Roster speculation XVIII - We're getting closer to things happening!

[Aladyyn]

So someone on trade boards coined this...

Bogosian + 8th + 38th for Eberle + 4th + 123rd

Is it just me or is that just mad value for us? 4th should be easier to flip for a D if we want to go that way.

 

[TehDoak]

In case you were wondering how "smart" some of the rumor mongers on twitter is:

 

[Aladyyn]

Some of the replies to that tweet are hilarious, such as saying Hall would fetch a top 10 D

Some interesting Sabres speculation from the guy though, apparently Vesey "always wanted to play with Eichel" and we have an offer in place for #3... Things might really actually start happening!

 

[TehDoak]

Some of the replies to that tweet are hilarious, such as saying Hall would fetch a top 10 D

Some interesting Sabres speculation from the guy though, apparently Vesey "always wanted to play with Eichel" and we have an offer in place for #3... Things might really actually start happening!

so wait, I post a tweet pointing out how stupid this guy is, your response is to get excited about the other things he posted?

Good Sir, can i interest you in a wonderful business opportunity?

 

[Aladyyn]

I mean, his evaluation of players is off, but that doesn't mean his speculation is.

 

[N.Y. Orangeman]

So someone on trade boards coined this...

Bogosian + 8th + 38th for Eberle + 4th + 123rd

Is it just me or is that just mad value for us? 4th should be easier to flip for a D if we want to go that way.

Just awful. Beyond awful.

 

[Jame]

That would be a tremendous disappointment. And for fun it leaves us with 5 D worth/have to protect in expansion...which we can't...so we end up taking a step backwards in the only area we took one forward almost immediately.

I know wanting to have offense is a crime around here...but we really need offense. And hey...we can protect forwards in expansion since those 6 and 7 slots are like...Foligno and Deslauriers.

This gives us another lottery year and then we have to protect Risto, Bogo and the guy you traded for and watch McCabe get plucked. And for extra fun we may have traded our 1st in a season where one of the worst 5 on 5 scoring teams got no help and missed the playoffs again. so we're just screwed all around.

Of course there's always the 8 skaters instead of 7/3 method. Where we risk Girgensons, Larsson and Pysyk. Maybe we get lucky and they take a forward and our top 9 can have you or me in it the next year.

Yea, all teams are going to pass on improving their teams this year for fear of losing ONE of their not 8 best players

(A entire year of idiot expansion arguments might actually break me...)

 

[truthbluth]

Yea, all teams are going to pass on improving their teams this year for fear of losing ONE of their not 8 best players

(A entire year of idiot expansion arguments might actually break me...)

C'mon Jame, Toronto graceful losing vs Buffalo disgraceful tanking didn't break you.
Leino as a 1st line center didn't break you.

Thankfully, you'll only have to worry about the expansion arguments for a few weeks now, for a few weeks leading up to the season opener, and a few weeks leading up to the deadline. I do feel the looming expansion draft will have some effect, particularly for teams that are in the early stages of a rebuild, but it shouldn't hinder the Sabres from trying to build a legit, NHL blue line.

 

[Sabre Dance]

Some of the replies to that tweet are hilarious, such as saying Hall would fetch a top 10 D

Some interesting Sabres speculation from the guy though, apparently Vesey "always wanted to play with Eichel" and we have an offer in place for #3... Things might really actually start happening!

Hoping we can get Ryan Murray from Columbus.

 

[TehDoak]

Hoping we can get Ryan Murray from Columbus.

I floated this idea a month or so back on the trade board. Needless to say, it didn't go well. (they have no reason to trade him)

 

[Zman5778]

(A entire year of idiot expansion arguments might actually break me...)

it's going to be the new "cap floor" argument we heard from many before the 14/15 season.

We're more than likely going to lose a solid player via expansion. But that's what the NHL wants. Moving along now.

 

[EichHart]

Hoping we can get Ryan Murray from Columbus.

Getting 3 would make my draft weekend, would be incredible.

 

[Sabre Dance]

I floated this idea a month or so back on the trade board. Needless to say, it didn't go well. (they have no reason to trade him)

What did you offer? My offer was pretty high, but fair IMO.

Reinhart and 8 for Ryan Murray and 3. Both #2 picks, but have shown flashes of being elite. Sabres IMO win the trade value by getting a near developed #1 LHD and also a 1st line wing prospect at #3.

Columbus gets a #1 center and a good prospect at 8.

 

[Zman5778]

I know wanting to have offense is a crime around here...but we really need offense.

Not as badly as you think.

How do you reconcile the facts that:

1a.) A team with a top 5 defense has won 7 of the 11 Cups since the lockout. Pittsburgh this year and Anaheim in 2007 fell just barely outside this.
1b.) The team with the better defense has won 9 of the 11 Cups since the lockout.

2a.) A team with a top 5 offense has won 5 of the 11 Cups since the lockout.
2b.) The team with the better offense has won 5 of the 11 Cups since the lockout.


To me these facts say that it's far more important to postseason success to have an elite defense rather than an elite offense.

Could we get it with a FA addition or two and natural growth from guys like Pysyk and McCabe? Maybe, possibly...in the right system.

Could we get an elite offense with an FA addition or two and natural growth from guys like Eichel, Reinhart, Girgensons and others? Absolutely.

To me, it's MUCH more likely that we can organically grow a Cup-caliber offense with the right FA sprinkled in than it is that we can organically grow a Cup-caliber defense right now.

This is why I (and others) are big fans of using #8 this year on a LHD. It'll be much easier to grow a Cup-level defense if we have Risto and #8 than it will be to rely on trade and FA acquisitions.

 

[thewookie1]

I wouldn't trade Reinhart for anything short of McDavid so he's not going to CBJ

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Hoping we can get Ryan Murray from Columbus.

I floated this idea a month or so back on the trade board. Needless to say, it didn't go well. (they have no reason to trade him)

What did you offer? My offer was pretty high, but fair IMO.

Reinhart and 8 for Ryan Murray and 3. Both #2 picks, but have shown flashes of being elite. Sabres IMO win the trade value by getting a near developed #1 LHD and also a 1st line wing prospect at #3.

Columbus gets a #1 center and a good prospect at 8.

The reason Clb would trade Murray or any D-man is because they need a #1C. I actually posted Reinhart and #8 for Werenski and #3, and didn't catch flak for it (actually got a prop).

Now I'm not promoting a Reinhart trade, because I know how sacrilegious that is for some, but the scenario plays out well for Buffalo depending on what you think of Puljujarvi. Werenski/Murray fills an obvious hole, while Puljujarvi might not be a huge drop off from Reinhart. Each team fills a void, while taking a small risk that the replacement they get in the draft (Pulju for Reinhart, Juolevi/Chychrun/Serg for Werenski/Murray) is not a big drop off.

I'm torn on the concept, but I'd feel better if Werenski came back.

 

[Sabre Dance]

I wouldn't trade Reinhart for anything short of McDavid so he's not going to CBJ

That's crazy.

 

[Jame]

it's going to be the new "cap floor" argument we heard from many before the 14/15 season.

We're more than likely going to lose a solid player via expansion. But that's what the NHL wants. Moving along now.

Exactly.

 

[TheWook]

Many people don't seem to realize that having a quality group of defensemen and a forward corp made up of two-way players is much more important than a one-dimensional scoring winger. Once we have those things (which we currently don't, that's the argument), the foundation of which all contending teams are built, and still can't score, then we can add scoring at the deadline like every contending team does.

 

[Sabre Dance]

Many people don't seem to realize that having a quality group of defensemen and a forward corp made up of two-way players is much more important than a one-dimensional scoring winger. Once we have those things (which we currently don't, that's the argument), the foundation of which all contending teams are built, and still can't score, then we can add scoring at the deadline like every contending team does.

There is one stat I wish we had available that would end this entire debate, offensive and defensive zone time.

If you're spending over half the game in the opponents defensive zone, even if you're not generating tons of shots your preventing the other team from generating shots on your goal.

We look at shot attempt as possession, but it's a flawed stat without comparing zone time.

I would equate it to a hurry up offense in the NFL. Sure the K-gun put up points but it put more pressure on the defense than a ball control offense because they were on the field more.

Boston and LA were elite D teams when they won the cup, but in playing those teams you couldn't get the puck from them in the offensive zone. Their cycle game was strong. Defense gets tired. Their forwards would win battles along the boards.

 

[Zman5778]

Sure the K-gun put up points but it put more pressure on the defense than a ball control offense because they were on the field more.

And the Bills lost 3 of the 4 Super Bowls because they couldn't play defense when it mattered.......and the offense sputtered.

 

[flashsabre]

Ducks just signed Vatanen for 4 years. Wonder how the contract impacts Risto. Now they have to sign Lindholm which will probably make Fowler available at the draft.

 

[Sabre Dance]

Ducks just signed Vatanen for 4 years. Wonder how the contract impacts Risto. Now they have to sign Lindholm which will probably make Fowler available at the draft.

Yeah, now Im expecting Fowler to move. Im guessing Buffalo.

 

[Sabre Dance]

Wow, he only got $4.8 million. They could possibly keep all 3 D now. Good news that Risto probably gets less than we expected, but bad news that the Ducks got Sami for such a great deal.

 

[krt88]

Ducks just signed Vatanen for 4 years. Wonder how the contract impacts Risto. Now they have to sign Lindholm which will probably make Fowler available at the draft.

Gotta believe Fowler will be the guy moved. Honestly I like Vatanen better but nothing can be done about that.