Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XXI - Let's make a deal

[Edge]

I'm with you on that, just do not see the Knights ponying up that sort of scratch

Exactly. And if someone can’t make the Rangers stop and really think about an offer, then they shouldn’t pursue it.

 

[kovazub94]

Given where DeAngelo is right now, if the Rangers decide to listen, I'd be looking along the lines of a Seth Jones for Ryan Johansen type of trade.

Value for value. A trade that's going to hurt to make for both teams.

I have no interest in trading DeAngelo for 2-3 parts. In fact, I don't have a lot of interest in trading DeAngelo period.

I hope people take a notice of your post. Young(er) posters for some reason think it will kill their credibility if they change their initial stand, while in reality it is the opposite. This is not to say you need to change your options on a game-by-game basis, but allowing facts to dictate / influence the position, not vice versa, is where credibility is earned.

 

[bobbop]

I’ll be disappointed if the Rangers make a bad trade.

Trading DeAngelo would require a top piece coming back. I though @QJL had a pretty good list although I think a few of the players he mentioned are on teams (e.g. Vancouver) that won’t be shopping in this aisle.

Trading Trouba would require significant brain lock on the part of the Ranger management. Nothing on this board amuses (infuriates) me more than posters not measuring the value of special teams and matchups. Trouba gets all the tough assignments. Top lines, penalty killing etc. He is doing all of the heavy lifting. DeAngelo and Fox aren’t going to match up on the penalty kill. He isn’t going anywhere.

The Rangers have a group of 5-6 players and a couple of them are going to have to be moved to make the payroll work next year. We all,know who they are. I hope that management chooses wisely and extracts the most possible value from the pieces that have to be moved.

 

[Edge]

The reason Tuch’s ice time has dropped is because they acquired Mark Stone.

The reason Tuch scored less to end last year is because he shot 4/71 starting in February and got less ice time once again because they acquired Mark Stone.

Mark Stone is a having a hell of an impact to knock Tuch down to 11 goals over 61 games.

In fact it was so devastating, Tuch’s offense slowed a full month before Stone even got there.

But kidding aside, he actually saw his production rebound slightly after Stone was acquired, after a steady decrease in goal scoring over the previous months.

 

[bobbop]

I hope people take a notice of your post. Young(er) posters for some reason think it will kill their credibility if they change their initial stand, while in reality it is the opposite. This is not to say you need to change your options on a game-by-game basis, but allowing facts to dictate / influence the position, not vice versa, is where credibility is earned.

Thank you for noticing.

I hated the Stepan trade and for the first year and a half I thought the Rangers got jobbed.

I saw the flashes from ADA that everyone did but I never thought he would get anywhere near this level. That’s probably why my hockey management career lasted about an hour.

Nothing makes me happier than seeing him do well. If he does well, the Rangers do well. That’s all that matters to me.

 

[n8]

Why is Deangelo moving? I understand the chai crunch, but he’s the best player on the blue line. Move someone else.

because we foolishly acquired Trouba who is essentially taking up ADA's cap space. I'd much prefer having Pionk and Heinola although I guess it's impossible to say what influence Trouba has had on Fox and ADA this season. We can theoretically still trade Trouba but I don't see the Rangers pulling such a dick move unless Trouba legit gives the Rangers a business reason to do so.

 

[Edge]

because we foolishly acquired Trouba who is essentially taking up ADA's cap space. I'd much prefer having Pionk and Heinola although I guess it's impossible to say what influence Trouba has had on Fox and ADA this season. We can theoretically still trade Trouba but I don't see the Rangers pulling such a dick move unless Trouba legit gives the Rangers a business reason to do so.

I don't even know where to start with this...

 

[Shesterkybomb]

24 early next season that will be cost controlled 50-60 point defender.

I highly doubt I will be disappointed in the return.

What is that first sentence?

 

[kovazub94]

I’ll be disappointed if the Rangers make a bad trade.

Trading DeAngelo would require a top piece coming back. I though @QJL had a pretty good list although I think a few of the players he mentioned are on teams (e.g. Vancouver) that won’t be shopping in this aisle.

Trading Trouba would require significant brain lock on the part of the Ranger management. Nothing on this board amuses (infuriates) me more than posters not measuring the value of special teams and matchups. Trouba gets all the tough assignments. Top lines, penalty killing etc. He is doing all of the heavy lifting. DeAngelo and Fox aren’t going to match up on the penalty kill. He isn’t going anywhere.

The Rangers have a group of 5-6 players and a couple of them are going to have to be moved to make the payroll work next year. We all,know who they are. I hope that management chooses wisely and extracts the most possible value from the pieces that have to be moved.

100% right. I feel exactly the same way when seeing suggestions to move Trouba because we have Fox, ADA (and Lundkvist in the wings). Trouba is a great value and his contribution includes shielding these other RDs from the type of top minutes that would quickly expose their deficiencies.

Looking at it from a different angle, Trouba himself is not an issue. Rather the Rangers not having an appropriate partner that would allow further maximizing Trouba’s strong sides is the issue. The Rangers need to find / create ADA type of player to play 1LD with Trouba. Pretty feasible ask from the front office given what the Rangers could offer to bring even this very high quality LD it implies. Even in this scenario ADA should be nearly untouchable, at least until there’s a better picture on the full potential of Fox and Lundkvist.

 

[Avery16]

I’ll be disappointed if the Rangers make a bad trade.

Trading DeAngelo would require a top piece coming back. I though @QJL had a pretty good list although I think a few of the players he mentioned are on teams (e.g. Vancouver) that won’t be shopping in this aisle.

Trading Trouba would require significant brain lock on the part of the Ranger management. Nothing on this board amuses (infuriates) me more than posters not measuring the value of special teams and matchups. Trouba gets all the tough assignments. Top lines, penalty killing etc. He is doing all of the heavy lifting. DeAngelo and Fox aren’t going to match up on the penalty kill. He isn’t going anywhere.

The Rangers have a group of 5-6 players and a couple of them are going to have to be moved to make the payroll work next year. We all,know who they are. I hope that management chooses wisely and extracts the most possible value from the pieces that have to be moved.

I don't think anyone thinks Trouba or ADA are bad Ds or don't make this team a lot better. Its just that there are a lot of great players in this league, and teams in the cap era have to make choices between great players to fill holes elsewhere. We have three very good or promising RD on the big squad, and some serious F depth issues, plus significant cap constraints this and next season. Tough choices.

 

[Avery16]

Not sure if it was reported here yet, but Brooks claimed in an article late this week that ADA is comfortable playing LD. Maybe that can be explored once Skjei is moved. I don't know why Hajek isn't playing for Staal. I know Staal has had some ok games recently, but this is about the future, not the present. Staal will likely not be here next season, and unless we do something dumb like expose Hajek in the expansion draft, he should be here for seasons to come.

 

[Avery16]

because we foolishly acquired Trouba who is essentially taking up ADA's cap space. I'd much prefer having Pionk and Heinola although I guess it's impossible to say what influence Trouba has had on Fox and ADA this season. We can theoretically still trade Trouba but I don't see the Rangers pulling such a dick move unless Trouba legit gives the Rangers a business reason to do so.

…or unless another team gives us a reason to.

 

[duhmetreE]

If ADA goes anywhere its for a prospect like Zegras or in a package for a player like Matthews.... or McDavid

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

My guess is the bullying that Lias referred to other than obvious beef with coach Quinn is the medical/trainer personnel pushed him to play through some pain/injury which he was not used to and obviously resulted in poor on ice production. Rangers trainers are known to make players play with lots of injuries, Dan Girardi is a good example and his game deteriorated because he was always so banged up. My guess is he doesn't want to say it to get those people in trouble before getting all info on what exactly is his injury/pain.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

What return/value in a trade can we expect for Fox vs ADA vs Trouba?

 

[Rangers ftw]

Lias and Georgiev to Carolina, what would be a reasonable return?

 

[Blue Blooded]

What return/value in a trade can we expect for Fox vs ADA vs Trouba?

Hard to gauge exact value, but I would think that in terms of relative value it goes Trouba>=Fox>DeAngelo.

Trouba is the most proven and is locked into a contract. But he carries a high cap hit.

Fox has ELC term and is the youngest, has all of his prime ahead of him.

DeAngelo depends on how they view him, some GMs might think this season is a fluke. Needs a new contract and while he has two RFA seasons left (IIRC), will require a decent cap hit to lock up with term. GMs know points cost money, esp with arb rights, and if they think he is awful defensively they might not like the expected AAV.

Teams ready to contend now or aim to step up into contention with the trade will prefer Trouba/ADA. The other teams will prefer Fox.

I think Kyle Dubas likes DeAngelo most of all, it was Dubas (with Keefe as the coach) that acquired him in the OHL and had him score 2 PPG for the Greyhounds.

Since I think DeAngelo is the best of the bunch, I have a hard time seeing a trade involving him go down that I like.

 

[NernieBichols]

I don't even know where to start with this...

How about with WAAAAAAA!!!

 

[Mikos87]

Spoke with a friend of mine out of Boston.

He told me about Hayes to NYR before anyone reported interest. Same with Vesey.

He has connections in Boston Area Hockey

That Bolded statement above is what he stated was being discussed.

Could be nothing, but hes 2 for 2 in terms of NYR and Boston connected players specifically

That would be a hell of a return. Heinen is a very good utility player. But more importantly he's a proven NHLer in the 23-27 range. If you look at a contender's window, you see most of their roster in their prime hockey years. If you keep going after 18 year olds, that peak is 6 years away.

That would be a great return for Kreider. I posted about Kreider getting 3 pieces a month ago, with one of those pieces being an NHL forward who can at-least play on the 4th line, a 2020 1st and a prospect. Heinen is a better player than a 4th liner.

The question is, whose the prospect? I would absolutely love to get Studnika, but I doubt they move him. Frederic would be a great identity player. As would Beecher. But Boston has some other guys that are good options.

One thing to keep in mind: Boston has had a losing record over the last month or so. Those OT points... that's what's keeping them afloat.

TOR and TB are nipping at that division title.

 

[Vitto79]

Not sure if it was reported here yet, but Brooks claimed in an article late this week that ADA is comfortable playing LD. Maybe that can be explored once Skjei is moved. I don't know why Hajek isn't playing for Staal. I know Staal has had some ok games recently, but this is about the future, not the present. Staal will likely not be here next season, and unless we do something dumb like expose Hajek in the expansion draft, he should be here for seasons to come.

If expansion was today wouldn’t Hajek be exposed?

TRouba has a no trade, DEAngelo, and I’d take Lindgren today

Miller, Jones, Robertson in the pipeline on LD

Could sign and expose Strome and Fast

 

[haohmaru]

My guess is the bullying that Lias referred to other than obvious beef with coach Quinn is the medical/trainer personnel pushed him to play through some pain/injury which he was not used to and obviously resulted in poor on ice production. Rangers trainers are known to make players play with lots of injuries, Dan Girardi is a good example and his game deteriorated because he was always so banged up. My guess is he doesn't want to say it to get those people in trouble before getting all info on what exactly is his injury/pain.

Huh? Do you have any evidence of this?

Dan Girardi played through injuries because Dan Girardi wanted to play. Nobody "made" him play through anything.

 

[eco's bones]

I’ll be disappointed if the Rangers make a bad trade.

Trading DeAngelo would require a top piece coming back. I though @QJL had a pretty good list although I think a few of the players he mentioned are on teams (e.g. Vancouver) that won’t be shopping in this aisle.

Trading Trouba would require significant brain lock on the part of the Ranger management. Nothing on this board amuses (infuriates) me more than posters not measuring the value of special teams and matchups. Trouba gets all the tough assignments. Top lines, penalty killing etc. He is doing all of the heavy lifting. DeAngelo and Fox aren’t going to match up on the penalty kill. He isn’t going anywhere.

The Rangers have a group of 5-6 players and a couple of them are going to have to be moved to make the payroll work next year. We all,know who they are. I hope that management chooses wisely and extracts the most possible value from the pieces that have to be moved.

I was thinking the same on Trouba. Size, strength, orneriness and he's a very good and talented player too. Because of all those things he plays all situations and gets more ice time than any of our other D. He is the most valuable D on the team---he is the go to guy that allows others to do what they do best.

The other thing is in his coming here and the fact that's he's lived up to his expectations---something that a Shattenkirk didn't do. He had his reasons for wanting to be a Ranger and he committed to this team---you don't throw that away after half a season. Players around the league might look at that and think the Rangers aren't very loyal.

Tony is not an all situations D but he is having a fantastic year. I'd be pretty hesitant to move him. I also don't think we're moving Fox.

 

[NYR Viper]

Why can’t the team have 3 good defensemen? I’m confused. Is the cap set at 2?

 

[nyr__1994]

At this point, I’m asking for Glass, I’m asking for Krebs, and I’m asking for a first. And even then I don’t know if it’s my first choice.

Even if you throw his projections for this season out the window, ADA has been a 50-60 point defenseman for almost a year now over his last 82 games — and that trend is not only maintaining, but trending slightly up.

Most on here have been begging for a 60 point d man since...well forever it seems.

Now we have one and we are trying to trade him. I understand there is a salary cap, but if his production keeps trending up like it has, you are looking at a Norris caliber defenseman. So what if he cost 6 or even 6.5 a year. He will be worth 9-10 mil on the open market...

While that is not a cheap contract, it is still a value contract, and that is what good cap management is, getting players on value contracts.

 

[leetch99]

I have given Trouba thsi season to acclimate himself to the club . I think with a decent steady partner and consistency from the rest of the D and some forwards backchecking a bit moe and a guy that can up the FO winning percentage our defense as a whole can improve right across the board . He needs work though getting his PP shot on target ....that would help .