Roster Building XX: How Many Patents Does Your GM Have?

[Lempo]

It doesn’t exist anymore but it still happens. Instead of talking officially, agents and teams talk in hypotheticals now.

Yes. The point I was vaguely trying to make in my previous post is that it kind of feels that the official pretended prohibition of pre Free Agency negotiations seems to be there mostly for shutting up the insiders and to stop them stealing the wind from the NHL Free Agency Frenzy July 1 programming, by setting the table up so that if a reporter was too accurate in reporting the upcoming contracts prior noon July 1, that said reporter would at the same time then also be publicly accusing the team and the player of tampering, thusly putting the reporter and the team in a collision course and making it more difficult for the reporter to do their job in the future.

Damned show business.

 

[spockBokk]

Some rehashing of yesterday’s news, but 2 tidbits:



Seravalli says that the Canes and Chatfield were talking about a 3yr deal at $2.75-3M a few months ago, not sure why that didn’t get done then

Pesce going to ufa is a foregone conclusion

Also teases Necas to Columbus, jokingly

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

Some rehashing of yesterday’s news, but 2 tidbits:



Seravalli says that the Canes and Chatfield were talking about a 3yr deal at $2.75-3M a few months ago, not sure why that didn’t get done then

Pesce going to ufa is a foregone conclusion

Also teases Necas to Columbus, jokingly

So the Canes want to keep Chatfield. Interesting.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

we probably were in that path until we say him in the playoffs and saw he couldnt handle 2RD duties.

 

[Borsig]

At this point I dont think guentz stays

 

[Blueline Bomber]

I'd have loved Chatfield for 3 years at 2.75

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Some rehashing of yesterday’s news, but 2 tidbits:

Seravalli says that the Canes and Chatfield were talking about a 3yr deal at $2.75-3M a few months ago, not sure why that didn’t get done then

Pesce going to ufa is a foregone conclusion

Also teases Necas to Columbus, jokingly

I suspect all of our UFAs go test the market when free agency opens. With the cap going up, they'd be foolish not to and as I said in the Guentzel post, I don't see Carolina offering them as much as they could get there.

 

[FlyingSquirrels]

At this point I dont think guentz stays

Nope. He gone.
Whole lotta cap space we are going to have. Not that will help replace Guentzel but it does open other avenues.

 

[To Be Determined]

we probably were in that path until we say him in the playoffs and saw he couldnt handle 2RD duties.

i don't remember him being some big negative against the islanders. and if we only judge his ability as a 2RD against the president's trophy winners, that's a pretty harsh baseline to use. I think he'd be fine as 2RD next season.

but i'm already on the record wanting us to put orlov on slavin's (edit - on slavin's right derp) left, and have chatfield-burns as our third pair next year.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

I suspect all of our UFAs go test the market when free agency opens. With the cap going up, they'd be foolish not to and as I said in the Guentzel post, I don't see Carolina offering them as much as they could get there.

The cap also means that Carolina can spend more, too. I don't know how or where they plan to allocate the funds, but I don't personally see all of our UFAs leaving, especially with the Necas questions. We're in the middle of a contention period, and I'm sure that they don't want to turn into what Winnipeg did in that one year where almost all of their defense left at one time and they were playing the likes of Derek Forbort in the top-4.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

i don't remember him being some big negative against the islanders. and if we only judge his ability as a 2RD against the president's trophy winners, that's a pretty harsh baseline to use. I think he'd be fine as 2RD next season.

but i'm already on the record wanting us to put orlov on slavin's left, and have chatfield-burns as our third pair next year.

chatfield didnt handle the Isles well either. His xGA was above 4. Him and Skjei shared the worst GF/GA ratio of 2-4 after Pesce went down.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

The cap also means that Carolina can spend more, too.

Carolina could always spend more, they chose not to. They've said multiple times they don't want to give long term high dollar deals to guys the age of Skjei, Pesce, Guentzel etc. They've said multiple times they place different values on players vs. the rest of the league. That's what I'm referring to.

I don't know how or where they plan to allocate the funds, but I don't personally see all of our UFAs leaving,

I didn't say they were "leaving". I said they'd go test the market. One or more of them could still end up signing with Carolina after that.

 

[ElmCityGuy]

Nope. He gone.
Whole lotta cap space we are going to have. Not that will help replace Guentzel but it does open other avenues.

Yep.... Canes are looking at Svech.. Aho.. Jarvis top line.

Canes need to sign a compete 2nd line with Necas and Turbo leaving.

 

[TheBigLetowski]

If Necas AND Guentzel are both gone, this BORG have some serious work to do. I'm nervously optimistic.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

Carolina could always spend more, they chose not to. They've said multiple times they don't want to give long term high dollar deals to guys the age of Skjei, Pesce, Guentzel etc. They've said multiple times they place different values on players vs. the rest of the league. That's what I'm referring to.

I didn't say they were "leaving". I said they'd go test the market. One or more of them could still end up signing with Carolina after that.

They do spend to the cap. They are not the Karmanos-era internal budget Canes. The question that I'm asking is who they are planning to spend it on. I don't think, for example, that you let Guentzel get paid elsewhere without either extending Necas long-term or trading him for a fellow forward that is also a long-term piece, i.e. Kyrou.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

They do spend to the cap. They are not the Karmanos-era internal budget Canes. The question that I'm asking is who they are planning to spend it on. I don't think, for example, that you let Guentzel get paid elsewhere without either extending Necas long-term or trading him for a fellow forward that is also a long-term piece, i.e. Kyrou.

I'm really not sure what you are getting at.

Do they spend to the cap? Yes
Do they avoid giving long term / high dollar deals to guys the age of Skjei/Guentzel: Yes
Do they openly state they have a different valuation (ie...lower) than others? Yes

Unless/until I see them deviate from that mode of operation, I will remain skeptical that guys like Guentzel, Skjei or Pesce be re-signed unless they find their value isn't what they thought it was after testing the market (or they take a discount to stay on a winning team, which doesn't happen often), regardless of what happens to Necas.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

I'm really not sure what you are getting at.

Do they spend to the cap? Yes
Do they avoid giving long term / high dollar deals to guys the age of Skjei/Guentzel: Yes
Do they openly state they have a different valuation (ie...lower) than others? Yes

Unless/until I see them deviate from that mode of operation, I will remain skeptical that guys like Guentzel, Skjei or Pesce be re-signed unless they find their value isn't what they thought it was after testing the market (or they take a discount to stay on a winning team, which doesn't happen often), regardless of what happens to Necas.

They have proven that they can do high-dollar/short-term (Orlov) or low-dollar/long-term (Staal). I've also long suspected that they treat core players differently than non-core players, which is why you're seeing rumors today that Slavin is going to be extended almost immediately after July 1st. Guentzel/Skjei/Pesce are interesting in that many front offices could consider them core players but it's more debatable with our group. Especially in the case of Guentzel, I have a hard time picturing a guy who's genuinely a PPG player as non-core quality unless you are confident that the Necas rumors are noise and that you have an extension ready to go.

 

[Svechhammer]

Nope. He gone.
Whole lotta cap space we are going to have. Not that will help replace Guentzel but it does open other avenues.

And we'll use it by doubling down on defense and completely ignoring anything on offense.

And come the end of the year next year we'll be wondering why our scoring let us down again in the playoffs. Wash, rinse, repeat

 

[Lempo]

And we'll use it by doubling down on defense and completely ignoring anything on offense.

Just bring on the 3-2-1 already!

 

[Blueline Bomber]

If we lose Guentzel, we paid WAY too much for him at the deadline.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

If we lose Guentzel, we paid WAY too much for him at the deadline.

we paid too much without a contract anyways.

 

[ElmCityGuy]

If Necas AND Guentzel are both gone, this BORG have some serious work to do. I'm nervously optimistic.

Well the Canes were in need a 2C and a top 6 winger at the end of the season. With no Jake then make it 2 top 6 wingers.

Add in the defensemen free agents then it's an interesting situation at the moment.

 

[Chan790]

If we lose Guentzel, we paid WAY too much for him at the deadline.

Nothing we couldn't afford to lose.
*A good pick.
*An expensive FA signing that didn't fit.
*Our most NHL-ready spec, who played a position of our deepest strength and who we were definitely moving in *a* trade if not this trade.
*Two boom-or-bust specs with warts in their games that we probably sold high on.
*A conditional pick whose conditions weren't met.

 

[Daeavorn]

I think there's a chance we don't keep Necas or Jake.

This was a really bad time for Don to leave.

 

[CandyCanes]

If Necas AND Guentzel are both gone, this BORG have some serious work to do. I'm nervously optimistic.

Don’t forget your 2nd pairing is also likely gone