Post-Game Talk: Rangers vs. Red Wings | 3/19/19 - 7PM - MSG

[Machinehead]

While going through hell doesn’t guarantee a championship, it’s rare that you can point to a championship team whose road didn’t cut right through those lands.

At least Hell is warm

 

[Gresch04]

I always feel like a heel pushing back on the more optimistic projections for this team’s turnaround. Even if I truly believe what I am saying is logical and based on experience, it’s still not something that brings joy.

The reality is that rebuilding isn’t pleasant. You hope the outcome is, but the journey to get there is filled with a lot of lows.

Add to that the fact that most “great” plans don’t turn out anywhere near as expected.

Successful teams and companies pretend it was all planned but luck plays as big a role in success as anything else. They use narrative fallacy to take credit for it later when telling the “story” in their ESPN 30 for 30.

Belichick’s talent is seeing the nuanced potential of a player and maximizing it better than most and being the best defensive strategist to ever live. Yet he still didn’t actually KNOW Brady was Brady. He only played him when Bledsoe got hurt. So luck was on his side.

 

[FireGerardGallant]

This team is just awful. I went to the game tonight and it’s impossible to root for many of these guys. Ryan Strome consistently plays hard, Buch was better than average but the majority of the guys just stand out for being bad. The amount of poor passes, bone headed plays, lack of drive, lack of aggression is really alarming. I get that this is a long season and guys like Mika and Kreider get a pass for looking disengaged, but I expect a lot more from the rookies and, simply put— none show anything that set them a part. Lias is performing magician level disappearing acts, the defense is atrocious- not a single player worth keeping and aside from Mika, Kreider, Buch and Strome, essentially none of the forwards are playing even close enough to justify a guaranteed spot on the roster next year. Chytil might be the next closest.

This team is miles, like a flight to Japan, away from even being anywhere near playoff bound!

Rome wasnt built in one day

 

[will1066]

Add to that the fact that most “great” plans don’t turn out anywhere near as expected.

Successful teams and companies pretend it was all planned but luck plays as big a role in success as anything else. They use narrative fallacy to take credit for it later when telling the “story” in their ESPN 30 for 30.

Belichick’s talent is seeing the nuanced potential of a player and maximizing it better than most and being the best defensive strategist to ever live. Yet he still didn’t actually KNOW Brady was Brady. He only played him when Bledsoe got hurt. So luck was on his side.

Good post

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

You know what, if we use that high pick to get a guy that completely changes our franchise, everyone here on this forum has ****ing earned it. I'm proud of this group.

If any franchise is due, it’s the Rangers. Screwed over be early nhl territory draft rules.

Then in the modern draft we’ve never had a number one pick, never even picked higher than 4th overall.

Pittsburg got Crosby and Malkin in back to back years while Mario Lemieux was still on the team. Edmonton had 1st overall picks 4 times in 6 years. And that’s after having the best player of all time already play for them. Wild.

We’ve been carried as a franchise, the most valuable in the NHL, for the last 15 years squarely on the back of a guy picked at 205th overall as an afterthought.

Looking like our luck had turned eight our 2007 first round pick we had a potential star player on our hands and then he tragically died while playing in Russia.

The two times in recent years our past GMs tried to tear it done and rebuild through the draft (Smith in 99 and. Sather in 04) the 99 draft was one of the worst of that time, getting us Brendl and Lundmark with 4th and 9th overall picks. Any other year we could’ve ended up with stars there.

In the Crosby lottery we were bottom 3 in the league and had the tied for most chances at winning that lottery and then ended up falling to 13th overall. How that was even possible by the rules still baffles me.

We’re due.

 

[Gresch04]

Yeah I mean on paper it makes sense, I just feel like next year is the year Gorton in for the upswing to start. I really can’t see him wanting to bottom out and sell and be garbage for 3 straight seasons. Even if we ended up with the top lottery chances I just have a hard time believing that would be his plan after already selling almost every good player and trying to suck for two straight years already. I guess we’ll see.

Makes sense, I just don’t see enough free agent talent to be anything better than a lousy playoff team. Which is what we’ve been for the better part of 80 years.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Yeah I mean on paper it makes sense, I just feel like next year is the year Gorton in for the upswing to start. I really can’t see him wanting to bottom out and sell and be garbage for 3 straight seasons. Even if we ended up with the top lottery chances I just have a hard time believing that would be his plan after already selling almost every good player and trying to suck for two straight years already. I guess we’ll see.

Actually I think it makes more sense and its more likely for them to wait it out...

They could have dismantled this team guns blazing last year but didn't. If there is one thing that JG has done, hes stripped things down iteratively and they've gotten to where they are organically, sort of.

Half of the board thought this team would contend for the playoffs before the season started, or at least ended up on the bubble. if you're looking at a team that is actually garbage, next year would really be the only year where they'd be on that level, unless you count right now. They could have pushed for the playoffs last year but were smart enough not to, they've been pretty f***ing bad for most of this year but not bad enough.

If you take a look at the Leafs model, they're pretty much doing what they were doing. It'd be a shame if they hit the Panic button a year too soon.

 

[Machinehead]

If any franchise is due, it’s the Rangers. Screwed over be early nhl territory draft rules.

Then in the modern draft we’ve never had a number one pick, never even picked higher than 4th overall.

Pittsburg got Crosby and Malkin in back to back years while Mario Lemieux was still on the team. Edmonton had 1st overall picks 4 times in 6 years. And that’s after having the best player of all time already play for them. Wild.

We’ve been carried as a franchise, the most valuable in the NHL, for the last 15 years squarely on the back of a guy picked at 205th overall as an afterthought.

Looking like our luck had turned eight our 2007 first round pick we had a potential star player on our hands and then he tragically died while playing in Russia.

The two times in recent years our past GMs tried to tear it done and rebuild through the draft (Smith in 99 and. Sather in 04) the 99 draft was one of the worst of that time, getting us Brendl and Lundmark with 4th and 9th overall picks. Any other year we could’ve ended up with stars there.

In the Crosby lottery we were bottom 3 in the league and had the tied for most chances at winning that lottery and then ended up falling to 13th overall. How that was even possible by the rules still baffles me.

We’re due.

10/10 post.

Frankly, the whole hockey world is due. A superstar on the Rangers. It's been a minute.

 

[Metranger]

It's weird to root for the Ranger's to lose.
Kinda like smelling your finger:

 

[Machinehead]

I don't think it's only smoke that Panarin's girlfriend wants us on his shortlist. Terrible or not, if Gorton wants to sign him, I believe that we'll be in the running.

She wants us on the shortlist because she could crack the lineup the way we're going.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

Makes sense, I just don’t see enough free agent talent to be anything better than a lousy playoff team. Which is what we’ve been for the better part of 80 years.

Yeah, it wouldn't surprise me if Gorton used some of his assets to swing a big trade for a young potential future star like Mika was. Maybe identify a team that's going to be up against the cap and can move a potential difference maker in the future. Who knows. I don't know what deals like that will be out there, I just think Gorton will be looking at possibilities along those lines along with maybe bringing in Panarin.

Who really knows. Gorton could swing a few trades and that's it, sign Free Agents and that's it or the free agents want too much and Gorton balks (rightfully) at any crazy contracts, and no other GMs wanna make any deals and he could run it back with a very similar group next year. We never know.

 

[JHS]

Rome wasnt built in one day

I get that but Rome was also not made of bricks that are cracked and filled with holes. Please, this is pathetic. This team is devoid of anything to even build around. Mica and maybe Kreider. Literally what else?!?

I’m reading now that guys on here don’t even want Panaran because he might lead to more wins next year?!?! Please,if Gorton has the chance and does not sign him, I’m at a loss. When can the Rangers start getting good again? How much longer does the fan base have to root for loses? It’s horrible— are we going to get another’s letter from the Front Office saying “ok Ranger fans we are now going to sign good players and you can now root for wins again.”

I’ve been a fan of this team for 30 years— Since I knew what hockey was. Rooting for the Rangers to lose is awful and counter to everything I want to do. I get why logically it makes sense but I just want to have some sense that the building is occurring with pieces that won’t fall down. Right now, the Rangers look to be trying to build with highly flawed pieces.

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

Looking at the names we picked ahead of Henrik in that draft, let alone anyone else. "Sven Helfenstein." "Brandon Snee!"

 

[Alluckks]

View attachment 202111

That horse has an illness

 

[Harbour Dog]

Yeah but there will be other teams on that list who are not Ottawa bad.

For sure.

But we've never had even a remote amount of trouble attracting big name free agents; not sure why Panarin is that much more farfetched (so hard not to write Farfetch'd) then any other random superstar who likes getting paid and living in NYC.

 

[Harbour Dog]

She wants us on the shortlist because she could crack the lineup the way we're going.

This is ridiculous.




She'd obviously have to start out in Hartford.

 

[will1066]

10/10 post.

Frankly, the whole hockey world is due. A homegrown superstar on the Rangers. It's been a minute.

Fixed

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I know this is uncharted territory for the Rangers, but someone who has watched hockey for 30 years should know how a rebuild works.

Of course it looks like they're trying to build with highly flawed pieces, these aren't the guys who were expected to lead them into the next era. Those guys have yet to be selected or aren't on the roster yet.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

10/10 post.

Frankly, the whole hockey world is due. A superstar on the Rangers. It's been a minute.

Aside from Hank, the last superstar in his prime here was who, Leetch.

Of course we had Gretzky for 3 years and he was amazing that first year but his back was like a slinky and he was deteriorating. Messier too but we mostly had him on his back 9, which is actually funny to look back on people thought Messier was done when we traded for him and he won the Hart in 1991, oops. Still maybe Messier counts?

Who was the last in his prime bonafide star forward we had? Aside from Messier, I don't even know. Gilbert? Ratelle?


Mr. Bettman, please give us the first or second pick. I promise I personally won't boo you anymore if you do.

 

[will1066]

I know this is uncharted territory for the Rangers, but someone who has watched hockey for 30 years should know how a rebuild works.

Of course it looks like they're trying to build with highly flawed pieces, these aren't the guys who were expected to lead them into the next era. Those guys have yet to be selected or aren't on the roster yet.

I do think a few of these guys will be the secondary layer for the Millers and the Kravtsovs.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

For sure.

But we've never had even a remote amount of trouble attracting big name free agents; not sure why Panarin is that much more farfetched (so hard not to write Farfetch'd) then any other random superstar who likes getting paid and living in NYC.

True, but when was the last time we were Ottawa bad?

The optics with this team are really rough. Theres optimism to be had since it's to be expected and they may land the young elite talent(s) they've lacked for a long time, but its a tough sell when there will be other teams and locations which will be just as attractive and can offer a better chance to win right away.

I said it in another thread, but watch out for Philly here. They have a shit ton of cap space.

 

[Machinehead]

Aside from Hank, the last superstar in his prime here was who, Leetch.

Of course we had Gretzky for 3 years and he was amazing that first year but his back was like a slinky and he was deteriorating. Messier too but we mostly had him on his back 9, which is actually funny to look back on people thought Messier was done when we traded for him and he won the Hart in 1991, oops. Still maybe Messier counts?

Who was the last in his prime bonafide star forward we had? Aside from Messier, I don't even know. Gilbert? Ratelle?


Mr. Bettman, please give us the first or second pick. I promise I personally won't boo you anymore if you do.

Those aren't boos, Gary, those are Hughes.

 

[Rangerfans]

I get that but Rome was also not made of bricks that are cracked and filled with holes. Please, this is pathetic. This team is devoid of anything to even build around. Mica and maybe Kreider. Literally what else?!?

I’m reading now that guys on here don’t even want Panaran because he might lead to more wins next year?!?! Please,if Gorton has the chance and does not sign him, I’m at a loss. When can the Rangers start getting good again? How much longer does the fan base have to root for loses? It’s horrible— are we going to get another’s letter from the Front Office saying “ok Ranger fans we are now going to sign good players and you can now root for wins again.”

I’ve been a fan of this team for 30 years— Since I knew what hockey was. Rooting for the Rangers to lose is awful and counter to everything I want to do. I get why logically it makes sense but I just want to have some sense that the building is occurring with pieces that won’t fall down. Right now, the Rangers look to be trying to build with highly flawed pieces.

I’m all for Panarin, but this is literally only the second season we haven’t been in the playoffs. Or year 1 still since the letter.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

The way the rebuilds go, you’re not going to hit on every high pick. Just look at Tampa.

Brett Connolly 6th overall. Slater Koekkoek 10th overall. Not every piece is going to fit and pan out, that’s just how it goes. That’s why it’s important to get as many assets as possible which Gorton has done so far.

It’s all just very fluid. Solid drafts, smart trades, smart signings. They can all be an important part of the plan. It’s not all one or all another.

 

[DanielBrassard]

True, but when was the last time we were Ottawa bad?

The optics with this team are really rough. Theres optimism to be had since it's to be expected and they may land the young elite talent(s) they've lacked for a long time, but its a tough sell when there will be other teams and locations which will be just as attractive and can offer a better chance to win right away.

I said it in another thread, but watch out for Philly here. They have a **** ton of cap space.

As much as I would want Panarin, there's no doubt the Rangers being this bad will have some sort of an effect on their ability to sign UFA's. Maybe it's not enough to cause them to avoid us but there has to be some reservation. If we win the lottery that might change things a bit.

 

[JHS]

I’m all for Panarin, but this is literally only the second season we haven’t been in the playoffs. Or year 1 still since the letter.

I totally get that and I’ll be a fan for however long this rebuild takes. My point is, if the fan base can’t root for getting good players then literally what’s the point. This idea that the Rangers have to be bad for a really long time and have absolutely no talent is just absurd to me. They can get good players, ramp up their NHL roster while still developing some of these current “NHL” level players where they belong— not in the NHL. That’s the way rebuilds are done. Being awful for years is the result of rebuilds going wrong and rushing players to the NHL!