Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2023-24: Hotel California

[MJF]

I'm not interested in paying a premium to move Bailey for exactly that reason. If he can't be moved for a reasonable price then it's just better to deal with it for another year and let the contract expire. Paying to move him for the current UFA crop, even the Islanders' UFAs, doesn't make a ton of sense to me. That cap space needs to be put to good use if they're moving him so I hope it'll be a precursor to another deal.

Then can Bailey's request not to be a healthy scratch be accommodated? Josh may have a bitter pill to swallow if he doesn't get bought out or decide to retire like Komarov did.

 

[Osakahaus]

Then can Bailey's request not to be a healthy scratch be accommodated? Josh may have a bitter pill to swallow if he doesn't get bought out or decide to retire like Komarov did.

If that happens then it hurts the islanders cap wise. Bailey probably is a 13th forward, or gets buried in Bridgeport (the better option)

 

[SI]

And yet the isles can't move Bailey...

Foligno is an expiring contract. You're too reactionary

 

[PK Cronin]

I shoulda used the sarcasm smiley.

I knew what it was, just replied anyway.

I don't consider 2 2nd rounders and a 3rd a good deal for us regarding Ladd. Go back and look at the board everyone here was killing Lou every year after making this move. What did he do for Komarov, he send him down to Bridgeport. Komarov decided he didn't want to stay in the minors and when over seas. Do you see Lou sending down Bailey?? I'm all for it.

My impression is/was that most fans were fine with the cost of Ladd. It's fine if you disagree. Yes, he got rid of Komarov and made his cap hit go away. I don't see the same benefit for Bailey to be sent to the minors since I doubt he'd go overseas to play. If they were going to mutually terminate his deal they'd do so now.

I'm getting worked up because there was some possible opportunities here on the cheap. But I think Lou falls a sleep for months. You'll see him at the draft, after that, next time you'll hear from him is at training camp. While other gms are actively out there. And if you say how do I know he isn't. Well isn't if funny during the offseason you'll hear from the media and beat writers about teams talking. Never about the isles though.

Lamoriello doesn't allow other teams to talk about it because he'll kill the deal. This idea that he's not doing anything is just dumb. He's made significant moves almost every year. Pageau, Palmieri, Horvat...but we're going to pretend like he's not doing anything because he's not working on your timeline or doing what you want him to do.

Just like you, all I want is this team to win. But I think Lou is way past his prime and it's really hurting us now. Yes, I'll give all the credit in the world to Lou when he first came here....and mainly because he brought in a HF coach who was able to get 110% out of the roster that was basically the same the year before (minus JT)....which was incredible that Trotz was able to bring this team to 2 conference championships.

That's fine, I don't have an issue with disliking what he's doing now. Creating scenarios out of thin air is something else entirely.

 

[IslesNorway]

Better to just let him go to 13th forward, and deal someone else (like Aho) to clear up space. Bailey isn't getting moved that easily, not right now and not in the buyout window.

Isles need to get those $5 million gone, trading Aho makes on difference.

 

[PK Cronin]

Isles need to get those $5 million gone, trading Aho makes on difference.

Only if they plan on using that space for something worthwhile.

 

[SI]

If we trade Nelson then we might as well trade everyone over 30, tear it down and rebuild. He’s our best/most consistent goal scorer.

Not necessarily - if the plan is to use that 6m on another player in free agency... Tarasenko, Bertuzzi, or Barbashev.

I get that 10 OA would not be enough for 2 years of Nelson - there is the possibility to grab another pick (like the Leafs 2024 2nd) + a prospect like Dylan Peterson

10th OA and Jimmy Snuggerud or Zach Bolduc. I prefer Snuggerud

The 10th OA pick could be on the NHL roster as early as 2024-25.

 

[Osakahaus]

Only if they plan on using that space for something worthwhile.

And in a UFA class like this, it isn't really worth it unless we go hunting for Ivan Barbashev or Bertuzzi, both of which feel like instant regret contracts.

 

[PK Cronin]

Not necessarily - if the plan is to use that 6m on another player in free agency... Tarasenko, Bertuzzi, or Barbashev.

I get that 10 OA would not be enough for 2 years of Nelson - there is the possibility to grab another pick (like the Leafs 2024 2nd) + a prospect like Dylan Peterson

10th OA and Jimmy Snuggerud or Zach Bolduc. I prefer Snuggerud

The 10th OA pick could be on the NHL roster as early as 2024-25.

I would have to think there could be a less risky return than the pick as the main piece coming back.

And in a UFA class like this, it isn't really worth it unless we go hunting for Ivan Barbashev or Bertuzzi, both of which feel like instant regret contracts.

Agreed. Burtuzzi seems likely to be reupped in Boston now that Hall is gone too. Barbashev is going to get paid for a great playoff performance and that's a huge risk for anyone taking that on.

 

[SI]

The Blues are built for now?

Most of their players are 30-34 - Schenn, Saad, Leddy, Faulk, Krug, Parayko, Binnington are all 30+ - you also Buchnevich at 28.

They are not rebuilding and retooled at the end of the season - Sanheim and Hayes potential deal was the Blues retooling to compete in 2023-24.

How successful they are and whether they should be rebuilding is entirely different topic

 

[Glorydays22]

I knew what it was, just replied anyway.



My impression is/was that most fans were fine with the cost of Ladd. It's fine if you disagree. Yes, he got rid of Komarov and made his cap hit go away. I don't see the same benefit for Bailey to be sent to the minors since I doubt he'd go overseas to play. If they were going to mutually terminate his deal they'd do so now.



Lamoriello doesn't allow other teams to talk about it because he'll kill the deal. This idea that he's not doing anything is just dumb. He's made significant moves almost every year. Pageau, Palmieri, Horvat...but we're going to pretend like he's not doing anything because he's not working on your timeline or doing what you want him to do.



That's fine, I don't have an issue with disliking what he's doing now. Creating scenarios out of thin air is something else entirely.

Regarding the moves he made i.e Parms, Pageau and Horvat. Just curious to know your opinion. Are you of the opinion he didn't overpaid in general as well as compound it with big contracts that are now hurting and will hurt us down the line? Mind you, I love Pageau (one of my favorite current players), but just want to hear your opinion on this. I mean we signed Horvat to an $8.5M deal which I think everyone knows he's not worth that deal. See the only way he can get FAs is to trade for them and then sign them to an overpayment.

And if you think I'm wrong, name 1 UFA that signed with us that was a big name. Please, don't bring up Ladd. Anyone else? He struck out on Panarin, Gaudreau, Kadri (to a lessor extent- didn't want him but). I know I'm missing at less one other but you get the picture.

 

[SI]

I would have to think there could be a less risky return than the pick as the main piece coming back.



Agreed. Burtuzzi seems likely to be reupped in Boston now that Hall is gone too. Barbashev is going to get paid for a great playoff performance and that's a huge risk for anyone taking that on.

If that 1st is Michkov? Or Benson? Or Leonard?, those will be guys this fan base will drool over - you know how we love our prospects.

 

[PK Cronin]

Regarding the moves he made i.e Parms, Pageau and Horvat. Just curious to know your opinion. Are you of the opinion he didn't overpaid in general as well as compound it with big contracts that are now hurting and will hurt us down the line? Mind you, I love Pageau (one of my favorite current players), but just want to hear your opinion on this. I mean we signed Horvat to an $8.5M deal which I think everyone knows he's not worth that deal. See the only way he can get FAs is to trade for them and then sign them to an overpayment.

And if you think I'm wrong, name 1 UFA that signed with us that was a big name. Please, don't bring up Ladd. Anyone else? He struck out on Panarin, Gaudreau, Kadri (to a lessor extent- didn't want him but). I know I'm missing at less one other but you get the picture.

Pageau was just prior to the pandemic so I think that one looks worse than it was at the time. I'm not blaming any GM for what they did just prior to the world shutting down. I don't think it was an overpayment though, for the time. Honestly, I don't have a problem with any of the trades he's made. The Palmieri deal was a win now move and we knew that deal wouldn't age well, it's unfortunately happened sooner than later (we'll see if he can stay healthy this year). Horvat is too early to tell what that deal will look like.

I don't think he's been in a position to sign big name UFAs for most of his tenure. There hasn't been cap space due to the flat cap and the team trying to compete for a cup during that time.

 

[Osakahaus]

Pageau was just prior to the pandemic so I think that one looks worse than it was at the time. I'm not blaming any GM for what they did just prior to the world shutting down. I don't think it was an overpayment though, for the time. Honestly, I don't have a problem with any of the trades he's made. The Palmieri deal was a win now move and we knew that deal wouldn't age well, it's unfortunately happened sooner than later (we'll see if he can stay healthy this year). Horvat is too early to tell what that deal will look like.

I don't think he's been in a position to sign big name UFAs for most of his tenure. There hasn't been cap space due to the flat cap and the team trying to compete for a cup during that time.

Pageau honestly is a decent deal still and i'll still pay him at that contract btw

 

[Glorydays22]

Pageau was just prior to the pandemic so I think that one looks worse than it was at the time. I'm not blaming any GM for what they did just prior to the world shutting down. I don't think it was an overpayment though, for the time. Honestly, I don't have a problem with any of the trades he's made. The Palmieri deal was a win now move and we knew that deal wouldn't age well, it's unfortunately happened sooner than later (we'll see if he can stay healthy this year). Horvat is too early to tell what that deal will look like.

I don't think he's been in a position to sign big name UFAs for most of his tenure. There hasn't been cap space due to the flat cap and the team trying to compete for a cup during that time.

I appreciate your feedback. I will disagree with you on Panarin. That was the offseason where we lost JT. Lou had money and wanted to make a splash with Panarin. When he didn't get him, even though it's been known that he out bid the Rangers, he pivoted and re-signed Lee.

I also don't have high hopes for Horvat just the simple fact before last year with Van. He was a 50pt player his entire career.

Mind you, I want to be 1000% wrong on everything I have said so far. I want Lou and you to throw it in my face....wouldn't care if that means our Isles are winning again. So Lou, Please prove me wrong and everyone hear can throw it back and me and I will happily take it

 

[Throttle]

f



he outscored JT, by mid season he as the one playing infront of #91 not behind

Again, worst team in the league defensively, the opponents are not really wasting their time on the Isles in that situation. He can (and did) bank all the points, however, his production hasn’t reached the same level shackled and unshackled. Lot harder to produce and impact when teams learn to play against you.

We can go in circles all day, we should just agree to disagree on this particular player.

 

[Throttle]

Then can Bailey's request not to be a healthy scratch be accommodated? Josh may have a bitter pill to swallow if he doesn't get bought out or decide to retire like Komarov did.

Baileys in for a bouncy ride and some hotel rooms this season, gonna be a long season for him once off the Island.

 

[Throttle]

And the Islanders have 9 players on the roster that have been here since at least 2015 and still haven’t won squat.

I realize you don’t make change for change sake, but I didn’t think the Islanders would become a jobs program.

I agree, but the big bucks guys are underperforming (Barzal, Lee, pulock), young ones are still learning and not having an immediate impact, and the old dudes are old with term.

The ‘one year too many’ is kinda biting the team in the butt for certain guys and ‘another $1-2M for the isles overpay’ is the same issue for other guys. The flattish cap has hampered the breathing room.

Under Malkin/Lou, Isles are in their best spot since 70/80s, which is lame, but true. I’m open to see what happens, if anything.

 

[MJF]

Baileys in for a bouncy ride and some hotel rooms this season, gonna be a long season for him once off the Island.

Or he’ll have a seat next to Ross Johnston most nights.

 

[NC 1972]

I'm not saying Bailey is even close to Hall in talent. Lou should have moved Bailey right away before something like this happened. With the cap only going up 1M, there are going to be more teams (as we are seeing) going to dump cap....Anyone i.e Johnsson, Hall and whomever is next is 100 times better than Bailey.


I don't care about Boston, Nashville, Calgary or whatever other team does last year or now. My concern is only for the isles and we aren't doing shit. Lou needs to be proactive with cap concerns for many of the teams this offseason.

And feel free to correct me if I’m wrong here, but didn’t we bring on a capologist awhile back?

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

I appreciate your feedback. I will disagree with you on Panarin. That was the offseason where we lost JT. Lou had money and wanted to make a splash with Panarin. When he didn't get him, even though it's been known that he out bid the Rangers, he pivoted and re-signed Lee.

Panarin was the year after Tavares.

 

[seafoam]

Unless Lamoriello pays assets to move Bailey, his only other (trade) option would likely be to exchange Bailey for a player with multiple years of term. In that case the Islanders however would be gaining minimal cap space (if any) or even gaining some.

The Islanders get a better fit (PPQB?) and the team they are trading with gets out of a deal early (since Bailey has one year remaining).

 

[Glorydays22]

Panarin was the year after Tavares.

your right but we still had cap space. Lou wasn't going to re-sign Lee if he got Panarin.

 

[NC 1972]

Again, worst team in the league defensively, the opponents are not really wasting their time on the Isles in that situation. He can (and did) bank all the points, however, his production hasn’t reached the same level shackled and unshackled. Lot harder to produce and impact when teams learn to play against you.

We can go in circles all day, we should just agree to disagree on this particular player.

Agreed it was jailbreak hockey and he benefited from playing behind 91 and whether you agree or not JT made everyone a better offensive player i.e. Matt Molson . Would you agree that Barzal is a top skater in this league? Then why can’t he get to the center of the ice like Jack Hughes for him to be worthy of his new contract he’s going to have to start playing like the kid in NJ.

 

[SI]

I appreciate your feedback. I will disagree with you on Panarin. That was the offseason where we lost JT. Lou had money and wanted to make a splash with Panarin. When he didn't get him, even though it's been known that he out bid the Rangers, he pivoted and re-signed Lee.

I also don't have high hopes for Horvat just the simple fact before last year with Van. He was a 50pt player his entire career.

Mind you, I want to be 1000% wrong on everything I have said so far. I want Lou and you to throw it in my face....wouldn't care if that means our Isles are winning again. So Lou, Please prove me wrong and everyone hear can throw it back and me and I will happily take it

Panarin was the following off season and no doubt Lou made a run for him and didn’t land him.

Lou did not go after Gaudreau as JG mentioned they never were part of the contract pursuit.

The only way has been able to land players is via trade. Cap has played part but also Isles still got that stank on them