Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XXI

[Mikos87]

Even as recently as 6 months ago, I would have gone after Puju. But @Mac n Gs is right. The guy has a really low hockey IQ. Doesn't think the game well at all.

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

Even as recently as 6 months ago, I would have gone after Puju. But @Mac n Gs is right. The guy has a really low hockey IQ. Doesn't think the game well at all.

And that’s a criticism that goes back to his draft year and even before it

 

[EdJovanovski]

TThe defense is even worse. Gilmour is a better option than DeAngelo at this stage, shattenkirk/smith aren't disappearing... looks like Hajek probably sucks right now.

How has DeAngelo been bad this season? He’s been our best defenseman imo lol

 

[Mikos87]

And that’s a criticism that goes back to his draft year and even before it

And the bet is that he could put it together with experience since the tools are in the upper echelon.

He's shown zero signs of it unfortunately.

 

[EdJovanovski]

Puljujarvi reminds me a bit of Zibanejad in his D+3 with the Sens. It was his first full NHL season, and there were still questions about his worth ethic and mental effort during the games. As talented as Puljujarvi is, he’s shown that he doesn’t have the hockey IQ to keep up at the NHL level.

Do I think he can break it? Maybe, but it’ll be tough when he’s in such a bad development environment like Edmonton. I’d be more than happy to take a flyer, but we’d need a much more significant piece in return for Kreider.

I’m done with players with low hockey IQs. It’s been three straight years of players out of position, terrible structure, and an overall lack of execution at basic hockey plays like breakouts, forechecking, and shot selection.

Zibby is a smart two-way player, and I think he was always regarded that way. Puljujarvi is a bonehead who has Ranger written all over him, really hope we don’t go after him.

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

And the bet is that he could put it together with experience since the tools are in the upper echelon.

He's shown zero signs of it unfortunately.

Yeah, I don’t really see him putting it all together. I’d take a flier on him for the price of a guy like Vesey, but I’d rather keep Fast or trade Zuccarello for something else if he’s the main piece coming back

 

[Mikos87]

Yeah, I don’t really see him putting it all together. I’d take a flier on him for the price of a guy like Vesey, but I’d rather keep Fast or trade Zuccarello for something else if he’s the main piece coming back

I'd still trade all 3 for Puju. I wouldn't trade a top six player for him. I think that there are issues with Vesey where it would be a good deal for the Rangers to make, and EDM gets a vetter player.

 

[bobbop]

I'm late to the party but I have to say somethings... I love Rick Nash as a person and as a hockey player, but I always will carry a grudge against him for what he didn't do in the playoffs for us.
@bobbop , you're always saying that you're against a rebuilding because of your age, you have to admit that we're not winning the stanley cup and the next years and the best chance that we have to contend soon is that we get a top 4 pick in this draft and the next one.
I still have faith in our management, the only pick that is debatable is Andersson and to be truthfull, I don't see a player picked after him that have showed a lot more of potential than him, maybe Brannstrom.
And finally, the only player that I'm completely against trading is Zibanejad, his age, his contract and his play so far has been the thing we neeed for the future.

I am not against rebuilding. I am against a prolonged scorch the earth rebuild.

What I like about this season is that the Rangers are competing, playing hard most of the time and giving young players a lot of valuable experience. I also acknowledge that at least one and perhaps two of the big three are headed out of town at the trade deadline.

I’d love a top 1-2 draft pick. I’m just not into taking gas to get there. Four years ago, I watched Don Maloney tear the Coyotes down to get a shot at Connor McDavid. The hockey was unwatchable. The players didn’t care, the coaches mailed it in and the building was a tomb. Yeah, I know attendance in Arizona has always struggled but I lived through the great runs the team had in 2009-10 and 2012 and watched them fill the building. It was the 2004 Rangers on steroids. I spent four years in minor league hockey and my teams in Syracuse and San Diego could have probably beat the Coyotes. And what did Arizona get for all their troubles? Dylan f***in Strome. Buffalo out-tanked the Coyotes by one point and the (then much more favorable than today) lottery dropped the Coyotes from second to third. Well played, Don.

For every Pittsburgh Penguins, there’s a New York Islanders. For every Chicago Blackhawks, there’s an Arizona Coyotes. And on and on. There are different ways to build a team. I don’t see Vegas waiting to win the lottery.

The Rangers were smart to kick start their rebuild by moving veterans. While I will never be happy with the return for Stepan, they got good value for Nash and Grabner and the Tampa deal may still work out OK. In a few weeks there will be more deals to dissect. Hopefully we do well.

And hopefully we move out enough payroll to make some smart acquisitions in the off season. I want Panarin — you simply can not ignore elite offensive talent. He will be fine 5-6 years into a seven year contract and always moveable at that point. I’d also like to see 1-2 intelligent veteran signings (e.g. Anton Stralman) to stabilize the back end. If the Rangers move veterans at the deadline, they will need some maturity. If Gorton can put Panarin with Kravtsov and perhaps adds in a top pick this year, then you have something to talk about.

One last point. There are a lot more older season ticket holders out there then the younger wanna be GMs on this board. There are more empty seats at the Garden this year than there have been for years. There will be a lot more next year. You can always bring fans back but to quote an old dear friend, “seats at tonight’s game are a perishable asset.” At some point business will enter into the equation.

 

[Mikos87]

Interesting how the league has panned out the last few weeks. By my count, there's going to be 9 potential buyers in the east, and an arms race at the top.

Fewer buyers out west but more sellers.

Been in a non hockey market out east, and three more out west recently.

One is concerned with a culture change, another regrets their contacts, and two others are in limbo.

Of those, one is trying to sell. Price is very high for a marginal contributor, but a contender would want the guy.

Team in the East is trying to make a hockey deal. Advisors want to solve for multiple holes. Tough to make these types of deals mid season.

 

[Mikos87]

One of the teams I mentioned is going to fire somebody soon imo.

 

[TheGortonConspiracy]

Do you guys like Tyson Jost? How about Jost + Colorado's first rounder for Hayes? Would that be too much on Colorado's side? Jost is also billed as low hockey IQ though

 

[Machinehead]

Do you guys like Tyson Jost? How about Jost + Colorado's first rounder for Hayes? Would that be too much on Colorado's side? Jost is also billed as low hockey IQ though

The Avs fans don't seem to have any interest in moving Jost.

I sign up for that. Jost is good a prospect as Chytil/Andersson.

 

[aufheben]

I can absolutely envision Hayes in Calgary. Dube?

I could see it, aesthetically anyway lol.

Just the thought of Zucc in a Capitals jersey makes me retch.

This is pretty amazing.

Everything about this franchise just irritates me.

 

[mike14]

One of the teams I mentioned is going to fire somebody soon imo.

Ducks with Carlyle?

 

[Machinehead]

I could see it, aesthetically anyway lol.

Just the thought of Zucc in a Capitals jersey makes me retch.

I literally don't even want the return from them. I don't want them helping us.

 

[egelband]

And the bet is that he could put it together with experience since the tools are in the upper echelon.

He's shown zero signs of it unfortunately.

Even as recently as 6 months ago, I would have gone after Puju. But @Mac n Gs is right. The guy has a really low hockey IQ. Doesn't think the game well at all.

And that’s a criticism that goes back to his draft year and even before it

I used to be all-for bringing in guys like this. But I’m more of the opinion now that the mental part is just as key as the physical part, if not more. Zibanejad is a rare case of a mental late-bloomer. Usually it doesn’t happen that way. I’d generally rather bet on a guy developing physical skills later than mental. Nothing is set in stone, of course. And that’s where good scouting is key.

 

[Wind Waker]

I don’t see Vegas waiting to win the lottery.

To be fair, they can't exactly run a lottery-tier team without a large chunk of their fanbase losing interest.

 

[DutchShamrock]

Yeah, I don’t really see him putting it all together. I’d take a flier on him for the price of a guy like Vesey, but I’d rather keep Fast or trade Zuccarello for something else if he’s the main piece coming back

And the problem is Chiarelli doesn't have enough in the bank to absorb that hit. A JP trade for Vesey is possible with the next gm but that would be the final nail in the coffin for the current. Of course Chiarelli's problem is he has about 4 candidates for the "final nail" primed.

 

[DutchShamrock]

The culture change team is probably St. Louis. The Stastny trade and the alarming collapse that preceded it last season carried a bunch of rumors about a rift in the locker room. Now you have tarensenko and schenn trade rumors. Off season trades, but you probably get a new GM at that point to be positive before that big of a trade. That's "new direction" territory.

Limbo: Anaheim, Dallas, Minnesota? Maybe Dallas is the team that regrets contracts.

Carolina and Florida are non-traditional markets that expected more out of their team's on paper.

 

[NYR Viper]

The culture change team is probably St. Louis. The Stastny trade and the alarming collapse that preceded it last season carried a bunch of rumors about a rift in the locker room. Now you have tarensenko and schenn trade rumors. Off season trades, but you probably get a new GM at that point to be positive before that big of a trade. That's "new direction" territory.

Limbo: Anaheim, Dallas, Minnesota? Maybe Dallas is the team that regrets contracts.

Carolina and Florida are non-traditional markets that expected more out of their team's on paper.

I think the East is Carolina. The guy their shipping who is marginal but everyone wants is probably Ferland.

Dallas, STL and probably ANA

 

[haohmaru]

How has DeAngelo been bad this season? He’s been our best defenseman imo lol

If that were true he wouldn't be in the press box every game.

 

[Mikos87]

2.5 out of 4 boys, but very solid.

Team regretting the contracts- it's more about structure rather than anything else. EG: Insurance related issues, and signing bonuses.

Ferland is a good bet, but marginal player is a defenseman. Culture change team is one that's been wanting one for a long time. Lifetstyle for the players are very comfortable.

Still the biggest finding for me is how the season has unfolded. I was concerned that there wasn't going to be a strong buyers market for the Rangers who are rebuilding, but that's not going to be the case.

The earlier the trades start the better, in other words, on the week of the TDL, start early, move the market early so you aren't left out cold on some guys, but hold on to the higher value assets till there is a bidding war, or your price is met.

 

[RGY]

Who would you rather invest in, Tarasenko or Panarin? Both 27 years old. Tarasenko will cost assets. Panarin only money which we have a lot of.

I think the Ranges will add an elite scorer/sniper to play with and help the developement of our younger centers Andersson and Chytil. Even to play with Hayes if they trade and re-sign him. I think Chytil ends up being a winger in his career especially if we fall enough to draft Hughes.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Who would you rather invest in, Tarasenko or Panarin? Both 27 years old. Tarasenko will cost assets. Panarin only money which we have a lot of.

I think the Ranges will add an elite scorer/sniper to play with and help the developement of our younger centers Andersson and Chytil. Even to play with Hayes if they trade and re-sign him. I think Chytil ends up being a winger in his career especially if we fall enough to draft Hughes.

Neither.

But if its one or the other, Panarin.

 

[Richard Banger]

Who would you rather invest in, Tarasenko or Panarin? Both 27 years old. Tarasenko will cost assets. Panarin only money which we have a lot of.

I think the Ranges will add an elite scorer/sniper to play with and help the developement of our younger centers Andersson and Chytil. Even to play with Hayes if they trade and re-sign him. I think Chytil ends up being a winger in his career especially if we fall enough to draft Hughes.

Be ballsy and get both of them.