Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XL

[ganiseri]

is there a 3rd pairing thug right d out there coming available in the next few seasons? I know this is old school thinking but we need a guy like a more mobile McQuaid to balance out the other guys on the right side. The Rangers are going to be really young and Charmin soft. I am also not against adding say Ryan Reaves for 6 minutes a night if he can take a shift and not Tanner Glass it.

Tampa got kicked out in 1st round for being too soft to get the puck. Last year caps dominated pens physically. Look what Zadorov is doing for Colorado. You dont need enforcer but you need guys who are not scared to get dirty when game is ugly. Lay some big/heavy hits on star players. Pens retooled hard to play against Wilson and that went to south.

 

[NYRKing]

The next deals should be moving out

Kreider
Fast
Names
Vesey

I would be shocked if Fast is moved. The other three, sure, but I think Shattenkirk is added to this list. Brooks said he' on the block and where there's smoke there's fire, especially after adding Fox.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I would be shocked if Fast is moved. The other three, sure, but I think Shattenkirk is added to this list. Brooks said he' on the block and where there's smoke there's fire, especially after adding Fox.

Pionk should be at the top of that list.

 

[LORDE]

At the end of the day, I get the sense from conversations over the last 6 -8 months that the Rangers want to come away with the guys they like and are willing to be aggressive in coming away with them.

I suspect they don't want to be in a position like 2017 where the guy at the top of their list was just out of reach. I think they want to go in, get their guys, and go home.

So in the Fox case, I think the Rangers probably could've haggled over which second rounder, or rolled the dice on waiting a year, but the fact was that they wanted Fox. As a result, they went out and got him. No speculating, no maybes, no waiting, no last minute derailments, etc.

Based on those same conversations, I get the sense the Rangers would like to take a similar approach in this draft. Let's put the Kreider speculation aside for a moment. Let's say for example that Zegras or Newhook is on the board at 14, and the Rangers have both guys ranked high. I can see the Rangers being willing to part with the Jets pick, the Dallas pick and the Tampa pick to get "their guy" and know he's in the fold.

I say that because I think there's a decent probability that if people weren't crazy about the Fox price, they're going to be surprised at how aggressive the Rangers might look to be elsewhere.

Which is fine... because we don’t need 3 ‘maybes or wait around and sees’ we need elite or close.

IF Fox is and Kakko is and we spend wildly to net the guy we would’ve picked at 6 - 9 I’m completely fine with that. MORE than fine.

 

[LORDE]

By the way, the Rangers 2016 draft is now:

#27 Brett Howden
#37 Libor Hajek
#49 Ryan Lindgren
#66 Adam Fox
#81 Sean Day
#98 Tarmo Reunanen
#133 Yegor Rykov
#141 Tim Gettinger
#171 Gabriel Fontaine
#174 Tyler Wall
#201 Ty Ronning

The active rebuilding stage of drafting our own picks and using vets to add picks and prospects might have only started last year, but in terms of development arcs, the rebuild clearly starts with that draft. Goes to my way of looking at it, which is that the rebuild is 3 years in and is about to conduct its 4th draft.

True in a sense.

Also true is that our own picks look awful but they’re taken in way diff spots also.

I look at it from this perspective also but I don’t consider the rebuild “starting in 2016” I see Gorton using a time machine of assets.

 

[Thirty One]

Tampa got kicked out in 1st round for being too soft to get the puck. Last year caps dominated pens physically. Look what Zadorov is doing for Colorado. You dont need enforcer but you need guys who are not scared to get dirty when game is ugly. Lay some big/heavy hits on star players. Pens retooled hard to play against Wilson and that went to south.

When the Caps win it's because of their size. When they lose, it's because of their skill. They got eliminated by a Hurricanes team without Ferland and Martinook.

 

[Tawnos]

True in a sense.

Also true is that our own picks look awful but they’re taken in way diff spots also.

I look at it from this perspective also but I don’t consider the rebuild “starting in 2016” I see Gorton using a time machine of assets.

In terms of the development timeline of the prospects in the organization, that's the same thing.

 

[East Coast Bias]

When the Caps win it's because of their size. When they lose, it's because of their skill. They got eliminated by a Hurricanes team without Ferland and Martinook.

They choked for a decade straight.

Then last season they were uber-clutch. A team that got murdered on shot and scoring attempts, but just knew how to score goals. Elite, clutch, goal scoring machine.

Then they choked again.

 

[haohmaru]

When the Caps win it's because of their size. When they lose, it's because of their skill. They got eliminated by a Hurricanes team without Ferland and Martinook.

Martinook played in 6 out of the 7 games vs. the Caps.

 

[LORDE]

In terms of the development timeline of the prospects in the organization, that's the same thing.

Yes. I was agreeing with u... just that I name/call it something else

 

[NYRKing]

Pionk should be at the top of that list.

A lot of people have soured on Pionk this year because of his defensive lapses but I think the organization holds him in high regard. This was his first full season in the NHL and at 23 with his offensive ability, he should sign a simple bridge contract and see if he can better adjust defensively over the next two years.

Frankly, he has a head for the game and may be able to make the adjustments needed to be a more well-rounded player.

 

[haohmaru]

They choked for a decade straight.

Then last season they were uber-clutch. A team that got murdered on shot and scoring attempts, but just knew how to score goals. Elite, clutch, goal scoring machine.

Then they choked again.

Ovie deserved a Cup, I guess.

Ovie also deserves getting bounced in the first round for doing the chicken thing and "all series baby" type of stuff. Stop talking/taunting and just win the games you need to. Otherwise, you just look like an even bigger idiot - which he does.

 

[Tawnos]

Yes. I was agreeing with u... just that I name/call it something else

Forgive me for being confused by you agreeing with me. It's pretty rare

 

[Thirty One]

Martinook played in 6 out of the 7 games vs. the Caps.

Well it seemed like he missed more!

 

[haohmaru]

Well it seemed like he missed more!

Invisible out there.

 

[NYRKing]

Tampa got kicked out in 1st round for being too soft to get the puck. Last year caps dominated pens physically. Look what Zadorov is doing for Colorado. You dont need enforcer but you need guys who are not scared to get dirty when game is ugly. Lay some big/heavy hits on star players. Pens retooled hard to play against Wilson and that went to south.

Agree. You need guys who can play fast but throw some weight. Hajek doesn't show the emotion but he can be very physical and Lindgren as well. ADA is the one who gets lost in this conversation. He might be small and offensive, but he has the edge and emotion that can really boost the back-end as long as it doesn't get away from him.

 

[BobMarleyNYR]

I would be shocked if Fast is moved. The other three, sure, but I think Shattenkirk is added to this list. Brooks said he' on the block and where there's smoke there's fire, especially after adding Fox.

Yeah, especially as right defense becomes more and more questionable, I think they'd sooner give him 4 years, $15-16M.

 

[BobMarleyNYR]

...

 

[True Blue]

I say that because I think there's a decent probability that if people weren't crazy about the Fox price, they're going to be surprised at how aggressive the Rangers might look to be elsewhere.

Believe it or not, while I fall into the camp of not being crazy about Fox price, I wouldn't at all be shocked at how aggressive Gorton would be to get his guy if such a move is feasible.

 

[Fitzy]

Morning hot take-

A good third pairing isn't crucial for a cup competing team. So concerns about whether a player could be a #5-6 are somewhat overstated. Lots of mediocre players that can be gotten on the cheap, such as Holden, Kempny, or McQuaid. You can have unusually good/useful third pairing dmen, which is nice, similar to 4th liners, but I don't think it's essential.

 

[BobMarleyNYR]

Agree. You need guys who can play fast but throw some weight. Hajek doesn't show the emotion but he can be very physical and Lindgren as well. ADA is the one who gets lost in this conversation. He might be small and offensive, but he has the edge and emotion that can really boost the back-end as long as it doesn't get away from him.

He's feisty, intense and pretty strong but his physical play is almost as ineffectual as it is entertaining and inspiring to teammates.

 

[East Coast Bias]

Morning hot take-

A good third pairing isn't crucial for a cup competing team. So concerns about whether a player could be a #5-6 are somewhat overstated. Lots of mediocre players that can be gotten on the cheap, such as Holden, Kempny, or McQuaid. You can have unusually good/useful third pairing dmen, which is nice, similar to 4th liners, but I don't think it's essential.

While I would agree, I think there's maybe not concern, but definitely intrigue into how Quinn's going to handle the RHD.

He doesn't seem to have any interest in dressing 3 of Shatty, Pionk, ADA and Fox together, based on last year. So if he's going to dress 2 of them and a 3rd RHD not in that group - what happens to the other 2?

We'll see.

 

[Fitzy]

While I would agree, I think there's maybe not concern, but definitely intrigue into how Quinn's going to handle the RHD.

He doesn't seem to have any interest in dressing 3 of Shatty, Pionk, ADA and Fox together, based on last year. So if he's going to dress 2 of them and a 3rd RHD not in that group - what happens to the other 2?

We'll see.

I think part of it depends on if Fox turns out to be as solid defensively as advertised, or if (Unthinkable I know) he needs a year in the AHL to develop his game to the pro level. Not to overstate the importance of a tourney on international ice, but we'll get a good indication of how Fox looks against men in the IIHFs.

If he is two-way, as advertised, the size becomes less of an issue.

If NYR go in on Trouba, which I truly think is a possibility, then you're going to see some movement from the rest of the defense.

 

[Lion Hound]

Brooks threw two tidbits out there recently.

1) Shattenkirk on the clock
2) Rangers trading a roster player to get another pick the 1st round.

Petrified of a Shatty plus the WPG pick, for a Cap dump type of a deal with say Edmonton for a Lucic contract plus the 8th overall.

 

[RGY]

Brooks threw two tidbits out there recently.

1) Shattenkirk on the clock
2) Rangers trading a roster player to get another pick the 1st round.

Petrified of a Shatty plus the WPG pick, for a Cap dump type of a deal with say Edmonton for a Lucic contract plus the 8th overall.

Shattenkirk is absolutely not waiving for EDM