Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XL

[True Blue]

What are your guys thoughts of something around Zib for 4th overall?

Nooooooooo.........ZBad is already a legit top line center. You NEED players like him on a rebuilding team.

 

[NYRangers0723]

What are your guys thoughts of something around Zib for 4th overall?

You cant trade every roster player for picks especially our top players who are young. I feel the same way with Kreider. I don't mind dealing him if its a big package or if he wants a expensive new deal but I feel like he is a good piece to have around. Many seem to want to get rid of him ASAP lol

 

[True Blue]

He'll get a 7-8 years, large money deal as an RFA from whatever team trades for him.

I agree that it will be 7 years. But I also think he shops around to see what the cash will be. Does not make sense for him not to.

 

[Ola]

Brooks threw two tidbits out there recently.

1) Shattenkirk on the clock
2) Rangers trading a roster player to get another pick the 1st round.

Petrified of a Shatty plus the WPG pick, for a Cap dump type of a deal with say Edmonton for a Lucic contract plus the 8th overall.

When did he mention the trade for a pick thing?

 

[TheBloodyNine]

I agree that it will be 7 years. But I also think he shops around to see what the cash will be. Does not make sense for him not to.

A team isn’t going to trade for him as an RFA without some assurance that he’d re-sign long term there.

 

[Lion Hound]

That sounds more like Kreider to me, TBH.

Not many other guys we'd trade that are worth a first- Vesey Fast and Names may each be worth a late second or early third, but a first screams Kreider.

Seems like its mostly this board that is on the trade Kreider piece. With Gorton unsure if Kreider is going to resign it seems all speculation on the part of the posters here.

Brooks is mentioning an player here. Speculation, or does he know something?

 

[True Blue]

A team isn’t going to trade for him as an RFA without some assurance that he’d re-sign long term there.

Then he may well stay on the Jets and they would do that as they are an "all-in" team. They are not going to trade him away simply for draft picks.

 

[ETTER DE]

"They acquired Tony De Angelo. He is a good player. He isn't the answer. All of the Rangers fan love him. The guy is still a jerk and needs a lot of handling."

Should have been traded to Carolina in the deal

 

[Thirty One]

When did he mention the trade for a pick thing?

Also wondering this.

 

[ETTER DE]

Might be wiser to just keep Shattenkirk and Pionk around and keep Fox in the AHL for the first half. Hopefully he bangs down the door and they have no choice but to move someone to make room.
Sometimes it takes that kind of situation to force a resolution rather than doing something proactively. I know it's a little counter-intuitive.

Maybe they think he needs to improve his skating? Could it be the reason why they did not want him to go back to Harvard? Start to work with him as soon as possibly?

 

[NickyLongLegz]

Seriously, what is with everyone here wanting to trade literally everyone on our roster that is over 23 years old? It is going to be tremendously valuable to have players with playoff experience once we are contenders. Zib should obviously stay as he is a legit first line center and is still young, Fast should say because he is excellent on the penalty kill and provides great bottom 6 offense and defense. The ideal situation with Kreider would be him resigning with the Rangers with a reasonable contract. Kreider is just entering his prime and is a powerhouse when he is on his game and I think with a bigger leadership role such as captain, he will become less streaky. Kreider is not going to be easily replaced unless we trade him for a top 7 pick. I'm all for young talent, but having a few 27 year olds is not going to hurt us.

 

[duhmetreE]

Kreider for Caufield
Kreider for Zegras
Kreider for Turcotte

all are acceptable

 

[Tawnos]

Seriously, what is with everyone here wanting to trade literally everyone on our roster that is over 23 years old?

It’s like two people.

Though there’s plenty of appetite to move Kreider... but that has more to do with his contract status than his age or the player he is.

 

[NickyLongLegz]

It’s like two people.

Though there’s plenty of appetite to move Kreider... but that has more to do with his contract status than his age or the player he is.

I agree with you, I just don't agree with the sentiment that we should be actively shopping him no matter what. If he asks for too hefty of a contract, then we will have to consider moving him for sure.

 

[Mac n Gs]

I love Kreider, but let’s be real here, he isn’t entering his prime. I don’t want to move him, but his impending contract status and overall body of work makes me wary of a long-term deal. Plus, moving him now allows you to send him to a team for a full season, and that team would have the added value of being able to recoup any assets used to acquire him around the deadline. He’d also most likely be moved with salary retention, which means you’re trading a big, fast, possession driving first line LW that’s a lock for ~25-25. That has value.

Also wondering this.

IIRC, it was in one of his interviews shortly after the draft lottery.

 

[Tawnos]

I agree with you, I just don't agree with the sentiment that we should be actively shopping him no matter what. If he asks for too hefty of a contract, then we will have to consider moving him for sure.

The question is really what you think the player is going to be as a 34 year old. Today doesn't matter.

 

[Cag29]

"They acquired Tony De Angelo. He is a good player. He isn't the answer. All of the Rangers fan love him. The guy is still a jerk and needs a lot of handling."

Should have been traded to Carolina in the deal

Quinn is handling ADA very well so far.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Kreider for Caufield
Kreider for Zegras
Kreider for Turcotte

all are acceptable

Winner.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

The question is really what you think the player is going to be as a 34 year old. Today doesn't matter.

He'll be at the very, very, very, very worst, a 3rd line player and play on the 2nd PP. I have no idea what percentage of the cap his contract will take up in 5 years, but he's worth keeping unless you're getting immediate help on the blue line back in a trade. You can keep the 14th or 15th pick or some reclamation project. Every team left in the playoffs has players over 30, playing well and contributing. I'm not saying he shouldn't or can't be moved, but you have a ton of young kids on the way and they need to learn how to be a Ranger. Who do you think is leading workouts in CT in the summer? Signing some journeyman vet for a year or two isn't the way to go about that, in my opinion.

Brandon Dubinsky, who isn't half the player Kreider is, is still chugging along at 33, playing 17-18 minutes a night for Colombus. Big minutes.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Kreider for Caufield
Kreider for Zegras
Kreider for Turcotte

all are acceptable

Honest question, have you seen any of those kids play for an extended amount of time?

 

[Mac n Gs]

He'll be at the very, very, very, very worst, a 3rd line player and play on the 2nd PP. I have no idea what percentage of the cap his contract will take up in 5 years, but he's worth keeping unless you're getting immediate help on the blue line back in a trade. You can keep the 14th or 15th pick or some reclamation project. Every team left in the playoffs has players over 30, playing well and contributing. I'm not saying he shouldn't or can't be moved, but you have a ton of young kids on the way and they need to learn how to be a Ranger. Who do you think is leading workouts in CT in the summer? Signing some journeyman vet for a year or two isn't the way to go about that, in my opinion.

Brandon Dubinsky, who isn't half the player Kreider is, is still chugging along at 33, playing 17-18 minutes a night for Colombus. Big minutes.

Uh, that Dubi comp doesn’t terrify you? Dubi had 16 and 14 points in 62 and 61 games, respectively, these past two years. He has two years left at $5.85M AAV plus a limited NTC/NMC. His 8.48% on the cap at the time of signing is equivalent to a $7M contract for Kreider today.

Again, I love Kreids and would keep him if I had the choice, but there’s a lot of risk here. It’s apparent that you need veterans and trying to build a team of only 20-24 year olds is folly, but they also need to be the right group of veterans.

 

[Cag29]

I love Kreider, but let’s be real here, he isn’t entering his prime. I don’t want to move him, but his impending contract status and overall body of work makes me wary of a long-term deal. Plus, moving him now allows you to send him to a team for a full season, and that team would have the added value of being able to recoup any assets used to acquire him around the deadline. He’d also most likely be moved with salary retention, which means you’re trading a big, fast, possession driving first line LW that’s a lock for ~25-25. That has value.



IIRC, it was in one of his interviews shortly after the draft lottery.

Kreider had 28 goals this season (Panarin 28 as well) that put him tied for 48th overall in the league. League av was 8.4 goals.
I really feel barring an unforeseen injury he can keep that up until he’s 32-33 no problem. He’s a specimen
With luck and playing with Zibby and possibly Kakko he could hit 35-40.
If he would sign 7 years at 6.5 I would sign him. But if an overwhelming deal came up I could see doing that as well. Very tough decision because he’s an unusual talent. Size speed power. Hard to come by. Also I keep thinking if we trade him he will he will go wild with his new team. Just our luck.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Uh, that Dubi comp doesn’t terrify you? Dubi had 16 and 14 points in 62 and 61 games, respectively, these past two years. He has two years left at $5.85M AAV plus a limited NTC/NMC. His 8.48% on the cap at the time of signing is equivalent to a $7M contract for Kreider today.

Again, I love Kreids and would keep him if I had the choice, but there’s a lot of risk here. It’s apparent that you need veterans and trying to build a team of only 20-24 year olds is folly, but they also need to be the right group of veterans.

It doesn't terrify me. Maybe Dubinsky wasn't the best example (I watched the game last night) but he's obviously still a very useful player on a team that's making a lot of noise and just beat up on the analytics wunderkids. Every team needs a certain kind of player, it's not all flashy 22 year olds skating around. We want a team that can win a cup. You need older established players to do that. We're seeing that in the playoffs. And there's risk with every player, but the guy is in amazing shape. I'm less worried about his durability than I am about someone like Zibanejad.

Who would be better to have on the other side of either Kakko or Kratsov this year?

If Kreider and his agent ask for something ridiculous, move him. Move him tomorrow. But if not, keep him. He'll only be a benefit to kids like Kakko, Kratsov, Chytil, whoever.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

Kreider had 28 goals this season (Panarin 28 as well) that put him tied for 48th overall in the league. League av was 8.4 goals.
I really feel barring an unforeseen injury he can keep that up until he’s 32-33 no problem. He’s a specimen
With luck and playing with Zibby and possibly Kakko he could hit 35-40.
If he would sign 7 years at 6.5 I would sign him. But if an overwhelming deal came up I could see doing that as well. Very tough decision because he’s an unusual talent. Size speed power. Hard to come by. Also I keep thinking if we trade him he will he will go wild with his new team. Just our luck.

Kreider is never scoring 35-40 goals in his career.

 

[NickyLongLegz]

Kreider is never scoring 35-40 goals in his career.

He would have scored 32-35 goals this past season if he didn't play through that injury. I think if he has a healthy season without the uncertainty of a trade or something, he can put up 35 easy. 40 goals I definitely don't think so. He clearly has the potential to be that good, but how to bring it out? Maybe coach Quinn, maybe giving him a captaincy, idk. Ideally, we can get him to sign a 4-5 year contract. I'd be more than happy to trade him for a top 10 pick, but not top 15, that is just not worth it to me unless we are sure his next contract is really going to f*** us.