Post-Game Talk: Rangers vs. Red Wings | 3/19/19 - 7PM - MSG

[PuckLuck3043]

I always feel like a heel pushing back on the more optimistic projections for this team’s turnaround. Even if I truly believe what I am saying is logical and based on experience, it’s still not something that brings joy.

The reality is that rebuilding isn’t pleasant. You hope the outcome is, but the journey to get there is filled with a lot of lows.

That's why we have never entered into a full balls to the wall rebuild and why Gorton had to send out the letter last year. It's painful but I expect us to come out the other side a real contender.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Aside from Hank, the last superstar in his prime here was who, Leetch.

Of course we had Gretzky for 3 years and he was amazing that first year but his back was like a slinky and he was deteriorating. Messier too but we mostly had him on his back 9, which is actually funny to look back on people thought Messier was done when we traded for him and he won the Hart in 1991, oops. Still maybe Messier counts?

Who was the last in his prime bonafide star forward we had? Aside from Messier, I don't even know. Gilbert? Ratelle?


Mr. Bettman, please give us the first or second pick. I promise I personally won't boo you anymore if you do.

Jagr

 

[JHS]

I know this is uncharted territory for the Rangers, but someone who has watched hockey for 30 years should know how a rebuild works.

Of course it looks like they're trying to build with highly flawed pieces, these aren't the guys who were expected to lead them into the next era. Those guys have yet to be selected or aren't on the roster yet.

So again, how long?? Please someone tell me—- no one can give an answer to that question because no one knows! My entire point is rebuilds are terrible to go through and almost never work out as planned. I keep reading how much a top 5 pick would help this team. I agree but has anyone considered that this top 5 pick could be a bust?!? It happens! So what then? Another several years of being awful just to maybe have another shot at a top 5 player?!?

I’ve been against the rebuild from the start and my position remains the same. I’ll get behind a rebuild but the front office better get something on this team to get behind. This current roster is a joke!

 

[will1066]

Aside from Hank, the last superstar in his prime here was who, Leetch.

Of course we had Gretzky for 3 years and he was amazing that first year but his back was like a slinky and he was deteriorating. Messier too but we mostly had him on his back 9, which is actually funny to look back on people thought Messier was done when we traded for him and he won the Hart in 1991, oops. Still maybe Messier counts?

Who was the last in his prime bonafide star forward we had? Aside from Messier, I don't even know. Gilbert? Ratelle?


Mr. Bettman, please give us the first or second pick. I promise I personally won't boo you anymore if you do.

I want to say Gaborik. Jagr had a few good years here too. Both were legit threats in the eyes of other teams. But then Jagr is a freak who lived an unnaturally long hockey life, to paraphrase Lord of the Rings.

 

[FireGerardGallant]

I get that but Rome was also not made of bricks that are cracked and filled with holes. Please, this is pathetic. This team is devoid of anything to even build around. Mika and maybe Kreider. Literally what else?!?

I’m reading now that guys on here don’t even want Panaran because he might lead to more wins next year?!?! Please,if Gorton has the chance and does not sign him, I’m at a loss. When can the Rangers start getting good again? How much longer does the fan base have to root for loses? It’s horrible— are we going to get another’s letter from the Front Office saying “ok Ranger fans we are now going to sign good players and you can now root for wins again.”

I’ve been a fan of this team for 30 years— Since I knew what hockey was. Rooting for the Rangers to lose is awful and counter to everything I want to do. I get why logically it makes sense but I just want to have some sense that the building is occurring with pieces that won’t fall down. Right now, the Rangers look to be trying to build with highly flawed pieces.

Again rebuilds take a while, this is going to be a process and you need to have some patience. You're writing off guys like Chytil but they're still developing. Also, signing Panarian would be a mistake because hes not worth the money hes going to get and he isn't going to make us a playoff team next year, just ruin our chances of drafting where we have to

 

[DanielBrassard]

I want to say Gaborik. Jagr had a few good years here too. Both were legit threats in the eyes of other teams.

Gaborik, Nash, Jagr were all stars. Nash and Gaborik in their 1st seasons were insanely good. But they never reached that level again unfortunately.

 

[FireGerardGallant]

I know this is uncharted territory for the Rangers, but someone who has watched hockey for 30 years should know how a rebuild works.

Of course it looks like they're trying to build with highly flawed pieces, these aren't the guys who were expected to lead them into the next era. Those guys have yet to be selected or aren't on the roster yet.

When this team is good again there will maybe be 8/9 guys on this current team that will be playing for them

 

[PuckLuck3043]

Makes sense, I just don’t see enough free agent talent to be anything better than a lousy playoff team. Which is what we’ve been for the better part of 80 years.

Lousy playoff teams don't go to 3 conference finals in 4 years which included 1 SCF and 20 minutes away from another 1 the following year.

 

[Harbour Dog]

True, but when was the last time we were Ottawa bad?

The optics with this team are really rough. Theres optimism to be had since it's to be expected and they may land the young elite talent(s) they've lacked for a long time, but its a tough sell when there will be other teams and locations which will be just as attractive and can offer a better chance to win right away.

I said it in another thread, but watch out for Philly here. They have a **** ton of cap space.

Yeah, granted, we haven't been close to this bad in my lifetime. The Dark Ages felt so much worse just because it was clear we had no direction, but at the same time, we could simply outspend most teams then.

I could be overestimating the pull of NYC a bit, but I always find myself looking in that area for where Panarin will end up. And of us, Jersey and the Islanders; I think the choice has to be us.

Philly makes a lot of sense though. I'm sure they'd pay as much as anybody to get him too.

 

[JHS]

Again rebuilds take a while, this is going to be a process and you need to have some patience. You're writing off guys like Chytil but they're still developing. Also, signing Panarian would be a mistake because hes not worth the money hes going to get and he isn't going to make us a playoff team next year, just ruin our chances of drafting where we have to

The Rangers may need to sign a guy like Panarian just to make the NHL salary floor next year based on the trash heap it looks like they will have! I’m just beyond frustrated with this idea that the NHL roster has to be a complete dumpster fire for years to come so the Rangers can stock pile assets. Also, lots of you are totally ignoring the fact that these assets currently have no place to develop within the organization because of the absolute train wreck Hartford is and with the Rangers being absolutely horrendous, that’s not exactly an environment to develop in. As said in my first post tonight, this team is miles away from being good but let’s at least get the car moving in the direction of being good again. Right now it looks like everyone wants the car to be heading in the direction of horrible!

I’m not writing guys like Chytil off. He’s looked ok at times this season and probably has the highest upside potential for any forward aside from Mika currently on the roster. I’m interested to see him develop.

 

[Gresch04]

I want to say Gaborik. Jagr had a few good years here too. Both were legit threats in the eyes of other teams. But then Jagr is a freak who lived an unnaturally long hockey life, to paraphrase Lord of the Rings.

Jagr has the single season points and goals record for a Ranger in the same year. He was incredible here.

 

[Ori]

This team need some years in a rebuild mode so important to collect future draft picks and 2020 draft year is going to be a really strong draft too, and it looks like we are bottom #3 next season so 27 years old Panarin will not sign here guys and his window don`t fit at all.

Larry Brooks talk about Kreider in his latest article about his hamstring injury. Well I actually hope he could reach 30 goals, but we won`t compete in his prime years since we need to rebuild our blueline when Marc Staal is gone - so in that reguard it make no sense to extend Kreiders contract from that perspective.
I defended Kreider on the hit on Elias earlier and like him as player too - my reasoning is only based on the rebuild direction and the age reasoning with him.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Yeah, granted, we haven't been close to this bad in my lifetime. The Dark Ages felt so much worse just because it was clear we had no direction, but at the same time, we could simply outspend most teams then.

I could be overestimating the pull of NYC a bit, but I always find myself looking in that area for where Panarin will end up. And of us, Jersey and the Islanders; I think the choice has to be us.

Philly makes a lot of sense though. I'm sure they'd pay as much as anybody to get him too.

He said he wants to be on the coast, that can be east or west.

LA will be in on him but they're way more f***ed than we are. Both in the short and long term.

I look at the Panthers and Flyers are the favorites.

 

[Metranger]

The Rangers may need to sign a guy like Panarian just to make the NHL salary floor next year based on the trash heap it looks like they will have! I’m just beyond frustrated with this idea that the NHL roster has to be a complete dumpster fire for years to come so the Rangers can stock pile assets. Also, lots of you are totally ignoring the fact that these assets currently have no place to develop within the organization because of the absolute train wreck Hartford is and with the Rangers being absolutely horrendous, that’s not exactly an environment to develop in. As said in my first post tonight, this team is miles away from being good but let’s at least get the car moving in the direction of being good again. Right now it looks like everyone wants the car to be heading in the direction of horrible!

I’m not writing guys like Chytil off. He’s looked ok at times this season and probably has the highest upside potential for any forward aside from Mica currently on the roster. I’m interested to see him develop.

He made a really sweet deke move coming down the left side moving the puck left and right with a defensemen trying to pivot with the puck. Then he got a nice shot off...There aren't many on this team that can do that.
He's a keeper.

 

[Gresch04]

Lousy playoff teams don't go to 3 conference finals in 4 years which included 1 SCF and 20 minutes away from another 1 the following year.

“Better part” of 80 years. I’ve been watching since 1979 so it’s been 1 amazing year, 5-6 great years and 33 “kill me now why am I a fan?” years. I should have said “vast majority”.

 

[Metranger]

Oh, and I'd definitely trade Krieder at the draft. No doubt.

 

[FireGerardGallant]

The Rangers may need to sign a guy like Panarian just to make the NHL salary floor next year based on the trash heap it looks like they will have! I’m just beyond frustrated with this idea that the NHL roster has to be a complete dumpster fire for years to come so the Rangers can stock pile assets.

The Rangers don't need to worry about hitting the cap-floor and signing a player to 8-11 million a year would be an inefficient way to deal with that issue. Also I guess you dont understand how a rebuild works? You are bad so you can get good again. Retools on the fly don't work ask Vancouver

Also, lots of you are totally ignoring the fact that these assets currently have no place to develop within the organization because of the absolute train wreck Hartford is and with the Rangers being absolutely horrendous, that’s not exactly an environment to develop in.

This is 100% true and is an issue that must be solved this summer.

As said in my first post tonight, this team is miles away from being good but let’s at least get the car moving in the direction of being good again. Right now it looks like everyone wants the car to be heading in the direction of horrible!

In order to get the car heading in the right direction, we need to be bad for a few years. Being mediocre doesn't help us be relevant again. That's just how rebuilding works

I’m not writing guys like Chytil off. He’s looked ok at times this season and probably has the highest upside potential for any forward aside from Mika currently on the roster. I’m interested to see him develop

First its Mika, also you said we have no one to build around besides him I kinda consider that writing Chytil off who will be a large part of teams in the future

 

[NYR94]

Gaborik was in his prime. Scored 40 goals twice and averaged about 70 something points per 82 games as a Ranger. Great sniper. I've never seen a Ranger get rid of the puck so quickly if he had it in a good scoring position. Dude was incredible.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

The first half of Gaboriks inaugural season here was Hart worthy.

Straight fire.

 

[DaBadGuy7]

Lousy playoff teams don't go to 3 conference finals in 4 years which included 1 SCF and 20 minutes away from another 1 the following year.

Lousy is a bad way to describe those teams, I would take very good team without an truly elite player(s) to carry them when games got very tight. That’s why many here such as myself want them to tank, probably the best chance since drafting Leetch of drafting and developing an elite player. Besides Jagr and Gaborik, trading and/or acquiring players through FA to get the Rangers far hasn’t helped.

 

[Fitzy]

The first half of Gaboriks inaugural season here was Hart worthy.

Straight fire.

He and Del Zotto were a two man wrecking crew in the fall.

 

[JHS]

The Rangers don't need to worry about hitting the cap-floor and signing a player to 8-11 million a year would be an inefficient way to deal with that issue. Also I guess you dont understand how a rebuild works? You are bad so you can get good again. Retools on the fly don't work ask Vancouver

This is 100% true and is an issue that must be solved this summer.

In order to get the car heading in the right direction, we need to be bad for a few years. Being mediocre doesn't help us be relevant again. That's just how rebuilding works

First its Mika, also you said we have no one to build around besides him I kinda consider that writing Chytil off who will be a large part of teams in the future

Chytil is a solid piece to team but not someone to build around. You guys all use the same line “you don’t know how a rebuild works.” Please, it’s obvious how they work so just stop. It’s also obvious how lots of teams try rebuilds and fail at them year after year after year. See Phoenix, Buffalo, Edmonton, Florida, just to name a few. What’s the common thread here— all these teams sold their fans on a rebuild and are still trying to figure it out. Also, all these teams rushed players to the NHL. Also, all these teams had very little organizational depth when it comes to talent before starting their rebuilds. Any of that sound familiar?!!?

Now, I’d rather follow the Toronto method. First, hire a great front office and NHL level coach( I like Quinn but he’s a stop gap guy.). Second, get elite talent by drafting generational talent( the absolute hardest and most luck dependent aspect.) The other part Toronto did very well was they kept a core of their young talent in the minors and allowed them to develop. That’s key.

Again, I’m rooting for this to work out- even though I’m avainst the rebuild. This front office has had one and a half seasons to get this going. I think the house is pretty much gutted. The dismantling is pretty over. I hope they start building with quality material.

 

[FireGerardGallant]

Chytil is a solid piece to team but not someone to build around. You guys all use the same line “you don’t know how a rebuild works.” Please, it’s obvious how they work so just stop. It’s also obvious how lots of teams try rebuilds and fail at them year after year after year. See Phoenix, Buffalo, Edmonton, Florida, just to name a few. What’s the common thread here— all these teams sold their fans on a rebuild and are still trying to figure it out. Also, all these teams rushed players to the NHL. Also, all these teams had very little organizational depth when it comes to talent before starting their rebuilds. Any of that sound familiar?!!?

Now, I’d rather follow the Toronto method. First, hire a great front office and NHL level coach( I like Quinn but he’s a stop gap guy.). Second, get elite talent by drafting generational talent( the absolute hardest and most luck dependent aspect.) The other part Toronto did very well was they kept a core of their young talent in the minors and allowed them to develop. That’s key.

Again, I’m rooting for this to work out- even though I’m against the rebuild. This front office has had one and a half seasons to get this going. I think the house is pretty much gutted. The dismantling is pretty over. I hope they start building with quality material.

If you want to follow the Toronto method (which we are) you should go take a quick look at their roster in 2015-2016. You want to bring this team in the opposite direction by signing Panarian. How do you think you get generational talent? By being a playoff bubble then winning the draft lottery with your 1% chance of a top 3 pick? You have to suck for a few years to do this right

 

[Edge]

Gaborik, Nash, Jagr were all stars. Nash and Gaborik in their 1st seasons were insanely good. But they never reached that level again unfortunately.

It always seemed like we got guys who were able to give us a few years off the back end of the peak, before they steadily declined.

Even guys like Jagr, Gaborik and Nash essentially had their 2-3 years.

It would be nice to see a guy steadily climb to that level and maintain it for 5, 6, 7 years, etc.

 

[bl02]

If any franchise is due, it’s the Rangers. Screwed over be early nhl territory draft rules.

Then in the modern draft we’ve never had a number one pick, never even picked higher than 4th overall.

Pittsburg got Crosby and Malkin in back to back years while Mario Lemieux was still on the team. Edmonton had 1st overall picks 4 times in 6 years. And that’s after having the best player of all time already play for them. Wild.

We’ve been carried as a franchise, the most valuable in the NHL, for the last 15 years squarely on the back of a guy picked at 205th overall as an afterthought.

Looking like our luck had turned eight our 2007 first round pick we had a potential star player on our hands and then he tragically died while playing in Russia.

The two times in recent years our past GMs tried to tear it done and rebuild through the draft (Smith in 99 and. Sather in 04) the 99 draft was one of the worst of that time, getting us Brendl and Lundmark with 4th and 9th overall picks. Any other year we could’ve ended up with stars there.

In the Crosby lottery we were bottom 3 in the league and had the tied for most chances at winning that lottery and then ended up falling to 13th overall. How that was even possible by the rules still baffles me.

We’re due.

Yeah baffling for sure but looking back at that draft believe it or not Staal was probably the second best player drafted between 2-12 (not counting goaltenders). Kopitar being the other who was taken at 11. And Oshie was taken at 24. I can't believe Oshie and Staal have been in the league for the same amount of time lol. f***ing penguins totally lucked out. That first round was pretty shitty besides Crosby and Kopitar.