Speculation: Roster Building Thread DCLXXIX: Countdown to the draft (and the other draft)

[Trxjw]

Arizona fans are so far apart on what most on here want stepan it's not even close.
Although Stepan is still young I feel like he fits a win now or semi win now ready team and Arizona is far from that. They were horrible last year and I don't see them being a playoff team this coming year or the following. He would be a good leader on that team for some of their younger forwards but from a results point of view will he make much of a difference on that team ?

A week ago Arizona fans thought they were going to steal Stepan because the Rangers were going to trade him there with Girardi. They thought he was a good option for exactly what most of us thing he'd bring to the table. Now that the Girardi thing has been debunked, it's all "he can't win faceoffs" and "we'll just keep rebuilding because Stepan sucks."

A smart GM knows he can't ice a roster full of kids. They need veterans to insulate them and mentor them. Chayka said exactly that on his conference call the other day. He said he wants a center. He wants to add right-handed shots. He cleared cap with Smith which was a deal that "wasn't made in isolation." All signs point to him being very, very interested in getting him, and there's no incentive for Gorton to end up with Hayes as his 2nd line center unless he's getting premium pieces back for Stepan.

They HAVE to add cap. They're not going to attract free agents that deserve that kind of money, and their owner isn't going to let them waste his money on players just to get to the cap floor. If they don't get Stepan, what are their options? Throw $8M a year at Hanzal? Throw stupid money at Nick Bonino?

Beggars can't be choosers. What other team is floating a top-six center with term that'd be willing to take futures at center in return?

 

[Gardner McKay]

It's not. You would be better off asking for 7+other things.

Yeah except we don't want to do a quality for quantity trade. Strome/Dvorak + or no dice.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

Rangers do not have to trade Stepan period. They're gonna get what they deem worthy or they will keep him, end of story.

 

[NYR Viper]

It's not. You would be better off asking for 7+other things.

Just because we are discussing deals without Strome, Chychrun, Domi or Dvorak doesn't mean there isn't a package that would interest Gorton.

Fischer is an interesting piece. Hickey. MIN 1st in 2017.

If they don't want to give up either soon to be or already young NHL pieces then the package has to be substantial futures. ARI 1st 2018 is another intriguing piece

 

[NYRSchrute217]

Absolutely would consider a 2018 1st as opposed to this year's 7th overall.

Would be fun to have a team to scoreboard watch in addition to rooting for the Rangers.

It may be best case scenario for the Rangers and easier to swallow for AZ.

 

[Mac n Gs]

A week ago Arizona fans thought they were going to steal Stepan because the Rangers were going to trade him there with Girardi. They thought he was a good option for exactly what most of us thing he'd bring to the table. Now that the Girardi thing has been debunked, it's all "he can't win faceoffs" and "we'll just keep rebuilding because Stepan sucks."

A smart GM knows he can't ice a roster full of kids. They need veterans to insulate them and mentor them. Chayka said exactly that on his conference call the other day. He said he wants a center. He wants to add right-handed shots. He cleared cap with Smith which was a deal that "wasn't made in isolation." All signs point to him being very, very interested in getting him, and there's no incentive for Gorton to end up with Hayes as his 2nd line center unless he's getting premium pieces back for Stepan.

They HAVE to add cap. They're not going to attract free agents that deserve that kind of money, and their owner isn't going to let them waste his money on players just to get to the cap floor. If they don't get Stepan, what are their options? Throw $8M a year at Hanzal? Throw stupid money at Nick Bonino?

Beggars can't be choosers. What other team is floating a top-six center with term that'd be willing to take futures at center in return?

Stop being so rationale and using your prior experience from watching how the business of hockey has worked over the years. Gosh.

Don't you know potential is always greater than proven talent. You have some nerve, ya know that?

 

[eco's bones]

so Brooks says the Rangers would only consider Shattenkirk on a higher AAV at a greatly reduced term (2 to 3 years)?... I don't get this franchise at all..

I'd give him more for a shorter term too. I don't know if we would like very much at all a Shattenkirk contract 6-7 years from now.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

I can see AV if we get Shatt or Trouba/Faulk/etc/etc..

Mcdonagh-Staal
Holden - Shatt/Trouba/Faulk/etc
Skjei - whoever..

God help me.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

I'd give him more for a shorter term too. I don't know if we would like very much at all a Shattenkirk contract 6-7 years from now.

yeah, but 2 to 3 years is absurd.. 5 maybe.. at a higher AAV.

 

[Savant]

It's not. You would be better off asking for 7+other things.

Sure it is. Gorton isn't going to waste his time if that's not the case. He isn't going to take a poo-poo platter. Maybe Tippett doesn't like Strome and wants to get a cost controlled too six center and get the risk elsewhere. There is certainly a fair deal to be made.

 

[Mac n Gs]

Vegas adding some JAM?

 

[XX]

Just because we are discussing deals without Strome, Chychrun, Domi or Dvorak doesn't mean there isn't a package that would interest Gorton.

Fischer is an interesting piece. Hickey. MIN 1st in 2017.

If they don't want to give up either soon to be or already young NHL pieces then the package has to be substantial futures. ARI 1st 2018 is another intriguing piece

I think the team would be more inclined to move Perlini or Duclair over Fischer, given that RHS is a huge need. There's also multiple later picks, Murphy, DeAngelo, Merkley, Dineen, Wood, useful roster players like Martinook and Rieder, future picks.

Hickey's rights were acquired for the Rangers, I feel. I think the Rangers could get a really damn good aggregate value package but not one that includes one of the absolute core young players. Crouse/Perlini/Duclair is probably as high as AZ would go.

 

[NYR Viper]

I am starting to wonder if Gorton and Chayka have a couple of deals in place already as option A and Option B. If Lindberg is taken, Gorton leans toward the package with the center. If he isn't, he may lean towards the winger. I'm not saying the rest of those packages are identical but wouldn't that be intriguing? Hickey may have been acquired as an added piece for this specific deal as ARI may not have a defensive prospect that truly interested Greeley and Gorton.

Say one deal is centered around Domi. The other maybe Strome?

It seems like Chayka's comments hinted at specifically Stepan. There aren't any other RH centers available and he was shy about discussing that the Smith deal wasn't made in a vacuum. He also acquired a junior defenseman who has shown a possible unwillingness to sign with his hometown team. Does he think he has a better shot getting a young Canadian kid to sign in Arizona rather than going UFA? That's real odd.

If Chayka was playing the game wouldn't you think he would have been more vague in his interview? Or acquired another player in lieu of Hickey.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Duclair doesn't even have a spot unless we trade a winger. I would happily take him back.

 

[Savant]

I am starting to wonder if Gorton and Chayka have a couple of deals in place already as option A and Option B. If Lindberg is taken, Gorton leans toward the package with the center. If he isn't, he may lean towards the winger. I'm not saying the rest of those packages are identical but wouldn't that be intriguing? Hickey may have been acquired as an added piece for this specific deal as ARI may not have a defensive prospect that truly interested Greeley and Gorton.

Say one deal is centered around Domi. The other maybe Strome?

It seems like Chayka's comments hinted at specifically Stepan. There aren't any other RH centers available and he was shy about discussing that the Smith deal wasn't made in a vacuum. He also acquired a junior defenseman who has shown a possible unwillingness to sign with his hometown team. Does he think he has a better shot getting a young Canadian kid to sign in Arizona rather than going UFA? That's real odd.

If Chayka was playing the game wouldn't you think he would have been more vague in his interview? Or acquired another player in lieu of Hickey.

I think Strome is the logical target here. He seems the odd man out, his fault or not. Especially if Tippett isn't a fan.

 

[DutchShamrock]

Duclair is the best player Arizona will part with for Stepan? I wouldnt trade Hayes for duclair, and i don't like Hayes. How about stepan for duclair and a giant billboard thanking the coyotes of relieving us of such a burden?

Just because Arizona is averse to top line players doesn't mean they don't have value.

 

[Savant]

Duclair doesn't even have a spot unless we trade a winger. I would happily take him back.

Yuck.

 

[Alluckks]

Hilarious that AZ fans are hell-bent on the concept that they wouldn't even do Strome or Dvorak 1 for 1 in a Stepan trade.

I hope we trade with AZ just to see their great reactions.

 

[Alluckks]

AZ needs to start winning and contend for a playoff spot for more than the first 10 games of the season or that team will be out of the state even sooner than already anticipated.

 

[NYR Viper]

I think the team would be more inclined to move Perlini or Duclair over Fischer, given that RHS is a huge need. There's also multiple later picks, Murphy, DeAngelo, Merkley, Dineen, Wood, useful roster players like Martinook and Rieder, future picks.

Hickey's rights were acquired for the Rangers, I feel. I think the Rangers could get a really damn good aggregate value package but not one that includes one of the absolute core young players. Crouse/Perlini/Duclair is probably as high as AZ would go.

I hear what you're saying but you must know that trading for a player like Stepan is going to hurt a little. In the same way losing Stepan is going to hurt the Rangers. Both sides rearrange their chairs.

I am thinking Arizona management has possibly soured on someone in that group you listed even if just a little bit and are looking to get a longer term asset in Stepan to help augment their young players.

Unlike many here I don't think Arizona is that far off from making the playoffs. They need a goalie, that's obvious. They have some intriguing pieces but they are lacking any sort of player outside of OEL who can lead and help a team get through a struggling time. Stepan would be a real solid addition.

They probably need another defenseman but adding a good 2-way center can help mask that deficiency. Just look at the Rangers for most of this season. It also allows for the young wings to play a comfortable offensive game knowing they are covered. There's a lot to be said about that.

 

[Mac n Gs]

I think the team would be more inclined to move Perlini or Duclair over Fischer, given that RHS is a huge need. There's also multiple later picks, Murphy, DeAngelo, Merkley, Dineen, Wood, useful roster players like Martinook and Rieder, future picks.

Hickey's rights were acquired for the Rangers, I feel. I think the Rangers could get a really damn good aggregate value package but not one that includes one of the absolute core young players. Crouse/Perlini/Duclair is probably as high as AZ would go.

So quantity for quality? Nah.

Look into Stepan's body of work for his career. You can keep overlooking proven vs unproven NHL talent, but you'd be getting a goddamn good center. Always consistent in having ridiculous impacts on goals for and against, plays all situations, draws top competition, proven leader and playoff performer and is reliable. He'd score more if AV didn't spread out his ice time like crazy and he's shown to play well with multiple different linemates.

Remember, we don't have to trade Stepan. He's still insanely valuable to the Rangers, but Gorton wants to turn over the core and bring in something new. If you asked me, I'd be shipping Hayes off to the moon and riding with Stepan and Mika down the middle for the next 4 years without even blinking. Think about the long-term consequences and adding veterans to help the kids learn to win. Don't become the pre-McDavid Oilers because I honestly want to see your group of kids succeed.

 

[Krams]

I think the team would be more inclined to move Perlini or Duclair over Fischer, given that RHS is a huge need. There's also multiple later picks, Murphy, DeAngelo, Merkley, Dineen, Wood, useful roster players like Martinook and Rieder, future picks.

Hickey's rights were acquired for the Rangers, I feel. I think the Rangers could get a really damn good aggregate value package but not one that includes one of the absolute core young players. Crouse/Perlini/Duclair is probably as high as AZ would go.

Then you can forget about Stepan and enjoy swimming in mediocrity until your team is moved to Quebec.

 

[DutchShamrock]

I am starting to wonder if Gorton and Chayka have a couple of deals in place already as option A and Option B. If Lindberg is taken, Gorton leans toward the package with the center. If he isn't, he may lean towards the winger. I'm not saying the rest of those packages are identical but wouldn't that be intriguing? Hickey may have been acquired as an added piece for this specific deal as ARI may not have a defensive prospect that truly interested Greeley and Gorton.

Say one deal is centered around Domi. The other maybe Strome?

It seems like Chayka's comments hinted at specifically Stepan. There aren't any other RH centers available and he was shy about discussing that the Smith deal wasn't made in a vacuum. He also acquired a junior defenseman who has shown a possible unwillingness to sign with his hometown team. Does he think he has a better shot getting a young Canadian kid to sign in Arizona rather than going UFA? That's real odd.

If Chayka was playing the game wouldn't you think he would have been more vague in his interview? Or acquired another player in lieu of Hickey.

I had a similar thought yesterday. First, domi is the player I want the most and think is the absolute last player chayka parts with. Second, I say you target the main piece regardless of the Vegas pick. The only thing we should be even entertaining is another center.

One guy I look at if lindberg is selected is Peter Holland.

So future top 6 center, Holland, 23rd OA? Include Raanta and we get hickey?

 

[SA16]

I still don't understand why fans of other teams insist on coming in here to post but whatever...

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I think the team would be more inclined to move Perlini or Duclair over Fischer, given that RHS is a huge need. There's also multiple later picks, Murphy, DeAngelo, Merkley, Dineen, Wood, useful roster players like Martinook and Rieder, future picks.

Hickey's rights were acquired for the Rangers, I feel. I think the Rangers could get a really damn good aggregate value package but not one that includes one of the absolute core young players. Crouse/Perlini/Duclair is probably as high as AZ would go.

I will say this as kindly as i possibly can.

You're delusional if you think that even comes close and that is a good aggregate package.

Arizona will have to give up at least 2 pieces that they really don't want to give up, probably 3. The Rangers are not going to trade their most consistent forward for a bunch secondary and tertiary pieces.