Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2023-24: Hotel California

[doublechili]

They weren’t wrong when they said he preys on weak play. It just didn’t specify if it was his or his opponent.

The part about weak play jumped out at me too, but for a different reason. When a kid is playing in juniors, USHL, college, etc., 99% of their opposition is not going to be in the NHL. So "preys on weak play" versus future beer league players doesn't help when you get to the big show and there is no "weak play". It's the old thing: does a prospect score NHL goals, and how does he produce at 5v5? MDC had a lot of PP goals in juniors, and he scored a lot of goals on uncontested shots from the slot. We know how that turned out. I remember when people were drooling over Filatov, yet his highlights were mostly breakaway goals. When that doesn't work anymore against better competition, does a guy have skills to succeed?

 

[miscs75]

The part about weak play jumped out at me too, but for a different reason. When a kid is playing in juniors, USHL, college, etc., 99% of their opposition is not going to be in the NHL. So "preys on weak play" versus future beer league players doesn't help when you get to the big show and there is no "weak play". It's the old thing: does a prospect score NHL goals, and how does he produce at 5v5? MDC had a lot of PP goals in juniors, and he scored a lot of goals on uncontested shots from the slot. We know how that turned out. I remember when people were drooling over Filatov, yet his highlights were mostly breakaway goals. When that doesn't work anymore against better competition, does a guy have skills to succeed?

Hockey IQ should be the main factor when it comes to drafting a guy honestly. You can teach positional play but knowing where to be and reading plays is a massive tell tale sign of a guys ability to develop. This is why guys like Yakupov and Ho-Sang won’t work out. They just don’t know what to do when away from the puck/make dumb decisions with it. Walterson ain’t any different than those two honestly.

 

[mm11]

agree, look at a guy like Horvat, not an eye candy prospect when coming out but had very good Hockey IQ which is translating to a very good NHL career. Heck, this scouting thing looks easy. LGI, Lou, i'll take 275k a year, sign me up brother

 

[YearlyLottery]

Pageau has looked a bit more healthy as of late. I am hoping that Lambert keeps that third line together for the foreseeable future. Lee has looked best on the first line this season and gives them a bit of muscle.

 

[NYI365]

Lou probably has Wahlstrom+Aho+1st+other picks+Pageau on his short list of available assets for trade. Not including prospects rn.

What Lou can get for say Wahlstrom+Aho+1st is another story. In terms of value I'd say that package is probably a notch or two below the package we gave VAN for Bo last year.

 

[Osakahaus]

Isles need a Ferraro or Fehavary instead of a Hanifin IMO

We need that guy to round out that 3rd pair with scotty. I really wish they can find that Andy Greene, but it'll be tough. Bortuzzo reminds me of a better Schenn or whatever the hell the guy was in 2021 they got for a 7th.

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

Hockey IQ should be the main factor when it comes to drafting a guy honestly.

There's no magic formula, which is why drafting is hard.

 

[Osakahaus]

There's no magic formula, which is why drafting is hard.

Hockey drafts are basically praying some 18-20 year old kid can skate and play fast enough to hopefully be a solid middle 6 player.

 

[crashthenet]

Hockey IQ should be the main factor when it comes to drafting a guy honestly. You can teach positional play but knowing where to be and reading plays is a massive tell tale sign of a guys ability to develop. This is why guys like Yakupov and Ho-Sang won’t work out. They just don’t know what to do when away from the puck/make dumb decisions with it. Walterson ain’t any different than those two honestly.

Specific to Wahlstrom, his skating wasn't great before the injury. Similar to Lee and many others, the following year there are residual effects. I had a conversation with Snow about Reinhart; he said he could do it all but a was a half a step too slow to do it at the NHL level. Seems like Wahlstrom may be suffering similarly. Perhaps exacerbated by the injury.

I don't know that Wahlstrom was on track to be a first line player but I wouldn't compare to Ho-Sang. Ho-Sang had absolutely no clue about how to play within structure and lacked the discipline and to learn. I wouldn't say Wahlstrom is that by any means. 16 pts in 35 games before the injury last year. Was trending in the right direction. Not saying I haven't been critical because I have.

 

[miscs75]

Specific to Wahlstrom, his skating wasn't great before the injury. Similar to Lee and many others, the following year there are residual effects. I had a conversation with Snow about Reinhart; he said he could do it all but a was a half a step too slow to do it at the NHL level. Seems like Wahlstrom may be suffering similarly. Perhaps exacerbated by the injury.

I don't know that Wahlstrom was on track to be a first line player but I wouldn't compare to Ho-Sang. Ho-Sang had absolutely no clue about how to play within structure and lacked the discipline and to learn. I wouldn't say Wahlstrom is that by any means. 16 pts in 35 games before the injury last year. Was trending in the right direction. Not saying I haven't been critical because I have.

Wahlstrom from what I’ve seen is a kid who has most of the tools but no toolbox. Fancy shot, NHL size (and strength) but slower than dirt and no concept of positioning. He got most of his points off of luckily being the right spot by luck. This year truly showed the player he is. He doesn’t know where to be and when to be there plus his play away from the puck is extremely lazy. If he can’t get the puck in the slot, he doesn’t look to create space for himself.

 

[Doshell Propivo]

"Kids got good hockey IQ." Sounds like some of the nonsensical evaluations the scouts in Moneyball were spouting...

 

[YearlyLottery]

There's no magic formula, which is why drafting is hard.

You don't need to search much farther than our very own Mat Barzal. Fantastic hockey player whose main talent is his skating ability not his hockey IQ. He just learned that he needs to shoot this season. If we only drafted under hockey IQ Barzal would not be an Islander.

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

"Kids got good hockey IQ." Sounds like some of the nonsensical evaluations the scouts in Moneyball were spouting...

Shouldn't draft anyone whose girlfriend isn't at least a 7.

 

[leeroggy]

Shouldn't draft anyone whose girlfriend isn't at least a 7.

 

[Throttle]

You don't need to search much farther than our very own Mat Barzal. Fantastic hockey player whose main talent is his skating ability not his hockey IQ. He just learned that he needs to shoot this season. If we only drafted under hockey IQ Barzal would not be an Islander.

Took the guy 7 years to figure that out. My guess is that’s not what the Isles figured was gonna happen.

 

[mm11]

Took the guy 7 years to figure that out. My guess is that’s not what the Isles figured was gonna happen.

he had something figured out after his 20 year old rookie season finished, sprinkle in some heightened defensive structures, plus a few shortened seasons and here we are. Kid still has NHL hardware, tons of playoff wins and series wins all before 26. Yeeesh, tough crowd

 

[Osakahaus]

Lambert isn't getting fired until the end of 2024 IMO. This entire staff is in need of seeing more out of the PK, and thats our death knell as of now.

 

[Top Corner]

Specific to Wahlstrom, his skating wasn't great before the injury. Similar to Lee and many others, the following year there are residual effects. I had a conversation with Snow about Reinhart; he said he could do it all but a was a half a step too slow to do it at the NHL level. Seems like Wahlstrom may be suffering similarly. Perhaps exacerbated by the injury.

I don't know that Wahlstrom was on track to be a first line player but I wouldn't compare to Ho-Sang. Ho-Sang had absolutely no clue about how to play within structure and lacked the discipline and to learn. I wouldn't say Wahlstrom is that by any means. 16 pts in 35 games before the injury last year. Was trending in the right direction. Not saying I haven't been critical because I have.

If I had to choose between the 2 evils, I take Ho-Sangs skill over Wahlstrom shot but to be clear, both are not real good options. I do like Maggio though

 

[YearlyLottery]

If I had to choose between the 2 evils, I take Ho-Sangs skill over Wahlstrom shot but to be clear, both are not real good options. I do like Maggio though

JHS was a much better hockey player than Wahlstrom. There is so much more that goes into it than just being a hockey player though. He has always been productive in the NHL but once Trotz gave him a second chance and he got sent back down after 10 games his career was finished.

 

[Doshell Propivo]

he had something figured out after his 20 year old rookie season finished, sprinkle in some heightened defensive structures, plus a few shortened seasons and here we are. Kid still has NHL hardware, tons of playoff wins and series wins all before 26. Yeeesh, tough crowd

He also has confidence now, thankfully.

 

[saintunspecified]

"Kids got good hockey IQ." Sounds like some of the nonsensical evaluations the scouts in Moneyball were spouting...

The only thing that's wrong about it's oversimplified - there are several kinds of 'hockey' or 'field' senses. Some of things labeled 'sense' are really about thinking, planning, and work ethic. Others are about visual processing, or pattern recognition. Others senses relate to timing. It's why the minors/europe have tons of ex-prospects who completely lacked the skill or athleticism to be NHL players.

These senses are evident when one coaches youth team sports. It's especially pretty common to see youth players who love the sport but lack the raw athleticism others have excel in 'senses'. That's much more common than seeing very good athletes who have excellent field/rink sense. Steve Yzerman was the rare type who had both, which is why was still so effective when hobbled.

 

[Mr Misunderstood]

Shouldn't draft anyone whose girlfriend isn't at least a 7.

Especially if none of his teammates show up to his birthday party.

 

[saintunspecified]

JHS was a much better hockey player than Wahlstrom. There is so much more that goes into it than just being a hockey player though. He has always been productive in the NHL but once Trotz gave him a second chance and he got sent back down after 10 games his career was finished.

I think Ho-Sang had the intelligence but was missing something else. Wahlstrom seems like a meathead.

 

[Lek]

I think Ho-Sang had the intelligence but was missing something else. Wahlstrom seems like a meathead.

i think Wally interviews like a long lost Belushi brother.

 

[MJF]

I think Ho-Sang had the intelligence but was missing something else. Wahlstrom seems like a meathead.

Ho-Sang was missing discipline. The ability to take instruction.