Post-Game Talk: Providence Bruins (4) vs Syracuse Crunch (1) - Syracuse wins series 4-1

[GloryDaze4877]

I am no hockey expert by any means, but the few times I saw him in providence I definitely haven't been impressed. I hope he proves me wrong but I am more excited about Debrusk in Boston next year than Heinen. I'd still be fine trading high on Heinen right now this summer

I have seen Heinen over the last 3 years probably 25 times (most have been on TV). I liked him right from the start, so I guess I may be biased. He's not a player that has a huge WOW factor, but he's almost always in the right spots, making the right plays. His vision (in college at least) was unbelievable and his playmaking excellent. He's not overly physical, but also not afraid to play in the corners or in front of the net. He can play any F position, and he is at good on the PP, and the PK.

The way he was utilized by Montgomery (even as a freshman) tells me this kid is a coaches dream. Had him out against top competition when he was down a goal or up a goal in the last minute, which cannot be said for many higher profile prospects he played against. The guy he reminds me of the most is Loui Eriksson (Heinen is a little better skater and passer, Loui better shooter), but I hate to say it on this board because of the great dislike most seem to have for him.

Suffice to say, I would NOT be ok with "trading high" on him this summer, unless it was a no brainer deal. In a Cap l league, the best way to stay relevant over a long period of time is to draft and develop your own cheap talent.

 

[Estlin]

I have seen Heinen over the last 3 years probably 25 times (most have been on TV). I liked him right from the start, so I guess I may be biased. He's not a player that has a huge WOW factor, but he's almost always in the right spots, making the right plays. His vision (in college at least) was unbelievable and his playmaking excellent. He's not overly physical, but also not afraid to play in the corners or in front of the net. He can play any F position, and he is at good on the PP, and the PK.

The way he was utilized by Montgomery (even as a freshman) tells me this kid is a coaches dream. Had him out against top competition when he was down a goal or up a goal in the last minute, which cannot be said for many higher profile prospects he played against. The guy he reminds me of the most is Loui Eriksson (Heinen is a little better skater and passer, Loui better shooter), but I hate to say it on this board because of the great dislike most seem to have for him.

Suffice to say, I would NOT be ok with "trading high" on him this summer, unless it was a no brainer deal. In a Cap l league, the best way to stay relevant over a long period of time is to draft and develop your own cheap talent.

You shouldn't have to feel bad for saying that. If Heinen turns out to be a player like Eriksson, then the Bruins—and this fan—will be thrilled. A smart, two-way player who can put up good numbers? What's not to like? Oh, right: he doesn't fight.

At this point, I don't see how Heinen doesn't make the team out of camp next season. He and Debrusk, whom I also expect to make it, will be welcome additions.

 

[BruinsHockey]

Little early to say he's not Brandon Bocheski or Chris Bourque.

That said I really hope he has a productive career in Boston. We could really use some Bergerons/Marchand/Krecjis to come outta no where and become really good NHL quality players.

Bocenski is a bad word here, for Kris Versteeg. what an awful trade.

 

[Fenian24]

You shouldn't have to feel bad for saying that. If Heinen turns out to be a player like Eriksson, then the Bruins—and this fan—will be thrilled. A smart, two-way player who can put up good numbers? What's not to like? Oh, right: he doesn't fight.

At this point, I don't see how Heinen doesn't make the team out of camp next season. He and Debrusk, whom I also expect to make it, will be welcome additions.

Regarding Loui he also doesn't hit, play hard or really seem to care. He was washed up when Boston acquired him, had one good year so he could fool a team into giving him another contract, and will be a even more of a non factor for the remainder of his career. Regardless of how I feel about Heinen I hope I never have any reason to compare him to Loui. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

 

[Beesfan]

Regarding Loui he also doesn't hit, play hard or really seem to care. He was washed up when Boston acquired him, had one good year so he could fool a team into giving him another contract, and will be a even more of a non factor for the remainder of his career. Regardless of how I feel about Heinen I hope I never have any reason to compare him to Loui. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

Oh wow. Loui was a good player all 3 years in Boston, and a great player the final year. He is terrible now, and we were right not to re-sign him, but that doesn't change the fact that he was been one of the best wingers in the game for the last 10 years.

If Heinen turns into Loui I would be estatic.

 

[Estlin]

Regarding Loui he also doesn't hit, play hard or really seem to care. He was washed up when Boston acquired him, had one good year so he could fool a team into giving him another contract, and will be a even more of a non factor for the remainder of his career. Regardless of how I feel about Heinen I hope I never have any reason to compare him to Loui. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

You have an agenda when it comes to specific types of players (pugilists good, "soft" players bad) and have long had it in for Eriksson. With regard to him, you are deliberately misrepresenting his playing style in order to confirm your bias. While Eriksson may not have been a hitter, he sure took a lot of abuse—more than anyone else on the team—in front of the net. Moreover, he was hardly washed up when Boston acquired him. (By the way, you appear to be conveniently forgetting the two concussions that he sustained in his first season with the Bruins.) A thirty-goal campaign in his final year in Boston is hardly washed up. Even though he sucked in Vancouver last season, I believe that, had he remained in Boston and continued to play with Krejci, he would have scored 25 or so with him.

Comparing a player (like Heinen) to Eriksson is a compliment.

 

[PB37]

You have an agenda when it comes to specific types of players (pugilists good, "soft" players bad) and have long had it in for Eriksson. With regard to him, you are deliberately misrepresenting his playing style in order to confirm your bias. While Eriksson may not have been a hitter, he sure took a lot of abuse—more than anyone else on the team—in front of the net. Moreover, he was hardly washed up when Boston acquired him. (By the way, you appear to be conveniently forgetting the two concussions that he sustained in his first season with the Bruins.) A thirty-goal campaign in his final year in Boston is hardly washed up. Even though he sucked in Vancouver last season, I believe that, had he remained in Boston and continued to play with Krejci, he would have scored 25 or so with him.

Comparing a player (like Heinen) to Eriksson is a compliment.

Exactly. Well said.

 

[Fenian24]

You have an agenda when it comes to specific types of players (pugilists good, "soft" players bad) and have long had it in for Eriksson. With regard to him, you are deliberately misrepresenting his playing style in order to confirm your bias. While Eriksson may not have been a hitter, he sure took a lot of abuse—more than anyone else on the team—in front of the net. Moreover, he was hardly washed up when Boston acquired him. (By the way, you appear to be conveniently forgetting the two concussions that he sustained in his first season with the Bruins.) A thirty-goal campaign in his final year in Boston is hardly washed up. Even though he sucked in Vancouver last season, I believe that, had he remained in Boston and continued to play with Krejci, he would have scored 25 or so with him.

Comparing a player (like Heinen) to Eriksson is a compliment.

I have had it in for Loui, and it wasn't like I was a huge Seguin fan or held that deal against him. I just could not stand his style of play, he was, is and forever will be boring. We disagree on the abuse he took in front. The concussions weren't forgotten, if people can rip McQuaid for being injured all the time Loui should not have been excused from his injury status while discussing his performance either.

I do love fighters but I don't expect to succeed, or believe it or not, would wish to with 18 guys who are all fighters. However I do expect you to compete and play hard. This is why I am disappointed in Spooner and why I disliked Loui. Just my opinion but Loui was the classic example of a "just a guy" type player in Boston for most of his time here.

Maybe it was watching the older Bruins teams with guys like Orr, O'Reilly, Bourque, Neely, Oates, etc. Stars who worked as hard as anybody on the team and didn't just count on talent to succeed. Reason I like Messier more than Gretzky and Howe more than Lemieux. Being willing to work and compete, hit and go to the dirty areas to win matters to me more than being a good skill player.

I hope Danton Heinen becomes a 60 plus point producing top six forward, would open up tons of options for the Bruins if he did. We will see what becomes of him. I don't root against players because I may not like their playing style (I have only seen a handful of Heinen's NHL games but wasn't impressed, small sample size so hopefully he reaches his potential) but if they can help the team win I am all for having them here. I just don't want Ryan Spooner, Frank Vatrano type of players in the bottom six, I want grit, toughness, some skating and scoring ability and solid defensive play. If Heinen can produce those thing, great, if not decisions will have to be made by Sweeney regarding what to do with him.

 

[Silva]

I have seen Heinen over the last 3 years probably 25 times (most have been on TV). I liked him right from the start, so I guess I may be biased. He's not a player that has a huge WOW factor, but he's almost always in the right spots, making the right plays. His vision (in college at least) was unbelievable and his playmaking excellent. He's not overly physical, but also not afraid to play in the corners or in front of the net. He can play any F position, and he is at good on the PP, and the PK.

The way he was utilized by Montgomery (even as a freshman) tells me this kid is a coaches dream. Had him out against top competition when he was down a goal or up a goal in the last minute, which cannot be said for many higher profile prospects he played against. The guy he reminds me of the most is Loui Eriksson (Heinen is a little better skater and passer, Loui better shooter), but I hate to say it on this board because of the great dislike most seem to have for him.

Suffice to say, I would NOT be ok with "trading high" on him this summer, unless it was a no brainer deal. In a Cap l league, the best way to stay relevant over a long period of time is to draft and develop your own cheap talent.

You've seen him a lot more than me. I hope it translates to the NHL! Boston definitely needs some help up front

 

[BruinsHockey]

Officials for Game 4 @Syracuse

Referee: Tom Chmielewski*(43) and Peter MacDougall*(45)

Linesman: Ryan Daisy*(81) and Francois Dussureault(60)

 

[Fonzerelli]

Amazing how folks see game differently

Confirmation bias and other challenges of eyeball scouting. The reason paid scouts failed 80% of the time before the advent of analytics.

 

[Fonzerelli]

what's the prognosis on his return?

 

[Fonzerelli]

I have had it in for Loui, and it wasn't like I was a huge Seguin fan or held that deal against him. I just could not stand his style of play, he was, is and forever will be boring. We disagree on the abuse he took in front. The concussions weren't forgotten, if people can rip McQuaid for being injured all the time Loui should not have been excused from his injury status while discussing his performance either.

I do love fighters but I don't expect to succeed, or believe it or not, would wish to with 18 guys who are all fighters. However I do expect you to compete and play hard. This is why I am disappointed in Spooner and why I disliked Loui. Just my opinion but Loui was the classic example of a "just a guy" type player in Boston for most of his time here.

Maybe it was watching the older Bruins teams with guys like Orr, O'Reilly, Bourque, Neely, Oates, etc. Stars who worked as hard as anybody on the team and didn't just count on talent to succeed. Reason I like Messier more than Gretzky and Howe more than Lemieux. Being willing to work and compete, hit and go to the dirty areas to win matters to me more than being a good skill player.

I hope Danton Heinen becomes a 60 plus point producing top six forward, would open up tons of options for the Bruins if he did. We will see what becomes of him. I don't root against players because I may not like their playing style (I have only seen a handful of Heinen's NHL games but wasn't impressed, small sample size so hopefully he reaches his potential) but if they can help the team win I am all for having them here. I just don't want Ryan Spooner, Frank Vatrano type of players in the bottom six, I want grit, toughness, some skating and scoring ability and solid defensive play. If Heinen can produce those thing, great, if not decisions will have to be made by Sweeney regarding what to do with him.

Excellent post! Agree whole heartedly

 

[GloryDaze4877]

Confirmation bias and other challenges of eyeball scouting. The reason paid scouts failed 80% of the time before the advent of analytics.

Link? How often do they fail after the advent of analytics (can you spell analytics w/4 letters )??

I don't hate analytics, but like anything else, think it should be used in conjunction with other tools. Far too often, I don't think that's the case.

 

[DKH]

Confirmation bias and other challenges of eyeball scouting. The reason paid scouts failed 80% of the time before the advent of analytics.

Ha ha not buying but nice try

 

[LouJersey]

Confirmation bias and other challenges of eyeball scouting. The reason paid scouts failed 80% of the time before the advent of analytics.

Success rates are up more now because of the ease of watching prospects now.

 

[TheBigBadB]

Link? How often do they fail after the advent of analytics (can you spell analytics w/4 letters )??

I don't hate analytics, but like anything else, think it should be used in conjunction with other tools. Far too often, I don't think that's the case.

It truly is all a crapshoot, maybe some scouts luck out better than others, but how a player reacts in the NHL really is dependent on the ability for the player to adapt to playing a fast game both physically and mentally against the best in the world. Other than generational talent obviously

 

[GloryDaze4877]

It truly is all a crapshoot, maybe some scouts luck out better than others, but how a player reacts in the NHL really is dependent on the ability for the player to adapt to playing a fast game both physically and mentally against the best in the world. Other than generational talent obviously

Yup.

Analytics or not, it's incredibly difficult to look at the vast majority of kids ages 14-17 and try to project what they will be after getting shaped by HS, college, juniors, and pro leagues. If it was easy to do it well, everyone would be doing it.

 

[GarbageGoal]

 

[Mainehockey33]

I wonder if they'll start Subban, he played well last game.

 

[ashnathan]

I have seen Heinen over the last 3 years probably 25 times (most have been on TV). I liked him right from the start, so I guess I may be biased. He's not a player that has a huge WOW factor, but he's almost always in the right spots, making the right plays. His vision (in college at least) was unbelievable and his playmaking excellent. He's not overly physical, but also not afraid to play in the corners or in front of the net. He can play any F position, and he is at good on the PP, and the PK.

The way he was utilized by Montgomery (even as a freshman) tells me this kid is a coaches dream. Had him out against top competition when he was down a goal or up a goal in the last minute, which cannot be said for many higher profile prospects he played against. The guy he reminds me of the most is Loui Eriksson (Heinen is a little better skater and passer, Loui better shooter), but I hate to say it on this board because of the great dislike most seem to have for him.

Suffice to say, I would NOT be ok with "trading high" on him this summer, unless it was a no brainer deal. In a Cap l league, the best way to stay relevant over a long period of time is to draft and develop your own cheap talent.

I like Heinen, but am i the only one who thinks Loui is better at passing than he is at shooting? He doesnt really snipe any goals (doesnt anymore anyway) maybe it was just his time in Boston but I could probably count his snipes on one hand I do miss the bloke though!

 

[PacificNWBruin]

I have had it in for Loui, and it wasn't like I was a huge Seguin fan or held that deal against him. I just could not stand his style of play, he was, is and forever will be boring. We disagree on the abuse he took in front. The concussions weren't forgotten, if people can rip McQuaid for being injured all the time Loui should not have been excused from his injury status while discussing his performance either.

I do love fighters but I don't expect to succeed, or believe it or not, would wish to with 18 guys who are all fighters. However I do expect you to compete and play hard. This is why I am disappointed in Spooner and why I disliked Loui. Just my opinion but Loui was the classic example of a "just a guy" type player in Boston for most of his time here.

Maybe it was watching the older Bruins teams with guys like Orr, O'Reilly, Bourque, Neely, Oates, etc. Stars who worked as hard as anybody on the team and didn't just count on talent to succeed. Reason I like Messier more than Gretzky and Howe more than Lemieux. Being willing to work and compete, hit and go to the dirty areas to win matters to me more than being a good skill player.

I hope Danton Heinen becomes a 60 plus point producing top six forward, would open up tons of options for the Bruins if he did. We will see what becomes of him. I don't root against players because I may not like their playing style (I have only seen a handful of Heinen's NHL games but wasn't impressed, small sample size so hopefully he reaches his potential) but if they can help the team win I am all for having them here. I just don't want Ryan Spooner, Frank Vatrano type of players in the bottom six, I want grit, toughness, some skating and scoring ability and solid defensive play. If Heinen can produce those thing, great, if not decisions will have to be made by Sweeney regarding what to do with him.

During his time here Loui was one of the hardest working forwards behind Bergy and Marchand. He won more board battles and was more of a threat in front of the net then Backes. He was also very versatile, played on multiple different lines and produced. During the 14/15 season it seemed like he was on a different line every week. He could actually hold onto the puck and also was great defensively. He was a cerebral two-player that didn't hit. He wasn't soft, he just didn't hit. Most here have blind spots for hitting/size. I liked Loui for what he was. The team just lost a lot of physicality, swagger during his time here. Heinen is very similar, so you probably won't like him. But if he can have a career like Loui's I won't complain, that's a lot of value from a 4 rounder.

 

[PrisonMike]

any way to watch this ?

 

[GarbageGoal]

2-1 Crunch end of one. Szwarz with the goal. Bruins were hurt by a 5 on 3 that led to a goal at the end of the period.

 

[roflstomper]

4-2 Syracuse now. Just giving up too many goals all series. Simple as that. I think McIntyre is tired.