Speculation: Roster Building Thread III (2019/2020) - Tick Tock

[Kupo]

Everyone says Trouba is a long-term solution, but I don't see any way they keep Trouba in three years without losing one of Zibanejad/Kakko/Kravstov/Panarin.

Either that, or the Rangers are going to have to learn how to play moneypuck with the rest of their lineup which is like asking a fish not to swim.

Cap will likely go up a bit. And we have like 500M coming off the books in the next two years.

I'm always in pessimism mode because this team has been slapping itself in the face with the same turd for 80 years.

They couldn't make it through two full years of a rebuild without getting the bank account out.

I didn't want Panarin, personally, but I've opened up to the idea of having him with all things considered.

Lemiuex scored 12 goals last year in a limited role as a 22 year old and was a very effective rat, and all of a sudden he's "garbage"? C'mon man.

Only 1 person here is calling him garbage. The same poster who basically cried the day Callahan got traded. Ironically, Lemieux can become Callahan-lite if he continues developing some aspects of his game.

That's the best picture they could find of Guerin? Dude looks legit hammered in that picture. Super rosy cheeks and nose...

 

[Tawnos]

You realize that Hank, Staal, and Smith all drop off the books in 2 years and will probably be replaced by ELCs, right? And Namestinikov and Strome are gone at the end of this year? And the cap is likely going up a couple mil with the new TV deal in a couple years?

It's not nearly as dire as you make it out to be.

I do think the concern is valid, provided that Kakko and Kravtsov are deserving of huge contracts coming off their ELCs. Yes, the cap will go up, but so will salaries to match. Look at Toronto, as an example. They have 2 $11m+ contracts and 1 ~$7m one... and it's giving them fits in signing another player who also deserves $11m+.

Yes, there are differences in the situations. The Leafs still had Marleau and had Kadri on a medium deal, where we have several expiring at the right time.

The Cap is absolutely going to be tricky for the Rangers to navigate within a few years. But that's always going to be the case when teams become good. I can understand having some concern over it. It's a little harder to understand tearing your shirt over it. As you said, it's not dire.

 

[Kupo]

I think the cap situation is extremely workable assuming it continues to go up, and they don’t sign anymore crippling, big number deals until Staal, Smith and Hank are off the books.

Aka not signing Kreider, and hopefully they don’t fall in love with Strome and hand him a Brock Nelson type contract

I would also reckon a guess that if the LD prospects continue to develop that Skjei will be on his way out in the next 2-3 years

Exactly. I think K'andre + Miller + Jones will make Skjei expendable. Let's not forget about Lindgren and Hajek. ADA seems like a trade candidate too if Fox + Lundkvist develop the way we hope they can.

 

[EpicDing]

I do think the concern is valid, provided that Kakko and Kravtsov are deserving of huge contracts coming off their ELCs. Yes, the cap will go up, but so will salaries to match. Look at Toronto, as an example. They have 2 $11m+ contracts and 1 ~$7m one... and it's giving them fits in signing another player who also deserves $11m+.

Yes, there are differences in the situations. The Leafs still had Marleau and had Kadri on a medium deal, where we have several expiring at the right time.

The Cap is absolutely going to be tricky for the Rangers to navigate within a few years. But that's always going to be the case when teams become good. I can understand having some concern over it. It's a little harder to understand tearing your shirt over it. As you said, it's not dire.

Not to mention Kakko and Kravtsov deserving huge deals is a GREAT problem to have.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

imagine there being so much debate over Derick Brassard's washed up ass...and he being the difference as to whether this team is 'contending/no longer rebuilding' vs still 'rebuilding'....

and contending and rebuilding are not binary states either.

 

[Kupo]

I do think the concern is valid, provided that Kakko and Kravtsov are deserving of huge contracts coming off their ELCs. Yes, the cap will go up, but so will salaries to match. Look at Toronto, as an example. They have 2 $11m+ contracts and 1 ~$7m one... and it's giving them fits in signing another player who also deserves $11m+.

Yes, there are differences in the situations. The Leafs still had Marleau and had Kadri on a medium deal, where we have several expiring at the right time.

The Cap is absolutely going to be tricky for the Rangers to navigate within a few years. But that's always going to be the case when teams become good. I can understand having some concern over it. It's a little harder to understand tearing your shirt over it. As you said, it's not dire.

If Kakko and Kravtsov need big new contracts, that's a damn good problem to have. Gorton and the nerds will figure out how to make the Cap work.

 

[Vinny DeAngelo]

When are we going to see the ADA deal?? We have to lock up our best D man

 

[nyr2k2]

When are we going to see the ADA deal?? We have to lock up our best D man

Man we signed Trouba for 7Y/$56M over a month ago.

 

[Vitto79]

CLB seems like a team that will take a contract even after Werenski signs

 

[Trxjw]

HFNYR August 2022:
Speculation: Roster Building Thread - RFA Holdout Edition: A great problem to have!

HFNYR September 2022:
Speculation: Roster Building Thread - RFA Holdout Edition Pt 5: Loving this problem!

HFNYR October 2022:
Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Ungrateful RFAs!

HFNYR November 2022:
Speculation: Roster Building Thread - $45M for 4 Forwards Edition

 

[Claxton]

When are we going to see the ADA deal?? We have to lock up our best D man

The lack of cap space and "attitude issues" aside, i think its incredibly stupid they don't lock him up on a longer term/ lower cap hit deal(similar but less than Girard in Colorado) before he really hits his stride and his salary demands skyrocket. Hes going to get a 1 y QO, put up 40+ points and put this team in a tough situation

 

[Paulie Walnutz]

Man we signed Trouba for 7Y/$56M over a month ago.

Yeah but Trouba isn’t the best “transitional” passing d-man in the league like DeAngelo is

 

[Vinny DeAngelo]

Man we signed Trouba for 7Y/$56M over a month ago.

I meant the actual best not the guy that could "develop"

 

[Avery16]

Yeah but Trouba isn’t the best “transitional” passing d-man in the league like DeAngelo is

But how v*e*r*s*a*t*i*l*e is he

 

[haveandare]

I do think the concern is valid, provided that Kakko and Kravtsov are deserving of huge contracts coming off their ELCs. Yes, the cap will go up, but so will salaries to match. Look at Toronto, as an example. They have 2 $11m+ contracts and 1 ~$7m one... and it's giving them fits in signing another player who also deserves $11m+.

Yes, there are differences in the situations. The Leafs still had Marleau and had Kadri on a medium deal, where we have several expiring at the right time.

The Cap is absolutely going to be tricky for the Rangers to navigate within a few years. But that's always going to be the case when teams become good. I can understand having some concern over it. It's a little harder to understand tearing your shirt over it. As you said, it's not dire.

Assuming Kravtsov is going to need a big deal is premature to say the least imo.

Also Toronto’s cap is so bad because of a good deal of stupidity, not just because they have good players.

NYRs cap may get tricky but it’ll depend on way to many unknowns as of today imo.

 

[gravey9]

I don’t know what this fear is all about.

The Rangers have 3 young centers, All first round picks, All coming into their second or third pro seasons in Chytil Howden and Andersson.

You’ve got 4 veteran guys that are natural centers behind them in Strome Namestnikov McKegg and Nieves for back up.

At some point you’ve got to let your top prospects sink or swim with real playing time and real line mates.

Hayes was a late first round pick. They put him in the 3C spot right out of college with veterans and off he went. Nowhere near the pro experience Chytil Howden or Andersson have at this point.

Chytil is going on his third pro season. Yes he’s young but he’s no rookie anymore. This league is as young as its ever been. Time to let this kid loose. And putting him between Kreider and Buchnevich is the perfect opportunity

Yes, we do have 3 young centers. But other than Chytil, none of the other kids are projected as 2nd line centers. Strome, Names, Mckegg and Nieves are all fill ins. So, yes, while we have potentially an abundance of bottom 6 center options moving forward -- it's unclear that any of top 6 ceilings other than Chytil. And it remains to be seen if Chytil is better at C or W. The next two seasons will go a long way to determine that. But, point is, while do have centers, we don't really have other options for a true top 6 offensive center in the system. Even if Chytil ends up a legit 2c, we still need more depth in the organization.

 

[Avery16]

Yes, we do have 3 young centers. But other than Chytil, none of the other kids are projected as 2nd line centers. Strome, Names, Mckegg and Nieves are all fill ins. So, yes, while we have potentially an abundance of bottom 6 center options moving forward -- it's unclear that any of top 6 ceilings other than Chytil. And it remains to be seen if Chytil is better at C or W. The next two seasons will go a long way to determine that. But, point is, while do have centers, we don't really have other options for a true top 6 offensive center in the system. Even if Chytil ends up a legit 2c, we still need more depth in the organization.

Not bottom six depth though. We just need a 2C.

 

[kovazub94]

Yes, we do have 3 young centers. But other than Chytil, none of the other kids are projected as 2nd line centers. Strome, Names, Mckegg and Nieves are all fill ins. So, yes, while we have potentially an abundance of bottom 6 center options moving forward -- it's unclear that any of top 6 ceilings other than Chytil. And it remains to be seen if Chytil is better at C or W. The next two seasons will go a long way to determine that. But, point is, while do have centers, we don't really have other options for a true top 6 offensive center in the system. Even if Chytil ends up a legit 2c, we still need more depth in the organization.

And how does having Brassard for this season would address these concerns (which was the context of the post you responded)?

 

[kovazub94]

The lack of cap space and "attitude issues" aside, i think its incredibly stupid they don't lock him up on a longer term/ lower cap hit deal(similar but less than Girard in Colorado) before he really hits his stride and his salary demands skyrocket. Hes going to get a 1 y QO, put up 40+ points and put this team in a tough situation

But this is the thing, these two considerations are significant in the decision process right now. Can't put these aside.

 

[kovazub94]

imagine there being so much debate over Derick Brassard's washed up ass...and he being the difference as to whether this team is 'contending/no longer rebuilding' vs still 'rebuilding'....

and contending and rebuilding are not binary states either.

If it were possible I hate Isles even more now for signing Brassard and putting @Machinehead on this downward spiral of hot takes.

 

[gravey9]

And how does having Brassard for this season would address these concerns (which was the context of the post you responded)?

this convo was on-going and separate from the Brass convo.

For the record, I don't want Brass back. We've already got more than enough fill ins. We need more young 2c options in the system going forward. Depending on what happens with Kreider, going to assume at least one asset in any Kreider trade may go towards addressing org center depth.

 

[kovazub94]

Mckegg is going to be on this team. Proved to be a valuable center for Carolina during their playoff run.

I think Lias starts in Hartford at this point as does Nieves. At least until they can find a taker for namestnikov.

Panarin Zibanejad Kakko
Kreider Chytil Buchnevich
Lemieux Strome Kravtsov
Namestnikov Howden Fast
McKegg

Don’t be surprised if McKegg is in there for Howden if he gets off to a slow start. They very well may feel they want to reset with Lias and Howden in Hartford with big mins and a new coaching staff. Could see some time down there.

Kravtsov will not.

Skjei Trouba
Staal DeAngelo
Hajek Fox
Smith

I don’t think we’ll carry a 23rd guy at least not right away but I wouldn’t be surprised to see Rykov make the team and take games from Hajek and Fox to see who’s really ready for those mins.

I think we have a good team here. I believe Trouba taking pionks mins alone is huge. I believe the kids Chytil kakko Kravtsov are going to be serious contributors.

However I could be wrong and they could struggle. If that happens we are looking at another significant sell off.

Kreider Namestnikov Fast Strome all could and should be gone at that point if that happens

Agree with a lot in this post, and moving the thread away from discussion you know who, I'll play along and assume that Lias is in Hartford.

Where I'd slightly adjust your lineup is your bottom-6 forward lines - I'd rather put Howden at 3C and shift Strome to his wing instead of Lemieux who goes to 4LW and Namestnikov then becomes 4C.

 

[Machinehead]

I do now. MH still hasn't wrapped his head around the idea that you can do two things at once.

Sure you can do two things at once. You can have a terrible roster AND be up against the cap!

 

[Machinehead]

Yeah but Trouba isn’t the best “transitional” passing d-man in the league like DeAngelo is

Fake news.

Karlsson is the best transitional passing d-man in the league. DeAngelo is second.

 

[RangerBoy]

this convo was on-going and separate from the Brass convo.

For the record, I don't want Brass back. We've already got more than enough fill ins. We need more young 2c options in the system going forward. Depending on what happens with Kreider, going to assume at least one asset in any Kreider trade may go towards addressing org center depth.

Kreider is a rental. The Rangers aren't getting a top center for a rental.