Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XVII - Want some, get some

[bobbop]

I don’t expect or want Kreider to get a seven year contract. That’s out of my value range. Pay him on a shorter term. Five years tops. And if his agents is be looking at the top 8-10 teams in desirable destinations (almost certainly all US) he will see there aren’t a lot of teams out there that will be able to give him a seven year term. @Edge nailed Kreider’s value perfectly . He is what he is. Stall will be gone next year and that leaves Lundquist (for one more year) and Mika. You need veteran leadership. Look at who is out there after every practice with the young players.

 

[Avery16]

Enter the Rykov

 

[BBKers]

@BBKers hearing anything about this? Also, anything on the Rangers? Seems like we havent really been looking to make any moves due to a lack of a fully healthy lineup.

Toronto and Carolina still talking about a trade apparently. Have not heard another word lately. Will meet some interesting people in 10 days or so. Will keep you posted if I hear something there.

 

[True Blue]

i meant overpay as UFA. no way I offer more than 2.5 per year for a 3 year deal at most for Fast already breaking down with maintenance days. if Fast wants 3 mil or more + goodbye. too much money for a depth PK forward that don't score much Fast is a 10 goal 30 pt guy. if someone wants to pay 3 or 4 mil for that, def not worth it. rather have a younger player take his spot on the roster as in getting his ice time, with being not the same type of player.

This is why I ultimately believe that he will be dealt. I think that the Rangers would spend that much money in different areas. Unless of course, as is the case with both Kreider and Strome, his desire to stay with the Rangers outweighed his desire to get the max amount of dollars. Though there is no GM that will pay him $4m

 

[FIRE DRURY]

We need Kakko or Chytil to go 100% in one-timer training, off the dot.

Agreed - especially Kakko.

If Panarin is going to be on his opposite circle on the PP, Kakko needs to shoot with assertiveness on that right side.

 

[Barnaby]

It doesn't have to be a rental, but I think it's the more likely scenario. Could they pull off a Stone-like trade with the Avs for Kreider? Of course, but I have a hard time seeing it.

Newhook doesn't need to help them now. At the earliest, Newhook needs to help them in 2.5 years when Kadri needs a new contract and the Avs need cheap talent on ELCs to fill in around their big guns.

But again, we know there was a deal being discussed around Kreider and the Avs pick at the draft. That deal fell apart when Newhook was still on the board. So what happened between now and then that would make them suddenly change their mind? They expected to be a good team this year, Newhook is having a very good debut with BC, and Kreider seems to be pouting more than he's scoring. I can't see anything there that makes me think the Avs would bite on that. Jost or Kaut? Sure, but I think Newhook is a pipe dream.

I concur. I'd be pretty close to shocked if the Rangers were able to pull off a guy like Newhook. Newhook has had a great debut and the Ads seemed to be pretty enamored with him. Teams seldom trade the prospect, but will often move the pick.

A first in 2020 and a B prospect or young bottom sixer (I'm not that familiar with the Avs), maybe a conditional 3rd in 2021 if Kreider resigns. I could see a deal similar to that.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

I mean, Kreider could probably very easily get 7 x 7 on the open market. Kane, Hayes and Anders Lee just got those contracts recently.

And if you're keeping the term shorter like 5 years, you're looking at a 9-10 million AAV to be in the same ballpark money wise.

It's just not realistic

 

[SA16]

If Kreider wasn't a Ranger and was going to be a FA this year would we want to sign him? No. Then why would we want to consider re-signing him?

 

[duhmetreE]

I'd honestly rather keep Kreider over Buch. Obviously depending on term. This is with the notion that Kravtsov replaces Buch in the near future.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

I mean, Kreider could probably very easily get 7 x 7 on the open market. Kane, Hayes and Anders Lee just got those contracts recently.

And if you're keeping the term shorter like 5 years, you're looking at a 9-10 million AAV to be in the same ballpark money wise.

It's just not realistic

JVR signed a 5 x 7.5m contract with Philly that could be looked at as a comparable with JVR being the more productive player.

I think Kreider is looking at something in the neighborhood of these:

If he wants 7 years: 6m cap hit

If he wants 6 years: 6.5m cap hit

If he wants 5 years: 7m cap hit

 

[Barnaby]

I don’t expect or want Kreider to get a seven year contract. That’s out of my value range. Pay him on a shorter term. Five years tops. And if his agents is be looking at the top 8-10 teams in desirable destinations (almost certainly all US) he will see there aren’t a lot of teams out there that will be able to give him a seven year term. @Edge nailed Kreider’s value perfectly . He is what he is. Stall will be gone next year and that leaves Lundquist (for one more year) and Mika. You need veteran leadership. Look at who is out there after every practice with the young players.

Why in the world do we want to extend Kreider for 5 years at his bare minimum 6.5-7.5 million range? This team has veteran leadership. This screams Staal and Girardi. Keep the player, get 2 years of value, and 3 years waiting to get rid of them on awful contracts. He's hit 50 points twice, but is generally in that mid 40 point range. The back end of that deal could be him forcing us to buy out, not sign a UFA, or extend valuable young players while he dips down to that 30-ish point range which means bottom end 2nd liner or 3rd line winger. It baffles me that some people want to hand him a massive contract rather than take a really valuable youth package to solidify the rebuild. If this team is extending anyone to 35 years old, it better be an elite forward or defenseman. What in Kreider's game this year shows you that THIS is the guy?

 

[FIRE DRURY]

I'd honestly rather keep Kreider over Buch. Obviously depending on term. This is with the notion that Kravtsov replaces Buch in the near future.

Buch is a half decade younger and is also outproducing Kreider right now. I'd rather have Buch in his prime here in NY, than Kreider trending down at a much higher salary.

They also play on different sides too.

 

[LaffyTaffy]

Toronto and Carolina still talking about a trade apparently. Have not heard another word lately. Will meet some interesting people in 10 days or so. Will keep you posted if I hear something there.

Appreciate it as always.

 

[Barnaby]

If Kreider wasn't a Ranger and was going to be a FA this year would we want to sign him? No. Then why would we want to consider re-signing him?

Bingo! If he was on another club we'd never go crazy for signing him. We'd say the back end of that deal could be a Frans Nielsen or Kyle Okposo type risk.

 

[aufheben]

I'd honestly rather keep Kreider over Buch. Obviously depending on term. This is with the notion that Kravtsov replaces Buch in the near future.

This is not something I want to bet on.

 

[duhmetreE]

Buch is a half decade younger and is also outproducing Kreider right now. I'd rather have Buch in his prime here in NY, than Kreider trending down at a much higher salary.

They also play on different sides too.

He's 4 years younger and they both bring different elements.

Kravtsov could theoretically replace Buch. It doesn't mean that it will happen with absolute certainty. We do not have anything close to a Kreider.

Like I've said, it all depends on term. What do people think Buch will want in 2 years? And Buch, as he is , will most definitely fall apart the older he gets.

 

[Avery16]

Kreider is a pending UFA and Buchnevich isn’t even an RFA until after next season. End of analysis.

 

[Edge]

Something to keep in mind when discussing veteran leadership is that today's younger players are tomorrow's veteran players.

So while we can't field a team of teenagers, guys who are 23 or 24 now will 26 or 27 when someone.

So as we talk about losing guys like Kreider, Staal, etc., it's important to note that's when the expectation for guys like Skjei, or ADA, or Lemieux comes into play --- in phases.

 

[offdacrossbar]

i may be one of few but ill take 89 over 20 all day long. younger cheaper and more talented.

buch still has the potential to have that boom breakthrough.

i think 20 is what he is at this point

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

31 Thoughts: A 'Code of Conduct' is coming to the NHL - Sportsnet.ca

9. Before the Dec. 1 signing deadline, word is the Oilers re-engaged some of the clubs who had shown previous interest in Jesse Puljujarvi. That includes the Rangers, St. Louis and Tampa Bay. I believe they discussed Lias Andersson with New York, and think Puljujarvi wanted to go there, but things couldn’t close.

 

[QJL]

31 Thoughts: A 'Code of Conduct' is coming to the NHL - Sportsnet.ca

Could definitely see this revisited in the future.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

Yeah I mean it was super obvious Andersson for Puljujarvi was being discussed

It makes sense

 

[Gardner McKay]

Yeah I mean it was super obvious Andersson for Puljujarvi was being discussed

It makes sense

What I don't understand is why it couldn't get done. Not too long ago I would have said no as I am one of the most anti-JP people on this board. But considering where Lias is at both from a production standpoint and how the team views him, I don't see why it didn't happen. No team should be asking for more.

 

[JimmyG89]

It probably didn't happen because the Oilers probably wanted more in return.

 

[Tob]

It probably didn't happen because the Oilers probably wanted more in return.

I think Lias is going to be traded at some point by the deadline in a package deal.