Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XXIII

[kinger8998]

FWIW, playing Ryan Lindgren with Shatty instead of Smith is tanking the value of both vets.

Though I guess Shatty gets an opportunity to prove he can defend in his own end because Lindgren makes sure that is where they are going to spend all their TOI.

i mean he is a 20-year old that has only played 2 career NHL games. and not a 5th overall pick 20-year old, hes a player that wasnt expected to be ready for another 2 years. but yeah, lets trash a guy who should turn out to be a pretty solid player for us when we contending because HE’S the biggest issue we have. yup, makes sense

 

[UAGoalieGuy]

FWIW, playing Ryan Lindgren with Shatty instead of Smith is tanking the value of both vets.

Though I guess Shatty gets an opportunity to prove he can defend in his own end because Lindgren makes sure that is where they are going to spend all their TOI.

Is this a serious comment? The kid is 20 and played a total of 2 NHL games.

He has the ability to move the puck. With his defensive abilities that would free Shattenkirk up to take a few more chances in the offensive zone.

 

[Blue Blooded]

i mean he is a 20-year old that has only played 2 career NHL games. and not a 5th overall pick 20-year old, hes a player that wasnt expected to be ready for another 2 years. but yeah, lets trash a guy who should turn out to be a pretty solid player for us when we contending because HE’S the biggest issue we have. yup, makes sense

Is this a serious comment? The kid is 20 and played a total of 2 NHL games.

He has the ability to move the puck. With his defensive abilities that would free Shattenkirk up to take a few more chances in the offensive zone.

I'm not writing him off as a prospect. I was merely commenting that if we are looking to raise the trade value of our vets, which seemed to be the topic of conversation, the results so far seem to indicate that playing Lindgren hurts us in two ways.

1. It obviously hurts whatever trade value Smith might have.

2. Looking at the results of the first two games it will hurt Shattenkirk's value, even compared to having Smith as his partner, since the Rangers have been continuously hemmed in their own end whenver Lindgren has been on the ice so far.

 

[UAGoalieGuy]

I'm not writing him off as a prospect. I was merely commenting that if we are looking to raise the trade value of our vets, which seemed to be the topic of conversation, the results so far seem to indicate that playing Lindgren hurts us in two ways.

1. It obviously hurts whatever trade value Smith might have.

2. Looking at the results of the first two games it will hurt Shattenkirk's value, even compared to having Smith as his partner, since the Rangers have been continuously hemmed in their own end whenver Lindgren has been on the ice so far.

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It's his first 2 NHL games! If this was over 15-20 games ok you cant use these numbers with such a small sample size. Especially when it's his first NHL games.

 

[Blue Blooded]

It's his first 2 NHL games! If this was over 15-20 games ok you cant use these numbers with such a small sample size. Especially when it's his first NHL games.

All I've been saying is that what we are doing right now is hurting Shattenkirk's trade value (and Smith's, but that's a lot less important).

But OK, let's say two games isn't enough. How many games do you give a player who's on-ice results indicate he is far from ready? Three, five, 15, 20? 20 games is a quarter of a season.

In my book Lindgren hadn't done enough to earn the callup in the first place, I would've picked Bigras or maybe Gilmour, so in my book two games are enough (one to worry me, one to confirm). If I agreed with the callup I could maybe stretch it to 3-5 games tops, depending on the outcome. But I would under no circumstance accept sub-30 CF% play for more than three games from any player, if that.

 

[kinger8998]

All I've been saying is that what we are doing right now is hurting Shattenkirk's trade value (and Smith's, but that's a lot less important).

But OK, let's say two games isn't enough. How many games do you give a player who's on-ice results indicate he is far from ready? Three, five, 15, 20? 20 games is a quarter of a season.

In my book Lindgren hadn't done enough to earn the callup in the first place, I would've picked Bigras or maybe Gilmour, so in my book two games are enough (one to worry me, one to confirm). If I agreed with the callup I could maybe stretch it to 3-5 games tops, depending on the outcome. But I would under no circumstance accept sub-30 CF% play for more than three games from any player, if that.

smith is untradeable imo, unless were taking a contract similar to his back, or pairing him with a 1st round pick to get rid of him. we dont really need his cap space - yet - so i dont see the need to get rid of him.

as for shattenkirk, if were really trying to get a good return, they’ll wait until next deadline. he had an injury this year, and the numbers just arent there for him so far, even if he has looked much better lately. i dont really see the need to trade shattenkirk, having him and ADA as PP defensemen give us a pretty good 1-2 punch for defense on the man advantage

 

[haohmaru]

Evaluating or charting a guy after his first two NHL games is kind of nuts. Smith is worthless and Shattenkirk's value is probably at all time low. I doubt the Rangers give a hoot about who he's paired with. They'd be foolish to trade him at this point because his value is in the crapper. Not one of the guys I see the Rangers dealing.

 

[Kovalev27]

I tend to agree. I don’t see why this kid was called up. Not even close to ready. Not a knock on him he’s 20 but he shouldn’t be here. Like I’ve said it’s more a knock on Libor Hajek if you ask me. If Lindgren is more ready that’s extremely disappointing

 

[haohmaru]

I tend to agree. I don’t see why this kid was called up. Not even close to ready. Not a knock on him he’s 20 but he shouldn’t be here. Like I’ve said it’s more a knock on Libor Hajek if you ask me. If Lindgren is more ready that’s extremely disappointing

Doesn't say much for Smith that Pionk and Claesson are out injured and the Rangers would rather give Lindgren a look than put him in the lineup. Matter of time before he's back with the 'Pack.

 

[LORDE]

Again with this crap.

Gorts has stated all along that they will do what is best for the development of players. Lindgren was called up over others. Why? Quinn said they've liked his game and have been wanting him up for a while now. But the posters here know better right?

He's getting a taste of the NHL. I'm sure he'll been set back down and someone else may come up. But that will depend on THAT players development. Not based on HFNYR posters.

I don't get the gripe.

We aren't good. We want a good draft pick.

WHO CARES WHAT HIS CF CORGIS ARE?????

 

[Kovalev27]

Doesn't say much for Smith that Pionk and Claesson are out injured and the Rangers would rather give Lindgren a look than put him in the lineup. Matter of time before he's back with the 'Pack.

He’s done. Huge disaster of a signing. It’s very odd he’s not slow he skates well much better than last year. he just can’t make a play can’t defend anymore just doesn’t get it. Really weird.

 

[RangerBoy]

Brendan Smith is garbage. He sucks. The Rangers have two more years left on that contract. Stick him in the AHL for the next two seasons. Trade him for another abysmal contract. Buy him out. He is awful. The Rangers aren't getting out of the contract scot-free.

Gorton traded a 2nd and a 3rd for Smith. That 2nd came from Ottawa in the Zibanejad trade. Jonatan Berggren was the 2nd. Smith was the 2nd best rental D behind Shattenkirk that year. The Red Wings thought about re-signing Smith but they traded him when Gorton made them that offer. I can see why.

The rental D market stinks this year. Gorton should be able to get more than he gave up for McQuaid. A 4th & 7th. That has to be the only reason why Gorton even acquired McQuaid in the first place. Looking at the rental D list & saying we can get more in February.

 

[Winston2018]

There are a lot of advantages to trying to make a deal for Hayes and Zuke during the break. First and foremost an injury. How about putting some good old fashioned pressure on the prospective suitors. "Hey Oilers the Canes are offering so and so...I need your best offer by Wednesday etc....There is some bluffing that needs to happen to force some movement.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

There are a lot of advantages to trying to make a deal for Hayes and Zuke during the break. First and foremost an injury. How about putting some good old fashioned pressure on the prospective suitors. "Hey Oilers the Canes are offering so and so...I need your best offer by Wednesday etc....There is some bluffing that needs to happen to force some movement.

And what makes you think that isn't happening already?

I am quite sure negotiations are already ongoing

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

Did Smith have a good first ten games or so this year, or was I played by Sam and Joe talking about how he’s not fat anymore?

 

[Trxjw]

For a guy who was supposed to definitely be a #1 defensemen before we signed him, Shattenkirk has an awful lot of excuses made for him.

 

[sjosty26]

Rongos have two scouts at the Avs/Kings game today, FWIW

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Rongos have two scouts at the Avs/Kings game today, FWIW

Hayes for Girard obviously

 

[Avery16]

FWIW, playing Ryan Lindgren with Shatty instead of Smith is tanking the value of both vets.

Though I guess Shatty gets an opportunity to prove he can defend in his own end because Lindgren makes sure that is where they are going to spend all their TOI.

Smith doesn’t need anyone’s help in tanking his value. He’s got a good handle on that all by himself.

 

[kinger8998]

not a

For a guy who was supposed to definitely be a #1 defensemen before we signed him, Shattenkirk has an awful lot of excuses made for him.

just not true at all, he was supposed to be the #2 on en elite pairing with mcdonagh, but hes really better suited on the second pair away from top competition.

the difference is in st louis he could be “the guy” on that second pair, but in NY whether its the injuries or decline or a combination, im not sure he can carry the majority of the load. we shall see nect year after a full summer of rest and hopefully him avoiding injury near start of season if he can return to form we signed him in or if he needs just as good as defenseman with him

 

[kinger8998]

i really dont know what happened to smith. one of the weirdest things ive ever seen. last year he was out of shape, this year hes skating like hes back in shape, but its almost like hes forgot how to pass the puck and defend. really dont get it. could it be a really severe confidence issue?

either way, were not getting rid of him unless its through buy out or trade for another bad deal. id rather keep him as spare D than have a kid called up to sit out. also dont care for him being sent down cause that takes playing time away from the prospects.

besides, we wont really need his cap space until after his deal is over, and if we need it before, just buy him out. id personally ride out the contract

 

[BobMarleyNYR]

smith is untradeable imo, unless were taking a contract similar to his back, or pairing him with a 1st round pick to get rid of him. we dont really need his cap space - yet - so i dont see the need to get rid of him.

as for shattenkirk, if were really trying to get a good return, they’ll wait until next deadline. he had an injury this year, and the numbers just arent there for him so far, even if he has looked much better lately. i dont really see the need to trade shattenkirk, having him and ADA as PP defensemen give us a pretty good 1-2 punch for defense on the man advantage

It really doesn't. DeAngelo rarely produces and I think Shattenkirk might be done.

 

[LeetchisGod]

For a guy who was supposed to definitely be a #1 defensemen before we signed him, Shattenkirk has an awful lot of excuses made for him.

Anyone who thought Shattenkirk was a #1 defenseman has never seen him play.

 

[kinger8998]

It really doesn't. DeAngelo rarely produces and I think Shattenkirk might be done.

i dont think shattenkirk is done, but no one truly knows if he is or not so cant really argue about it

deangelo also plays with strome, namestnikov and vesey on the PP so i think i can pinpoint why hes not producing...

next year with kravtsov, another year of progression from chytil, and possibly a panarin signing we could potentially ice 2 capable PP units made up of some combination of:

kreider, buch, zibanejad, panarin, chytil, kravtsov, ____, ____, deangelo, shattenkirk

blanks could be free agent signings or i guess you could fill with vesey (will play net front) or namestnikov (very good at zone entries)

again all hinges on panarin signing, if he doesnt it goes back to looking pretty rough

 

[BobMarleyNYR]

Yeah, I don't want Panarin anymore... at some point, the DeAngelo excuses won't hold water... probably not until he's 30, but they won't.