He’s not a UZFA till aug 16. He plays this year he burns his ELC year.

if he said he was not signing then buffalo would have traded him. He’s not some throw in.

You only trade him if the compensation is better than the 2nd round comp pick.

 

[Zman5778]

I wonder what the cost of Dvorak + Savard from Montreal would be?

Savard I can see the interest in.....but why Dvorak?

 

[UnleashRasmus]

Delete

 

[Bendium]

The team does look fatigued at times. That said, the problem is going to quickly shift here from the players, to coaching and management.

1. Coaching - PP is one dimentional.
2. Coaching - Noone is ever in front of the net.
3. Coaching - Need at least some kind of defensive structure within this run and gun style.
4. Management - The lack of NHL dmen and lack of dmen prospects wont fix itself. This is one area I call BS on the patience mantra. Wait all you want, without trade it wont get better for years.
5. Management - You can only win so much without some size and grit in the forward group. Need to burn the drift wood and bring in some middle 6 talent.

The best players are being leaned on to hard, especially for their age. We are soon going to see if Donnie can coach past the development phase. We are going to soon see if KA can manage the roster going forward as the core enters its p[layoff capable window.....which by the way....is starting now.

 

[Sabre Dance]

Seems like a good time for a trade.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

I think this chart demonstrates some of the difficulties any single trade would face. Most of the team is negative 5v5. (x-axis is minutes/game).

They're about -6.5 xGd 5v5, and -4 xGd Special Teams. That's not a good stat; given how good their power play is their penalty kill is super bad. They're like +22 xG 5v4 and -26 xG 4v5. They get a fair amount more power plays than they give up.

Sabres hockey is fun and exciting, but just about every line is losing unless Dahlin is out with them. Cozens is doing surprisingly well given the amount of defensive shifts he starts. Quinn looks better on the chart than he actually is, he gets a lot of sheltered deployment.

 

[Aladyyn]

View attachment 634553

I think this chart demonstrates some of the difficulties any single trade would face. Most of the team is negative 5v5. (x-axis is minutes/game).

They're about -6.5 xGd 5v5, and -4 xGd Special Teams. That's not a good stat; given how good their power play is their penalty kill is super bad. They're like +22 xG 5v4 and -26 xG 4v5. They get a fair amount more power plays than they give up.

Sabres hockey is fun and exciting, but just about every line is losing unless Dahlin is out with them. Cozens is doing surprisingly well given the amount of defensive shifts he starts. Quinn looks better on the chart than he actually is, he gets a lot of sheltered deployment.

In what ways exactly?

 

[Chainshot]

In what ways exactly?

When the bench gets shortened, he and Peterka often don't get much TOI and when they do it's offensive deployment.

 

[Aladyyn]

When the bench gets shortened, he and Peterka often don't get much TOI and when they do it's offensive deployment.

Depending on the situation that could actually make his numbers look worse relative to the team. If they're disproportionately sitting when holding the lead then sure, but from what I remember and from what I see on hockeyviz, it's been happening both when chasing games and holding leads so I don't think it has much impact on the numbers.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

In what ways exactly?

He starts very few times defensively compared to Cozens and Peterka

 

[Aladyyn]

He starts very few times defensively compared to Cozens and Peterka

Quinn and Peterka have pretty much identical zone deployment

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

He starts very few times defensively compared to Cozens and Peterka

There's also the match-ups they face. Granato typically isn't throwing out the rookies against other teams top lines. We've seen games where opposing coaches will seek out those match-ups when the Sabres are on the road, but at home Granato will often try to line Quinn/JJ up with lesser competition when he has the 2nd line change advantage.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

Quinn and Peterka have pretty much identical zone deployment

As a percentage of shifts yes, total shifts no. JJP plays almost 50% time 5v5. They hide Quinn.

 

[zenthusiast]

Even if they’re not gunning for the playoffs (which I think they should, for the experience that it would grant the young players in a playoff chase), they could clearly stand to benefit from relieving some of the pressure on the players asked to carry the heaviest burdens

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

The team does look fatigued at times. That said, the problem is going to quickly shift here from the players, to coaching and management.

1. Coaching - PP is one dimentional.
2. Coaching - Noone is ever in front of the net.
3. Coaching - Need at least some kind of defensive structure within this run and gun style.
4. Management - The lack of NHL dmen and lack of dmen prospects wont fix itself. This is one area I call BS on the patience mantra. Wait all you want, without trade it wont get better for years.
5. Management - You can only win so much without some size and grit in the forward group. Need to burn the drift wood and bring in some middle 6 talent.

The best players are being leaned on to hard, especially for their age. We are soon going to see if Donnie can coach past the development phase. We are going to soon see if KA can manage the roster going forward as the core enters its p[layoff capable window.....which by the way....is starting now.

#1 - can be handled with some coaching and players shifting mentality to work the puck down low.
#2 - is on the players as well as coaching, and also applies to their own net.
#3 - Granato's presser yesterday he talked about the players not playing scared, as if he wanted them to play more confidently but that also says riskier to me. Seems like a conflict. They just can't take this style into the playoffs and expect to win four series...even in their prime in a couple years.
#4 - I agree. The only in-house option is Johnson signing and drafting a guy like Reinbacher, and both will take at least two years to be impact players. That's assuming they both actually hit their potential...patience doesn't work here.
#5 - Hoping Kulich will be a gritty player, but he's not enough.

KA has done well in allowing the scouting dept to shine in the draft, and creating a good culture and environment. At some point though he has to transition from "patience" (which is also a very easy route to rely on your scouting dept to draft, and just make a few insignificant signings along the way), and make a big trade or two to shore up obvious holes in the roster. For me the FW group can have some time, and UPL lately gives KA the same out for goaltending, but the D-corps just has to be acted on. If KA does nothing, hoping for Johnson to sign without knowing for sure, or doing nothing for other reasons that I hope aren't true, and then Johnson walks, that's going to be a bad sign to me. If he doesn't make a big move then in the summer for a D-man that will be a really, really bad sign.

 

[Aladyyn]

As a percentage of shifts yes, total shifts no. JJP plays almost 50% time 5v5. They hide Quinn.

Hide him from what?