Roster Building Thread: Part VII (2023-24)

[Savant]

It's really not a big deal. It's August 12th.

Trevor Zegras, Jamie Drysdale, Shane Pinto, Evan Vouchard and Calen Adison (to name a few) are still unsigned.

Also...

Nah. We need 24/7 video of access to see why he hasn’t signed yet.

clearly

 

[bhamill]

See a reference to Cuylle is not needed - it only muddies the point.

If you have a player who’s in his D+2 year scores 19 goals and in his D+3 year gets 39 points, both almost exclusively at ES is by definition a good player. These are the only points needed.

Fair enough.

 

[bhamill]

Nope. Stupid.

His statement was basically along the lines of why are we complaining about Lafreniere. If Cuylle was doing this, then we’d be ecstatic. HF being HF.

By this logic, let’s say Zibanejad played 82 games next year and put up 35 points. Then I responded to criticism by saying, “Hey guys, would we be saying this if Nick Bonino put up 35 points?! He’s still a good NHL’er,” then it’d be equally ridiculous.

Well that’s YOUR interpretation of what he was saying. Which I could call a “stupid“ take if that’s how we are interacting. That’s not what I got out of it at all. EVERYONE has said Laf is a disappointment in comparison to his draft position. But some are saying he’s a bad player. Which they wouldn’t say about a player drafted lower playing the same way, the same level, at the same age. Now a player is either good or he is not, and that has ZERO to do with draft position or expectations. A borderline 3rd/2nd liner is NOT a bad player, and that’s what Laf is. It’s ridiculous to say he’s a bad player. I mean when your argument is to put aside a forward’s scoring to try to say a player is no good, it is real reach. Especially when he’s also our second most physical forward even if you mystically ignore his scoring stats.

 

[kovazub94]

Well that’s YOUR interpretation of what he was saying. Which I could call a “stupid“ take if that’s how we are interacting. That’s not what I got out of it at all. EVERYONE has said Laf is a disappointment in comparison to his draft position. But some are saying he’s a bad player. Which they wouldn’t say about a player drafted lower playing the same way, the same level, at the same age. Now a player is either good or he is not, and that has ZERO to do with draft position or expectations. A borderline 3rd/2nd liner is NOT a bad player, and that’s what Laf is. It’s ridiculous to say he’s a bad player. I mean when your argument is to put aside a forward’s scoring to try to say a player is no good, it is real reach. Especially when he’s also our second most physical forward even if you mystically ignore his scoring stats.

If you remove McDavid’s scoring then what does he do - just skating around fast. Call me unimpressed.

 

[nyr2k2]

Yeah Lafreniere is objectively a solid player. If you knew nothing about his background and looked at his age and production I don't know how you could reach any other conclusion. If you add in the context of him being the #1OA then of course he's a disappointment and his production seems unimpressive.

The draft pedigree doesn't really matter to me and it shouldn't in general. Players are players. I don't care if a random player is a former first rounder or a "nice story" guy from the sixth round. I care if he can play or not. Lafreniere can play, and as long as he's relatively cheap and under our control I'll be fine with him.

Him being a disappointment or not, that's a separate conversation for me.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Yeah Lafreniere is objectively a solid player. If you knew nothing about his background and looked at his age and production I don't know how you could reach any other conclusion. If you add in the context of him being the #1OA then of course he's a disappointment and his production seems unimpressive.

The draft pedigree doesn't really matter to me and it shouldn't in general. Players are players. I don't care if a random player is a former first rounder or a "nice story" guy from the sixth round. I care if he can play or not. Lafreniere can play, and as long as he's relatively cheap and under our control I'll be fine with him.

Him being a disappointment or not, that's a separate conversation for me.

It should matter that when almost all other #1 picks are franchise players and players in his draft are becoming superstars . And he’s sucking ass and doesn’t seem to care .

 

[Leonardo87]

 

[ReddestRum]

It should matter that when almost all other #1 picks are franchise players and players in his draft are becoming superstars . And he’s sucking ass and doesn’t seem to care .

This is VERY easy to say when YOUR #1 pick's only stand out is scoring 3rd liner, 5v5 goals while other #1 forwards simply stand out post Yakupov. I mean, I bet it matters to those teams and fanbases quite a bit LOL.

 

[RangersFan1994]

 

[KennyWu]

That's a generous use of "superstar", that's for sure

 

[Clark Kellogg]

View attachment 735654

So true. There could easily be another 20 players on that list.
I’ll throw Guy Lafleur’s name in.
Stopped there for now in case other people want to play.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

View attachment 735654

Jokinen lol

 

[ReddestRum]

View attachment 735654

Only one season where Wayne put up less points than games played and that was his final season with us, and he still put up 62 in 70 at 38 y/o AND was the leading point man on the team. Craziness.

 

[JHS]

You're reading things into the situation that aren't there. There's nothing unusual about a non-arbitration RFA still being unsigned on August 12th. The deadline to get a deal done is the first day of training camp, and that's a soft deadline.

If I'm his agent, I'm waiting as long as I can to see what Shane Pinto and Morgan Frost get so I can use that as leverage to get more for my client. The Rangers have some flexibility and his agent knows that. We have $2,278,417 in cap space with a 22 man roster. If we send down Belzile and Mackey, that number jumps up to $3,828,417. So even if we give Laf 3 mil per year, that's still 800k in cap space with a 21 man roster.

If you were Laf's agent, wouldn't you be trying everything you could to get him more money?

He’s the first overall pick and he’s trying to get an extra 500,000 from the organization because that’s how bad he’s been in his first few seasons. It’s pathetic. Almost as pathetic as his abilities on the ice.

Stop being so “well this is the way it goes.” No that’s true if you are a third round overachiever who is trying to get as much money as you can. Laf was supposed to be this transformative talent who now appears to be haggling over breadcrumbs. He should be embarrassed.

The Rangers should be embarrassed as well. Giving this underachieving mediocre likely never will be this bridge deal is a reflection on just how bad he’s developed. He’s not even remotely on the same level as any first overall pick in recent NHL history.

Rather than having this deal done and making an off season plan, instead this “fat” cat had likely been loafing through the off season and will again be almost exactly NHL average statistically next season.

 

[JHS]

Holy overreaction…

Really? So in your opinion it’s somehow a good thing that this “generational franchise altering player” is still unsigned and the training camp starts in a month?

That’s a sign of how mediocre this guy has been that this organization did not lock him up right away. They are treating him like he’s not even wanted( don’t blame them as he’s been average at best.)

Even you Laf lovers seem incapable of making sense. If you love the guy wouldn’t you want him around? Now you are the ones telling me it’s not a big deal he’s not signed…I’m confused. Truth is I could care less if they sign this guy because I’m fairly sure he’s not gonna amount to much but I do think a bridge deal is worth giving him since he’s so young. Not because he’s shown anything…

 

[GAGLine]

He’s the first overall pick and he’s trying to get an extra 500,000 from the organization because that’s how bad he’s been in his first few seasons. It’s pathetic. Almost as pathetic as his abilities on the ice.

Stop being so “well this is the way it goes.” No that’s true if you are a third round overachiever who is trying to get as much money as you can. Laf was supposed to be this transformative talent who now appears to be haggling over breadcrumbs. He should be embarrassed.

The Rangers should be embarrassed as well. Giving this underachieving mediocre likely never will be this bridge deal is a reflection on just how bad he’s developed. He’s not even remotely on the same level as any first overall pick in recent NHL history.

Rather than having this deal done and making an off season plan, instead this “fat” cat had likely been loafing through the off season and will again be almost exactly NHL average statistically next season.

Okay. Have fun being miserable.

 

[JHS]

Well that’s YOUR interpretation of what he was saying. Which I could call a “stupid“ take if that’s how we are interacting. That’s not what I got out of it at all. EVERYONE has said Laf is a disappointment in comparison to his draft position. But some are saying he’s a bad player. Which they wouldn’t say about a player drafted lower playing the same way, the same level, at the same age. Now a player is either good or he is not, and that has ZERO to do with draft position or expectations. A borderline 3rd/2nd liner is NOT a bad player, and that’s what Laf is. It’s ridiculous to say he’s a bad player. I mean when your argument is to put aside a forward’s scoring to try to say a player is no good, it is real reach. Especially when he’s also our second most physical forward even if you mystically ignore his scoring stats.

Bad vs good is too extreme. If you look at the numbers he’s statically almost exactly NHL average. So I’d call him average with below average attributes and one of the worst top overall picks in recent NHL history. That’s the most accurate way of describing Laf.

 

[JHS]

Okay. Have fun being miserable.

I’m actually not as you don’t even know me. I’m simply pointing out the truth and while I know living in delusional land is a trait of some around here the situation in reality land paints a picture of an organization that’s like “ok guess he will try and nickel and dime us for an extra 500,000- guess that’s what he wants to do.” Vs a player who is thinking “guess I better get an extra 500,000 before my “I’m young so I need more time” excuse runs out.”

This is not really the way most first overall picks are dealt with. Again reality land tell me that basically every first overall pick was signed to a large contract when his entry deal came up. That’s just fact. I know those are hard for people to swallow with Laf but I’ll keep trying( less often) to point them out.

 

[Vitto79]

So Laf gets sat 2.7 then the team has 300 k under the cap?

 

[GENESISPuck94]

The Lafrenière takes around here lately have been pretty wild. Gotta say, the fat and lazy narratives are super lame.

There are more accurate words to use other than lame.

 

[NYRFAN218]

I'll worry about Laf not being signed if it's Labor Day and guys are already in the area skating informally with camp a week or two away. Until then, it's not even a thought in my head.

 

[RGY]

Really? So in your opinion it’s somehow a good thing that this “generational franchise altering player” is still unsigned and the training camp starts in a month?

That’s a sign of how mediocre this guy has been that this organization did not lock him up right away. They are treating him like he’s not even wanted( don’t blame them as he’s been average at best.)

Even you Laf lovers seem incapable of making sense. If you love the guy wouldn’t you want him around? Now you are the ones telling me it’s not a big deal he’s not signed…I’m confused. Truth is I could care less if they sign this guy because I’m fairly sure he’s not gonna amount to much but I do think a bridge deal is worth giving him since he’s so young. Not because he’s shown anything…

Yes in my opinion this is not a big deal and you are providing an injection of a dramatic overreaction to two sides dealing with a contract situation like every other team does. It’s business.

Go enjoy the rest of your summer. Show up in October for opening night in which Lafreniere will be on the opening night roster

 

[GAGLine]

I’m actually not as you don’t even know me. I’m simply pointing out the truth and while I know living in delusional land is a trait of some around here the situation in reality land paints a picture of an organization that’s like “ok guess he will try and nickel and dime us for an extra 500,000- guess that’s what he wants to do.” Vs a player who is thinking “guess I better get an extra 500,000 before my “I’m young so I need more time” excuse runs out.”

This is not really the way most first overall picks are dealt with. Again reality land tell me that basically every first overall pick was signed to a large contract when his entry deal came up. That’s just fact. I know those are hard for people to swallow with Laf but I’ll keep trying( less often) to point them out.

You're right. I don't know you. And you don't know Laf, so why are you putting words in his mouth?

 

[Leonardo87]

@GAGLine and @JHS

 

[Vitto79]

I'll worry about Laf not being signed if it's Labor Day and guys are already in the area skating informally with camp a week or two away. Until then, it's not even a thought in my head.

Pretty much and about a dozen guys are unsigned RFAs

No way that list is that long come training camp