Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2023-24: Hotel California

[Throttle]

3 weeks and counting on an opportunity for an easy rebuild, before Sorokin and Barzal have NMC/NTCs that kick in on July 1st. Trade both of them. Trade Dobson and Romanov - they both have zero trade protection. Trade Nelson and Palmieri (only 16 team NTCs). Trade all 6 of those guys and you get significant assets back. And you have a bad team. Then Horvat, Pelech and Pulock would likely waive their NTCs rather than play on a bottom feeder. At that point you have to fill out a roster and meet the cap floor, so it becomes a positive that you have guys like Lee, JGP, Mayfield, etc..

I wouldn't do this, but is this scenario impossible? Am I missing something?

Trade Barzal for Brady Tkachuk. That’s the move to reposition and move forward.

 

[Mr Misunderstood]

I don't care what it means. Resigning any 30+ year old to a 7-8 year deal as they are leaving their prime is a dumb GM move...And that's what Lou is probably going to do with at least 2 of those 3.

One of these years this aging team is just going to fall off a cliff and be a top lottery team...And probably not even have their 1st rounder because Lou only GMs one way - Go all in all the time regardless of circumstance.

Completely agree, although there are some players who can continue to be effective out into their mid/late thirties more than others which should be blatant by playstyle and how they are effective.

We ALL knew the Lee deal was bad when it was signed. He has never been fleet of foot, doesn't possess a great wrister, slapper or one timer, has had a significant knee injury and has a body frame that is non conducive to a long career in this era of the NHL.
Then guys like - Cizikas, Martin, Clutter, Pageau, who play heavier minutes/PK just aren't going to hold up physically over the long haul (I'd even throw Horvat in this group, I get scared of his wear & tear).

Nelson is one that I actually could see as being effective in the NHL at 36 years old. I'm not advocating for Lou to re-sign him to the 6 year deal, but he would be the type that wouldn't be the Danforth Anchor that someone like Lee appears to be.

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

Ok, so just think about this for a second. Isles trade Anders Lee to LA for Andre Lee.

Isles get younger, faster and all the things everyone always says, plus they gain 100% more Andre.

 

[periferal]

Completely agree, although there are some players who can continue to be effective out into their mid/late thirties more than others which should be blatant by playstyle and how they are effective.

We ALL knew the Lee deal was bad when it was signed. He has never been fleet of foot, doesn't possess a great wrister, slapper or one timer, has had a significant knee injury and has a body frame that is non conducive to a long career in this era of the NHL.
Then guys like - Cizikas, Martin, Clutter, Pageau, who play heavier minutes/PK just aren't going to hold up physically over the long haul (I'd even throw Horvat in this group, I get scared of his wear & tear).

Nelson is one that I actually could see as being effective in the NHL at 36 years old. I'm not advocating for Lou to re-sign him to the 6 year deal, but he would be the type that wouldn't be the Danforth Anchor that someone like Lee appears to be.

But at some point you have to shift resources on your team to get younger - Especially when you have ZERO farm system. Trading Nelson, as much as I like him, is a deal that will get you a lot back in a deal because he's a superb #2 center for almost any team in need - And there will be a bunch if he hit the block.

But again this is Lou and he runs the team like he wants everyone to die an Islander - Including himself.

 

[MJF]

We ALL knew the Lee deal was bad when it was signed. He has never been fleet of foot, doesn't possess a great wrister, slapper or one timer, has had a significant knee injury and has a body frame that is non conducive to a long career in this era of the NHL.

Delete

 

[MJF]

Completely agree, although there are some players who can continue to be effective out into their mid/late thirties more than others which should be blatant by playstyle and how they are effective.

We ALL knew the Lee deal was bad when it was signed. He has never been fleet of foot, doesn't possess a great wrister, slapper or one timer, has had a significant knee injury and has a body frame that is non conducive to a long career in this era of the NHL.
Then guys like - Cizikas, Martin, Clutter, Pageau, who play heavier minutes/PK just aren't going to hold up physically over the long haul (I'd even throw Horvat in this group, I get scared of his wear & tear).

Nelson is one that I actually could see as being effective in the NHL at 36 years old. I'm not advocating for Lou to re-sign him to the 6 year deal, but he would be the type that wouldn't be the Danforth Anchor that someone like Lee appears to be.

The problem is Lou followed up Lee with 6 more bad contracts, 4 of which are immovable without sweeteners, imho.

As for Brock Nelson, if he’s willing to resign a 3 year, or a team friendly 4 year, contract I’d bring him back. I just have my doubts he’d be willing to accept a short term deal.

 

[MarsTBOW]

Trade Barzal for Brady Tkachuk. That’s the move to reposition and move forward.

This would be the move if they wanted to change everything overnight

 

[Throttle]

This would be the move if they wanted to change everything overnight

It’s THE Florida move of moving on from a perimeter player to a player with jam. Both are signed and young, except Barzal is signed for 7 years, which OTT cost certainty on the cap/salary. OTT moves on now before Brady asks out (and he will) and are working from negative position just CAL did. His NMC kicks in next summer, he’ll ask out before that, so he can lock in his last three years on a team favorable to him.

 

[leeroggy]

Ok, so just think about this for a second. Isles trade Anders Lee to LA for Andre Lee.

Isles get younger, faster and all the things everyone always says, plus they gain 100% more Andre.

You left out the savings on embroidering new uniform tags

 

[doublechili]

Sounds exciting, can’t wait to have a Sabres like future of no playoffs for a decade.

Scortched earth rebuild makes no sense for this team. A retool, sure I could see the argument, and may even be for it. A complete rebuild is extremely foolish.

Yes, you're missing your IQ . . . check Al Gore's Lock Box, it might be there . . .

Just to be clear, I wasn't advocating that the team do a tear down rebuild (and said so). There seems to be a perception that somehow a tear down rebuild is impossible. I was just pointing out that it could be pretty easily accomplished in the next few weeks.

 

[Throttle]

Completely agree, although there are some players who can continue to be effective out into their mid/late thirties more than others which should be blatant by playstyle and how they are effective.

We ALL knew the Lee deal was bad when it was signed. He has never been fleet of foot, doesn't possess a great wrister, slapper or one timer, has had a significant knee injury and has a body frame that is non conducive to a long career in this era of the NHL.
Then guys like - Cizikas, Martin, Clutter, Pageau, who play heavier minutes/PK just aren't going to hold up physically over the long haul (I'd even throw Horvat in this group, I get scared of his wear & tear).

Nelson is one that I actually could see as being effective in the NHL at 36 years old. I'm not advocating for Lou to re-sign him to the 6 year deal, but he would be the type that wouldn't be the Danforth Anchor that someone like Lee appears to be.

Considering Lee can’t skate and is slow, he still nets 20+ a season. He WOULD net more if the Isles PP wasn’t the perimeter ‘I’m afraid of the net’ strategy it has turned into.

Considering Lee’s faults, one would think he would be -30, but he’s not and he’s not sheltered to offset that either. His not used effectively as the team has redesigned how it wants to run the PP (and the game generally).

But, we know, Lee isn’t exciting, so he’s get the rented mule treatment.

 

[Mr Misunderstood]

Considering Lee can’t skate and is slow, he still nets 20+ a season. He WOULD net more if the Isles PP wasn’t the perimeter ‘I’m afraid of the net’ strategy it has turned into.

Considering Lee’s faults, one would think he would be -30, but he’s not and he’s not sheltered to offset that either. His not used effectively as the team has redesigned how it wants to run the PP (and the game generally).

But, we know, Lee isn’t exciting, so he’s get the rented mule treatment.

Unfortunately, Lee is the example of signing an over 30yo power forward to a long contract. I could've used Ladd, Okposo, Lucic but Anders is OUR current example.

I love the guy and completely agree with you that he would be more effective with a better PP, or one that is more suited to his abilities.

My post was not targeted to discount Lee's game, it is more around the long term UFA signing of an older player considering their playstyle.

 

[denis5]

But at some point you have to shift resources on your team to get younger - Especially when you have ZERO farm system. Trading Nelson, as much as I like him, is a deal that will get you a lot back in a deal because he's a superb #2 center for almost any team in need - And there will be a bunch if he hit the block.

But again this is Lou and he runs the team like he wants everyone to die an Islander - Including himself.

Josh Bailey says hello. Andrew Ladd, too. If Lou wants/needs a player gone, he'll pay the price to make it happen. With that in mind, it's a near certainty that at least one of the 4 vets with contracts that expire over the next two seasons get moved now, prior to free agency, and probably at the draft. We got that extra pick for a reason, and it's not to make a selection.

Nelson, on the other hand, could probably be moved without a sweetener. But unlike some (many?) Islander fans, I saw some clear signs of decline in his play this year and his days as a center are probably numbered (we did try him on wing ourselves this year, to awful results, unfortunately). I expect that pro scouts noted the same, so the return won't be very high if Lou does decide to move him. That's okay, as right now, I think his cap space is more valuable than he is. Ditto for Palms by the way, who is very unlikely to repeat what he did this season. As the old saw goes, it's better to move a player a year too early than a year too late, and if (yeah, I know, big if) we are going to do anything significant this off season, getting more cap space is a must.

 

[periferal]

Josh Bailey says hello. Andrew Ladd, too. If Lou wants/needs a player gone, he'll pay the price to make it happen. With that in mind, it's a near certainty that at least one of the 4 vets with contracts that expire over the next two seasons get moved now, prior to free agency, and probably at the draft. We got that extra pick for a reason, and it's not to make a selection.

Again...Lou only trades vets when he is FORCED to because of cap reasons. If there was no cap Bailey and Ladd would not have been traded.

Nelson, on the other hand, could probably be moved without a sweetener. But unlike some (many?) Islander fans, I saw some clear signs of decline in his play this year and his days as a center are probably numbered (we did try him on wing ourselves this year, to awful results, unfortunately). I expect that pro scouts noted the same, so the return won't be very high if Lou does decide to move him. That's okay, as right now, I think his cap space is more valuable than he is. Ditto for Palms by the way, who is very unlikely to repeat what he did this season. As the old saw goes, it's better to move a player a year too early than a year too late, and if (yeah, I know, big if) we are going to do anything significant this off season, getting more cap space is a must.

Agree that Nelson dipped a bit last year. That along should be the reason to trade him before other teams figure out he's in decline...Much less resign him to a 5+ year deal when the end of that deal will be another disaster.

But again...Wanna bet Lou doesn't trade Nelson before the 2025 trade deadline? I'd be more than thrilled to take that L, but more than confident I wouldn't.

 

[Throttle]

Ladd went on a podcast after he retired and explained his Isles story after Lou came onboard - it’s very Robidas island-like. He was being diplomatic, but he was clear that the org really didn’t want him anymore.

So, Lou was already looking to move on from Ladd before he was ‘forced to.’

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

You left out the savings on embroidering new uniform tags

It was implied, bozo!

 

[leeroggy]

It was implied, bozo!

admit it, you MISSED THAT

 

[denis5]

Again...Lou only trades vets when he is FORCED to because of cap reasons. If there was no cap Bailey and Ladd would not have been traded.

And if he intends to do anything this offseason, cap reasons are again the reason why players would be moved.

 

[periferal]

And if he intends to do anything this offseason, cap reasons are again the reason why players would be moved.

Not at all the point you first replied to. Of course any GM can move out a contract. The point is that Lou only moves vets when he's forced to. Otherwise he hands out long-term deals to any player up for free agency so that they can "die an Islander" (unless the cap mandates otherwise - Which is usually does given how Lou works with the cap).

 

[doublechili]

Again...Lou only trades vets when he is FORCED to because of cap reasons. If there was no cap Bailey and Ladd would not have been traded.

Bailey and Ladd were done as Islanders. Salary cap or no salary cap, they weren't playing any more games in the jersey. The team paid a price to make them go away to free up cap space. If there were no salary cap they still wouldn't have played - they'd have sat at home collecting their paychecks (assuming the owners were willing to pay them).

They're really not analogous to any player on the team heading into this offseason.

 

[seafoam]

Josh Bailey says hello. Andrew Ladd, too. If Lou wants/needs a player gone, he'll pay the price to make it happen. With that in mind, it's a near certainty that at least one of the 4 vets with contracts that expire over the next two seasons get moved now, prior to free agency, and probably at the draft. We got that extra pick for a reason, and it's not to make a selection.

Nelson, on the other hand, could probably be moved without a sweetener. But unlike some (many?) Islander fans, I saw some clear signs of decline in his play this year and his days as a center are probably numbered (we did try him on wing ourselves this year, to awful results, unfortunately). I expect that pro scouts noted the same, so the return won't be very high if Lou does decide to move him. That's okay, as right now, I think his cap space is more valuable than he is. Ditto for Palms by the way, who is very unlikely to repeat what he did this season. As the old saw goes, it's better to move a player a year too early than a year too late, and if (yeah, I know, big if) we are going to do anything significant this off season, getting more cap space is a must.

Komarov too? Lou boxed him out and he waved the white flag so he could go play in Europe. Obviously with Ladd being from NA and making a considerable more amount of coin, he was going to force Lou to trade him to make him go away (which is exactly what happened).

 

[Throttle]

Komarov too? Lou boxed him out and he waved the white flag so he could go play in Europe. Obviously with Ladd being from NA and making a considerable more amount of coin, he was going to force Lou to trade him to make him go away (which is exactly what happened).

Funny thing on the way to unleashed…this team hasn’t moved the needle since Komarov moved on…

 

[Lek]

Funny thing on the way to unleashed…this team hasn’t moved the needle since Komarov moved on…

I liked Leo

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

admit it, you MISSED THAT

IT WAS THE WHOLE POINT.

 

[SI90]

Unpopular opinion maybe but I’d trade both Brock and Palmieri this summer. Last years of their deals and they’re both mid 30’s. Team needs to get younger and more skilled. Brock would be really attractive to a lot of teams looking for 30 goal 2way reliable center.
Palmieri is a 25+ goal gritty winger. Those are 2 guys I don’t see use signing long term that could help us get back some assets and open up cap space.