Player Discussion Quinn Hughes, Pt. VII

[arttk]

Premature. And a big if. But if the Canucks win a cup with this core in the next few seasons, might history look a little more kindly back at Jim Benning's team building?

Drafted (no picks higher than 5OA):
Demko
Boeser
Pettersson
Hughes
Hoglander

Traded for:
Miller

No

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

We’ve never even had a defender finish top-5 in Norris voting.

Jovanovski was 6th twice. Ehrhoff was 8th.

i believe hughes’ 9th place finish last year is fourth, behind those two jovo seasons and hoff

it really is unbelievable to have a franchise d and get to watch him game in game out

 

[CloutierForVezina]

This is the exact kind of start Quinn needed to have to generate buzz around the league and get a positive narrative going to make a serious run for a Norris. The problem is last year he (and the Canucks) had a slow start and he quietly put up points and all the voters ignored him for players who had much more explosive starts.

Still a ton of hockey left to be played, but he has looked incredible so far this year and is finally turning heads. Some voters might even stay up late enough to catch the first period for a few games this year.

 

[Svencouver]

Premature. And a big if. But if the Canucks win a cup with this core in the next few seasons, might history look a little more kindly back at Jim Benning's team building?

Drafted (no picks higher than 5OA):
Demko
Boeser
Pettersson
Hughes
Hoglander

Traded for:
Miller

The Canucks will have a very interesting drafting and development record over the Benning years, to say the least. Pettersson and Hughes weren't obvious picks, and I give them full credit for making them. Hughes maybe moreso; although fans deliberated somewhat between Dobson and Bouchard, it seemed like the league's scouts and brass had Hughes higher on the board in general and it was a bit of fortune that we got him where we did. But the drafting and development past the first round was absolutely abysmal. There were some smart guys in that scouting room, but it was balanced out by a whole lot of idiocy and utterly impotent CHL/OHL drafting. Utica was also a drip-feed of failure from the top-down and there's no coincidence that Abbotsford has exploded with organizational competence and developmental success since new management took over. The Cull years especially were horrific to watch.

 

[VanJack]

Through 10 games, Quinn Hughes has been the best d-man in the NHL--and it's not really close.

Like a lot of great players, they keep slavishly working on their games even after earning the big money, and Hughes is no exception. I'm betting that he practiced his shot with thousands of pucks over the summer--and you can see the results.

His shot was previously the only 'hole' in his game.....now it's a game changer. Checkers on the PK can no longer collapse down low and just let Hughes shoot. He can now handcuff a goalie from distance.

If he stays healthy, could he hit 100 points? What a player!

 

[EpochLink]

https://x.com/NHLPA/status/1720472520158015973?s=20

Straight out of Granville

 

[Canucks LB]

I saw him in Abbotsford for a game versus the flames in his draft year, I remember seeing him skate, and I said still to that day, this kid is going to be special.

I have videos and pictures from the event.

or was it the Langley event center, I think it was the Langley event centre

 

[Luck 6]

About the same for me. It’s a coin flip between Miller and Pettersson. They kind of alternate between games.

Pettersson, 2nd in the league in scoring, 19 pts in 10 games…. 4th best player on the Canucks! What a good problem to have haha.

 

[canuckking1]

Hughes has been the best player in the league this season and deserves to be a Hart frontrunner at this point. However, defensemen just don't win the Hart trophy. The player who wins the Art Ross wins the Hart 90% of the time, with the other 10% being the player who won the Rocket and is close enough in points

 

[potatowejj]

Premature. And a big if. But if the Canucks win a cup with this core in the next few seasons, might history look a little more kindly back at Jim Benning's team building?

Drafted (no picks higher than 5OA):
Demko
Boeser
Pettersson
Hughes
Hoglander

Traded for:
Miller

lol

He also handicapped the team with a seemingly never-ending string of some of the worst contracts in the league so...

The cap situation for this team should not be what it is.

 

[ForecheckBackcheck]

The Canucks will have a very interesting drafting and development record over the Benning years, to say the least. Pettersson and Hughes weren't obvious picks, and I give them full credit for making them. Hughes maybe moreso; although fans deliberated somewhat between Dobson and Bouchard, it seemed like the league's scouts and brass had Hughes higher on the board in general and it was a bit of fortune that we got him where we did. But the drafting and development past the first round was absolutely abysmal. There were some smart guys in that scouting room, but it was balanced out by a whole lot of idiocy and utterly impotent CHL/OHL drafting. Utica was also a drip-feed of failure from the top-down and there's no coincidence that Abbotsford has exploded with organizational competence and developmental success since new management took over. The Cull years especially were horrific to watch.

Yea, some huge hits. And then equally huge misses and dumb decisions.

 

[Ribbit]

Benning was not incapable of making some good moves but he saddled this team with so many bad contracts over the years. Then right before he finally runs out of leash he trades for possibly the worst contract in the league so he could get rid of 3 bad contracts that were going to expire in a year anyways. We have a 2.3m cap penalty next year and 4.7m for two years after (then 2.1m for 2 more) because of Benning. Aqua deserves a ton of blame as well for hiring the guy and giving him a leash at least 3 years too long.

He absolutely was the worst GM I've seen for the Canucks (watching since 2005) and while he's had some positive moves, all I can really see is the really bad one still handcuffing us today.

Anyways, Quinn Hughes is incredible and it's insane we were able to get this guy at 7th overall. Here's hoping Calgary keeps imploding and we can grab Tanev off them. Obviously Hughes-Hronek is an insane pair, but Tanev opens up options to split them up if we needed to for whatever reason.

 

[mdobbs]

Premature. And a big if. But if the Canucks win a cup with this core in the next few seasons, might history look a little more kindly back at Jim Benning's team building?

Drafted (no picks higher than 5OA):
Demko
Boeser
Pettersson
Hughes
Hoglander

Traded for:
Miller

Benning never had issues drafting, definitely had some good picks

It was the pro scouting and cap management that was absolutely atrocious

 

[petterdaddy]

Benning was not incapable of making some good moves but he saddled this team with so many bad contracts over the years. Then right before he finally runs out of leash he trades for possibly the worst contract in the league so he could get rid of 3 bad contracts that were going to expire in a year anyways. We have a 2.3m cap penalty next year and 4.7m for two years after (then 2.1m for 2 more) because of Benning. Aqua deserves a ton of blame as well for hiring the guy and giving him a leash at least 3 years too long.

He absolutely was the worst GM I've seen for the Canucks (watching since 2005) and while he's had some positive moves, all I can really see is the really bad one still handcuffing us today.

Anyways, Quinn Hughes is incredible and it's insane we were able to get this guy at 7th overall. Here's hoping Calgary keeps imploding and we can grab Tanev off them. Obviously Hughes-Hronek is an insane pair, but Tanev opens up options to split them up if we needed to for whatever reason.

 

[LuckyDay]

 

[WTG]

Premature. And a big if. But if the Canucks win a cup with this core in the next few seasons, might history look a little more kindly back at Jim Benning's team building?

Drafted (no picks higher than 5OA):
Demko
Boeser
Pettersson
Hughes
Hoglander

Traded for:
Miller

Giving credit to Benning for drafting does a disservice to the back room staff who spent all season actually doing the hard work scouting. I don’t give Benning much credit for amateur scouting.

 

[geebster]

Giving credit to Benning for drafting does a disservice to the back room staff who spent all season actually doing the hard work scouting. I don’t give Benning much credit for amateur scouting.

I mean then no GM can take credit for drafting then and no CEO can take credit for almost any work done by their company. Actual work is always done by people further down.

Ultimately if the people hired by someone do a good job the person in charge deserves some credit for delegating to the right people. That back room staff worked for Benning. I still think he was a horrible GM that did far more damage than good for us. If you list only the good things it seems great but you can do that with any GM.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

I mean then no GM can take credit for drafting then

As they shouldnt.

and no CEO can take credit for almost any work done by their company. Actual work is always done by people further down.

Hiring and listening people smarter than you.

Thats leadership.

The opposite happened under Benning.

Ultimately if the people hired by someone do a good job the person in charge deserves some credit for delegating to the right people. That back room staff worked for Benning. I still think he was a horrible GM that did far more damage than good for us. If you list only the good things it seems great but you can do that with any GM.

He got rid of the guy in charge of drafting EP40 and Quinn Hughes.

 

[WTG]

I mean then no GM can take credit for drafting then and no CEO can take credit for almost any work done by their company. Actual work is always done by people further down.

Ultimately if the people hired by someone do a good job the person in charge deserves some credit for delegating to the right people. That back room staff worked for Benning. I still think he was a horrible GM that did far more damage than good for us. If you list only the good things it seems great but you can do that with any GM.

I do believe that GMs don't deserve that much credit for drafting. Also, CEO's and GMs have a lot in common, and they are there to lead the direction of the team. But they are powerless if the staff below them is incapable of making those changes. Gillis before he got canned turned over the scouting department before he left.

A leader is only as strong as their supporting staff around them. Benning inherited a good scouting department under him. But whenever he forgoed that scouting staff (ie. Juolevi and Virtanen), he made the wrong choices.

Also, if Benning was such a strong scouter, he would have taken his knowledge of the Bruins whom he left 3 months prior to the draft, and drafted Pastrnak over McCann in his first draft here.

 

[LemonSauceD]

Being snubbed from higher Norris votings
Being told he’s too small
Being told he can’t defend
Tired of losing

This is a man determined to prove all his doubters wrong. He’s out there demanding his piece of the cake as well as his respect.

The kid just turned 24. He’s got another level to him. He’s been the best defenseman in the league the last 40-50 games.

 

[geebster]

I do believe that GMs don't deserve that much credit for drafting. Also, CEO's and GMs have a lot in common, and they are there to lead the direction of the team. But they are powerless if the staff below them is incapable of making those changes. Gillis before he got canned turned over the scouting department before he left.

A leader is only as strong as their supporting staff around them. Benning inherited a good scouting department under him. But whenever he forgoed that scouting staff (ie. Juolevi and Virtanen), he made the wrong choices.

Also, if Benning was such a strong scouter, he would have taken his knowledge of the Bruins whom he left 3 months prior to the draft, and drafted Pastrnak over McCann in his first draft here.

I think Benning sucked, and I hated him a lot while he was here, but I just feel its a weird attitude that you see with a lot of Americans with politics where every good thing that happened cant have anything to do with him even if he had final say on it, and every bad thing is 100% because of him no matter what.

To some degree if managers deserve any blame for bad things people under them do they should also get some credit the other way. Inheriting a good staff and keeping them and going with their suggestions is a plus in his column, if that isnt attributed to him then he cannot be blamed for not keeping good guys right? You cant blame a guy for firing a good person but then not give them credit for keeping that person for years and having good drafting outcomes with them.

As with everything people just want to believe someone is wholly bad or evil and nothing good can be possibly said about them. Thats just now how the real world works theres more nuance than that. I think the guy was in over his head and brutally screwed our team over with his signings, but all in all the drafting record was good while he was here. Shouldve never held the job as long as he did.

This is all super off topic though, as for Hughes Im glad we are seeing articles and videos about him by eastern media now, but I am still bitter about how underrated he has been and will forever blame Seth Jones for it.

He got rid of the guy in charge of drafting EP40 and Quinn Hughes.

So he should take blame for not keeping Brackett but should get credit for allowing the work Brackett did under him (i.e. drafting EP and Quinn) while he was here right? Why does he get blame for not keeping good people but gets no credit for the years he did keep them and had good outcomes?

 

[WTG]

I think Benning sucked, and I hated him a lot while he was here, but I just feel its a weird attitude that you see with a lot of Americans with politics where every good thing that happened cant have anything to do with him even if he had final say on it, and every bad thing is 100% because of him no matter what.

To some degree if managers deserve any blame for bad things people under them do they should also get some credit the other way. Inheriting a good staff and keeping them and going with their suggestions is a plus in his column, if that isnt attributed to him then he cannot be blamed for not keeping good guys right? You cant blame a guy for firing a good person but then not give them credit for keeping that person for years and having good drafting outcomes with them.

As with everything people just want to believe someone is wholly bad or evil and nothing good can be possibly said about them. Thats just now how the real world works theres more nuance than that. I think the guy was in over his head and brutally screwed our team over with his signings, but all in all the drafting record was good while he was here. Shouldve never held the job as long as he did.

This is all super off topic though, as for Hughes Im glad we are seeing articles and videos about him by eastern media now, but I am still bitter about how underrated he has been and will forever blame Seth Jones for it.


So he should take blame for not keeping Brackett but should get credit for allowing the work Brackett did under him (i.e. drafting EP and Quinn) while he was here right? Why does he get blame for not keeping good people but gets no credit for the years he did keep them and had good outcomes?

I completely understand your case, and I'll be clear, I do not share this American mentality of "everything someone does is bad", but just like the previous administration, a f***ton of shit that Benning did was bad/terrible.

Benning WANTED Virtanen, Benning DID compare Juolevi with f***ing Lindros. Those are things that he did. Here is a quote from a Bruins exec that basically confirmed it was Benning who chose McCann over Pastrnak.

How Bruins landed David Pastrnak with 25th pick in NHL Draft

The Bruins believed David Pastrnak could be truly great. And on draft night, they thought they had no shot at him.

theathletic.com

Keith Gretzky was excited and scared. It was June 27, 2014, and the Bruins’ former director of amateur scouting saw a prize ready to be plucked.

But there was a problem.

The Bruins, owners of the 25th pick, were waiting on one club at No. 24. It was Vancouver.

A month earlier, the Canucks had hired Jim Benning as general manager. Benning was formerly the Bruins’ assistant GM.

Benning, an eight-year Bruins employee, helped write their playbook for the 2014 draft. Not only did Benning know every player his former employer preferred, he shared many of their team-building philosophies.

The Bruins adjusted their list following Benning’s exit. This didn’t guarantee, however, that Benning wouldn’t one-up his former employer.

Gretzky’s nerves were somewhat calmed by the 2013-14 viewings he conducted alongside Benning. His ex-colleague had a thing for Jared McCann, the hard-nosed left-shot center who had scored 62 points in 64 games for Sault Ste. Marie of the OHL.

“Every time I would take Jim to a game, he scored a couple goals,” Gretzky said. “I knew he liked him. How much say he had in it, I don’t know.”

Sure enough, the Canucks drafted McCann at No. 24. Gretzky and his coworkers tried to stay composed. But the energy at the Bruins’ table at Philadelphia’s Wells Fargo Center crackled.

The Bruins were about to draft David Pastrnak.

Bruins almost threw a party because Benning f***ed up. But saying that, Benning did promote Brackett, which was a plus. But f*** me, he had such a glorious opportunity to change the franchise and he f***ing blew it.

 

[Chairman Maouth]

I think Benning sucked, and I hated him a lot while he was here, but I just feel its a weird attitude that you see with a lot of Americans with politics where every good thing that happened cant have anything to do with him even if he had final say on it, and every bad thing is 100% because of him no matter what.

To some degree if managers deserve any blame for bad things people under them do they should also get some credit the other way. Inheriting a good staff and keeping them and going with their suggestions is a plus in his column, if that isnt attributed to him then he cannot be blamed for not keeping good guys right? You cant blame a guy for firing a good person but then not give them credit for keeping that person for years and having good drafting outcomes with them.

As with everything people just want to believe someone is wholly bad or evil and nothing good can be possibly said about them. Thats just now how the real world works theres more nuance than that. I think the guy was in over his head and brutally screwed our team over with his signings, but all in all the drafting record was good while he was here. Shouldve never held the job as long as he did.

This is all super off topic though, as for Hughes Im glad we are seeing articles and videos about him by eastern media now, but I am still bitter about how underrated he has been and will forever blame Seth Jones for it.


So he should take blame for not keeping Brackett but should get credit for allowing the work Brackett did under him (i.e. drafting EP and Quinn) while he was here right? Why does he get blame for not keeping good people but gets no credit for the years he did keep them and had good outcomes?

I agree.

No doubt about it, Benning messed things up here big time, but I've also recently been tempted to give Benning credit for a considerable part of our current success - acquiring Petey and Hughie - if for no other reason than to hear more heads popping than if a chimpanzee got hold of some bubble wrap.

 

[Canucker]

I agree.

No doubt about it, Benning messed things up here big time, but I've also recently been tempted to give Benning credit for a considerable part of our current success - acquiring Petey and Hughie - if for no other reason than to hear more heads popping than if a chimpanzee got hold of some bubble wrap.

"Even a blind squirrel finds a nut on occasion". Sure, he drafted them so he can get the credit for that, but as with everything it requires proper context. When you draft in the top 10 because you've got a crap team, you should be able to pick some high end talent along the way.

Not really understanding why you would take up the mantle for an epically failed GM just to troll people though. Doesn't seem productive.

 

[Chairman Maouth]

"Even a blind squirrel finds a nut on occasion". Sure, he drafted them so he can get the credit for that, but as with everything it requires proper context. When you draft in the top 10 because you've got a crap team, you should be able to pick some high end talent along the way.

Not really understanding why you would take up the mantle for an epically failed GM just to troll people though. Doesn't seem productive.

That blind squirrel found two consecutive nuts when those around him who could see found none.

Not many teams are capable of picking that kind of high-end talent. Very few, in fact. In the case of draft picks below the number one pick, which they both were (5 &7), very few teams pick talent the likes of Petey and Hughes, and do it two drafts in a row. Look at the players before and after them. Your theory is flawed.

I was labeled a Benning sympathizer long ago, not because I was. I wasn't in fact. I was labeled a Benning sympathizer because, like Tyler Myers, I believed that not everything Benning did was bad, and I was capable of separating the good from the bad. Now, and in retrospect, and after all the hate Benning received here, really vicious stuff, I find the fact amusing that Benning was responsible for drafting two NHL superstars who are currently tearing up the league.

Benning was not evil. He was just a guy trying his best to do a job, a job he ultimately failed at. But it wasn't all failure. Benning's legacy is with us this season.