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Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XLIV

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bobbop said:
What kind of team are you going to run out there? Getting beat every night is no way to nurture a young group.

You don’t understand the culture part of rebuilding.
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There are a lot of people around here who don't understand this or don't want to understand it despite the fact that there are glaring examples of it around the league.
 
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For the record, I like Buchnevich and have patience for his path. I'm just puzzling some things together and guessing what might happen.

He is a guy that is not trusted by the coach. Maybe that changed, but there has been talk surrounding him. We are rumored to want to get back into our anticipated draft range in the top 10. Edmonton doesn't have the appetite to wait for a player to develop and maybe bounce after college graduation. Buch is RFA and club controlled. Maybe not worth #8 but we have some cap space to balance out the inequality.
 
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So, now we're talking about trading Zibanejad in 3 years without knowing what the next 3 years look like for him? This place is priceless. Truly.

And Buchnevich, too? The guy finally puts his best foot forward, arguably our best player down the stretch last season, and we want to shuffle him off for another pick and another dart thrown at the dart board?

I'll keep both for the next few seasons and take my chances. We've got enough picks.
 
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If and when we get to the point where Zibanejad’s next contract is a potential concern, we can explore the possibility of moving him.

But that’s still a ways out and there’s no incentive to force a move now unless there’s a no-brainer that is presented.

There’s much work to be done between now and then.
 
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haohmaru said:
So, now we're talking about trading Zibanejad in 3 years without knowing what the next 3 years look like for him? This place is priceless. Truly.

And Buchnevich, too? The guy finally puts his best foot forward, arguably our best player down the stretch last season, and we want to shuffle him off for another pick and another dart thrown at the dart board?

I'll keep both for the next few seasons and take my chances. We've got enough picks.
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What about using him in a package for a young NHL player?
 
haohmaru said:
So, now we're talking about trading Zibanejad in 3 years without knowing what the next 3 years look like for him? This place is priceless. Truly.

And Buchnevich, too? The guy finally puts his best foot forward, arguably our best player down the stretch last season, and we want to shuffle him off for another pick and another dart thrown at the dart board?

I'll keep both for the next few seasons and take my chances. We've got enough picks.
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The Zibanejed stuff I don't know how it manifested.

It doesn't seem like anyone really wants to ship out Buchnevich. There was a comment made by a beat writer that alluded to him not being around for the expansion draft. It's just conversation. Don't know why you are putting a condescending angle on it.
 
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It's all about the end result with the rebuild. If the Rangers can get a piece they see as a better long-term option in the deal, then I think Buchnevich could be traded. Like I said earlier, I think that's either a top-10 pick to get a player they really covet or a potential foundational piece on the blue line. I don't think Buch gets the former on his own, but in a bigger trade that involves a couple other pieces on either side it could get it done depending on how other teams value him.

Dealing him is definitely betting big on Kravtsov though. Depends on what other moves are made of course, but there will be 3 open spots on the wings in the top-six if the Rangers deal both Buch and Kreider while adding Kakko at the draft. Would imagine they'd like to add another right-shot player in that group as well.
 
ZuccsFluffierFluffer said:
Ok, better young NHL player.
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IDK, I guess my issue with this is Buchnevich + whatever 1st/2nd for "upgrade" makes less sense to me than signing a young-ish UFA that costs us nothing.

I guess it depends on if Buchnevich is amenable to giving up a few UFA years in an RFA deal that's good for both sides. I'm definitely not ready to give up on the guy, though.
 
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DutchShamrock said:
It doesn't seem like anyone really wants to ship out Buchnevich. There was a comment made by a beat writer that alluded to him not being around for the expansion draft. It's just conversation. Don't know why you are putting a condescending angle on it.
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Nothing condescending about it all. I just don't understand it. Even Buch+ for 8th OA - I have doubts that 8OA in this years draft amounts to Buchnevich in the first place. The rebuild should be made around core pieces and, if anything, Buchnevich took a huge step at the end of last year and should be part of that core. No reason to send a 24 year old packing for another spin of the wheel for a guy that's clearly starting to fill his shoes and live up to expectations. Look at some of the redrafts for that year, many have PB going in the first round.

2013 Redraft: MacKinnon remains No. 1 pick of Avalanche

2013 NHL Re-Draft - NHL - DraftSite.com

Quite a few have put the Buch for __ or Buch + ___ for _____ out there. This isn't limited to a beat writer. Scroll back.
 
haohmaru said:
IDK, I guess my issue with this is Buchnevich + whatever 1st/2nd for "upgrade" makes less sense to me than signing a young-ish UFA that costs us nothing.

I guess it depends on if Buchnevich is amenable to giving up a few UFA years in an RFA deal that's good for both sides. I'm definitely not ready to give up on the guy, though.
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Player you trade for would cost less cap wise and likely has his best hockey ahead of him.

Just from a timing and roster perspective, that seems to be the more prudent option. For instance, the difference between a Nylander and Panarin is going to be 4+ mill annually - That is significant.
 
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ZuccsFluffierFluffer said:
Player you trade for would cost less cap wise and likely has his best hockey ahead of him.

Just from a timing and roster perspective, that seems to be the more prudent option. For instance, the difference between a Nylander and Panarin is going to be 4+ mill annually - That is significant.
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How do you figure? Nylander is 10M. Panarin isn't going to be 14M. And, after last year, that Nylander contract isn't looking great.

I get the idea, I just don't get why another NHL GM is trading a younger/better Buchnevich for Buchnevich+. I don't see it.
 
haohmaru said:
How do you figure? Nylander is 10M. Panarin isn't going to be 14M. And, after last year, that Nylander contract isn't looking great.

I get the idea, I just don't get why another NHL GM is trading a younger/better Buchnevich for Buchnevich+. I don't see it.
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Nylander was only 10 this year because of the prorated salary. He comes in a touch under 7 for the next 5 years.

Panarin would take at least 11 to come here.

And the reason would be $$$$$$$. You'd get a capable NHL body on top of other things (likely another pick, and a prospect or perhaps another roster player like Pionk.)

Rangers have the space to take another body back if necessary.
 
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ZuccsFluffierFluffer said:
Nylander was only 10 this year because of the prorated salary. He comes in a touch under 7 for the next 5 years.

Panarin would take at least 11 to come here.

And the reason would be $$$$$$$. You'd get a capable NHL body on top of other things (likely another pick, and a prospect or perhaps another roster player like Pionk.)

Rangers have the space to take another body back if necessary.
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Why are you paying 7M to a guy that averaged .5PPG (27 points in 54 games) last season and losing assets for that privilege instead of signing a guy that was a beast in the playoffs, had 87 points in 79 games, and all it's costing you is money? That makes little sense to me for the sake of "cap". One was clearly not like the other last year.
 
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haohmaru said:
Why are you paying 7M to a guy that averaged .5PPG (27 points in 54 games) last season and losing assets for that privilege instead of signing a guy that was a beast in the playoffs, had 87 points in 79 games, and all it's costing you is money? That makes little sense to me for the sake of "cap". One was clearly not like the other last year.
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And if it were just about last year, I'd agree.

But it isn't. Nylander's usage wasn't very good and he was playing catchup the entire year. I'd wager on him bouncing back in a big way the next year.

4 million+ in cap is significant, especially since our young guys aren't going to be on ELC's forever. Plus he just turned 23, it's reasonable to say that his best hockey is ahead of him.

Panarin's probably isn't.
 
ZuccsFluffierFluffer said:
And if it were just about last year, I'd agree.

But it isn't. Nylander's usage wasn't very good and he was playing catchup the entire year. I'd wager on him bouncing back in a big way the next year.

4 million+ in cap is significant, especially since our young guys aren't going to be on ELC's forever. Plus he just turned 23, it's reasonable to say that his best hockey is ahead of him.

Panarin's probably isn't.
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Panarin's probably is. I don't think he's peaked.

I'm not even a "sign Panarin" guy - but I'd take signing Panarin over losing huge assets for Nylander any day of the week. Screw the cap, it's not going to be an issue when this team is really competing again in a few years.
 
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